England

[Si]

I'm baffled how Rooney and Owen are so high in the records though given how many better strikers there's been play for England. Rooney still has a long time to go as well.

Shit qualifiers, goals against nothing nations.

[Yorkie]

Rooney just epitomises everything about the national team since he joined it. You can't argue with his goalscoring record in the same way you can't argue with England's record in qualifiers - Croatia 07 aside. The more relevant fact is that he and they have never delivered when it really mattered. The record will stand and he will have earned it but in the context of perennial underachievement it means virtually nowt.

 

And I do quite like him as a footballer.

[Guest chopey]

I never new Charlton was a tory

[Guest Outlaw Pete]

I'm baffled how Rooney and Owen are so high in the records though given how many better strikers there's been play for England. Rooney still has a long time to go as well.

 

Lots of goals against crap teams

[newsted]

I'm baffled how Rooney and Owen are so high in the records though given how many better strikers there's been play for England. Rooney still has a long time to go as well.

Shit qualifiers, goals