Dave Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 I don't know that they've moved the goalposts, and neither does anyone on here. We probably never will either so it's kind of pointless arguing about that. Assuming they're operating professionally and like other clubs, they have an asking price of around £7m for a French international player we want and whom openly wants to leave them to join us. We won't meet the asking price, so we'll do without. I'd say that was unreasonable on our part. So close to the end of the transfer window and having already made three bids below their asking price, I can't see how agreeing now is 'throwing our hands up'. We either want him or we don't. We've tried to get him at a cut down price, it patently didn't work. The most logical thing would be to look elsewhere of course but we don't seem to want to do that or we'd have done so before now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NG32 Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 Modric, Woodgate, NZogbia, Gameiro, Gervinho, De Jong, Douglas. That's just the ones off the top of my head. I'd say our miss rate is pretty high. Well N'zogbia was well dodged in the end and so was Woodgate. Modric was a kick in the balls. Gameiro and Gervinho never seemed really likely to join to begin with. DeJong was a bit of a shame and Douglas, no one knows whats happening. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BooBoo Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 There were all high profile players we went for and failed to get "over the line". Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanshithispantz Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 They may have? Lille are a good club though at the end of the day and there's probably only a couple of dozen outfits out there that are a more attractive prospect to the player, and even less that have the money spare AND need a right back. That's why I've never understood the "why has nobody else put in a bid?" line, it suggests that there's hundreds of choices out there which there isn't. Also Lille clearly view him as being worth the price, otherwise they wouldn't be keeping him. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole_Toonfan Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 Modric, Woodgate, NZogbia, Gameiro, Gervinho, De Jong, Douglas. That's just the ones off the top of my head. I'd say our miss rate is pretty high. Tbf the majority of those players have proven that we made the right move in that going overboard for them. I don't want to question the policy as it's proved fruitful so far, but i do believe that sometimes there should be slightly more flexibility like with Debuchy. Lille are asking for a very fair fee IMO and we are just pissing about, i do think if we are to get what we want in the future and the valuations are quite close (i.e. around a million) then we might have to just pay it. We are not going to be able to to get a Cabaye for 4m every single window. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarrenBartonCentrePartin Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 Woodgate just went back to Burra so scratch that one off. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanshithispantz Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 We put good bids in for most (if not all) of those players so the point is pretty much void. They either didn't want to come (Gerv, Modric, Gameiro) or their clubs were after obscene money (De Jong, N'Zogbia). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NG32 Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 There were all high profile players we went for and failed to get "over the line". Was N'Zogbia really worth 9.5 million tho? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tooj Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 I'd still pay that for him now. Would give us options in both 4-4-2 and 4-3-3. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NG32 Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 I'd still pay that for him now. Would give us options in both 4-4-2 and 4-3-3. Could even play him at LB. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole_Toonfan Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 Wouldn't pay 5m for N'Zogbia far too lazy and inconsistent. Would rather trust Marveaux than spend money on N'Zogbia. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ohmelads Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 Two 12th place finishes, relegation (!), promotion and a 5th place and now people are saying we are one of the best run clubs in the country? Aren't we getting ahead of ourselves a bit? Last season was one of my favourite as a toon fan, but it is ridiculous to take the attitude that it is "job done" and we can sit back and watch it all unfold again just like last season. That for me is more arrogant than recognising we need to strengthen just to achieve the same. We tried standing still once and it marked the start of years of decline. Players can smell a lack of ambition and start to look elsewhere. It's not about chasing 4th place. To finish 5th again or even close we have to strengthen. It is complacent to think the same players will do it all again and play an extra 10 games or whatever into the bargain. Wouldn't that be great? Fact is we had to play Cisse and Anita in 40c heat in Greece and then fly them straight to London for another game at Stamford Bridge - that's one week into the season and we've seen the effects it's going to have. Get past Atromitos on Thursday and you're looking at the group stage, which could mean swapping the heat of Greece for freezing winter games in Russia and then trips to place like Stoke only a couple days later. It's going to put pressure on the squad that we didn't see last season. Fatigue, injuries, rotation. Do we have the squad for it? We still have a good starting XI, and if forced to go on it won't be a catastrophe but it's the squad that concerns me at this stage. I predict more injuries this season owing to more midweek games. Beyond our good first XI you are looking at a lot of untested kids and players who have never shown anything in a toon shirt like Obertan, Marveaux and Gosling or mediocre backup like Ameobi and Williamson. We have to hope some of them can step up like Raylor and Perch did last season. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarrenBartonCentrePartin Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 my thoughts overall on the transfer window are that its hasn't felt like a "window" at all. Across the board theres not really been a sense of frantic urgency or any high profile moves that catch you by surprise. The biggest was probably Hazard or van Persie, but they'd been on the cards for a while. From our perspective it just seems like we're happy to stick with what we've got. The whole thing has just passed us by really. The longer it's been going on I've been preparing myself for a statement from the board saying we've replaced who we've released and we've not sold anyone and therefore we, as a club, have had a 'good/productive/stable' period over the summer. While I'm glad not to have lost anyone (touch wood) it does stink of 03/04 a bit. There was the opportunity to kick on. Should we not pull the Debuchy deal out of the bag last minute it will feel like a real kick in the knackers. It's not often you get a good player appearing to be openly willing to join you. Its frustrating that the board are refusing to budge over a couple of million quid, although I do realise there is the possibility that Lille have been moving the goalposts. It will be interesting to see what MA/DL/LC do if when January comes around, we're well behind where we were last season. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NG32 Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 Last season was one of my favourite as a toon fan, but it is ridiculous to take the attitude that it is "job done" and we can sit back and watch it all unfold again just like last season. That for me is more arrogant than recognising we need to strengthen just to achieve the same. We tried standing still once and it marked the start of years of decline. Players can smell a lack of ambition and start to look elsewhere. I dont think anyone is suggesting job done, just trying to understand why they are not willing to push the boat out or spend money for positions that needed upgraded. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
themanupstairs Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 Pretty sure the manager, chief scout and owners aren't sat around twiddling their thumbs while NO readers contemplate suicide this week. I find it impossible to believe that Ashley still doesn't realize the benefit of a strong functioning squad. Most transfers really are very complicated, and we cannot be certain of what has been going on behind the scenes. We all want a competitive squad, we all want to see NUFC win many more matches than we lose. That includes the manager and the owners. I do believe they are on a quest to achieve the best possible finish this season, using last season's relative success as a springboard. Oldtype hit the nail on the head with his post. Not sure if it was in thread or not, but it sums up my view perfectly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dokko Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 Wouldn't pay 5m for N'Zogbia far too lazy and inconsistent. Would rather trust Marveaux than spend money on N'Zogbia. Aye, if Marv could last a few games without getting injured. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 Can only echo ohmelads. Couldn't agree with that more. I'd not be "gutted" but I'd definitely count it as an opportunity missed if we didn't sign anyone else. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BooBoo Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 Two 12th place finishes, relegation (!), promotion and a 5th place and now people are saying we are one of the best run clubs in the country? Aren't we getting ahead of ourselves a bit? Last season was one of my favourite as a toon fan, but it is ridiculous to take the attitude that it is "job done" and we can sit back and watch it all unfold again just like last season. That for me is more arrogant than recognising we need to strengthen just to achieve the same. We tried standing still once and it marked the start of years of decline. Players can smell a lack of ambition and start to look elsewhere. It's not about chasing 4th place. To finish 5th again or even close we have to strengthen. It is complacent to think the same players will do it all again and play an extra 10 games or whatever into the bargain. Wouldn't that be great? Fact is we had to play Cisse and Anita in 40c heat in Greece and then fly them straight to London for another game at Stamford Bridge - that's one week into the season and we've seen the effects it's going to have. Get past Atromitos on Thursday and you're looking at the group stage, which could mean swapping the heat of Greece for freezing winter games in Russia and then trips to place like Stoke only a couple days later. It's going to put pressure on the squad that we didn't see last season. Fatigue, injuries, rotation. Do we have the squad for it? We still have a good starting XI, and if forced to go on it won't be a catastrophe but it's the squad that concerns me at this stage. I predict more injuries this season owing to more midweek games. Beyond our good first XI you are looking at a lot of untested kids and players who have never shown anything in a toon shirt like Obertan, Marveaux and Gosling or mediocre backup like Ameobi and Williamson. We have to hope some of them can step up like Raylor and Perch did last season. Absolutely in a nut shell. Reflects my feelings to a t. To expect the current squad to hit the heights of last season is pretty unfair really, some of them were punching massively above their weight. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leffe186 Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 I think you're quite clearly one of the best-run clubs in the country now, particularly considering where you were three years ago. That doesn't mean you can't spend a little more now. We're seeing exactly the same arguments on Spurs boards, just on a bigger scale. Rather than "why can't we pay the extra mill or so and get things done" it's an extra three or four mill. You're trying to improve on Simpson and Shola, we're trying to replace Modric and Defoe. We're both working on similar margins though, so I think the answer is different. With the extra TV money this year, I think that you need to take the opportunity to pay a little more to pick up two extras. I suspect you don't have enough wiggle room for more. This step-up is not the tough one, the next is a killer, so if Ashley & Co. are unable to loosen the purse strings now then it doesn't bode well. The one thing I would say is that I think our second teams are closer than they have ever been before. That line-up against Atromitos looked pretty good to me. Obviously there's an issue up front, and an injury to Cisse would have been a total disaster. The key advantage you have now over the Luque time is that I would have far more faith in the scouts. It wasn't just Luque, it was silly contracts for people like Xisco, Smith, Owen etc etc. A misstep on one player right now would be less damaging. I mean look at us - we paid silly money for Bent and Bentley, and arguably Keane, and still have Jenas on a pretty big wage. We absorbed all that crap and still did OK because the rest of the squad was strong enough. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 The impression I get looking at your squad as a whole is it's actually quite similar to ours, in the sense of a quality first XI but question marks over squad depth. I don't think your squad is strong enough (nor would ours be, or most squads in the league) to finish 5th again and also go far in Europe. It would take a monumental effort from your players to do that. Also, I would factor in the fact you were a surprise last year. Teams will be more adept this year at recognising your strengths (will be interesting to see if teams attempt a man-marking role with Ben Arfa for example), and also from a mental viewpoint, there will be pressure on the team to perform to a similar standard. On the other hand, you could look at teams like Arsenal, Liverpool and Tottenham and ask, are any of them in a better position than last year? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
duo Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 I am all for prudence but a transfer spend of 3.5 mil is pitiful. We seriously lack cover up front yet I can't see anyone coming through the door. With a 'modest' investment we could have a decent season. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole_Toonfan Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 Top posts both of you, always nice to see the opinions of fans from other clubs As for the Arsenal, Liverpool and Tottenham question..... Arsenal are stronger in a creative sense, but much much weaker in a goalscoring sense so no they are not. Liverpool are stronger IMO, not enough to scare me or anything but stronger none the less.... Allen and Sahin are obvious upgrades on Adam and Henderson, as for Borini i don't know if he's better than Kuyt or Bellamy so they might have got worse there. So it's not a massive improvement but an improvement none the less. As for Tottenham, they are obviously weaker currently but if they go out and get the likes of Lloris in among others then that will all change. It's really of case of taking stock when the deadline closes, as it could all be very different. I'm confident what ever happens we will up there anyway as long as we don't get too many injuries. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BottledDog Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 I am all for prudence but a transfer spend of 3.5 mil is pitiful. We seriously lack cover up front yet I can't see anyone coming through the door. With a 'modest' investment we could have a decent season. We apparently bid £12m or whatever on a striker. The money is there to invest, but it's not simply a case of just going out and spending it. Any deal has to be seen as good value and right for the team and the club, something it is obviously hard for us to judge without knowing the ins and outs. To have a squad even vaguely comparable to Tottenham's or Arsenal's 2 years after relegation is pretty staggering when you think about it. Keep the faith. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ikon Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 If we don't sign any new ones before the window closes then it has been a pathetic window from our part. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haz Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 The window activity hasn't been exactly pathetic but the excuses will be. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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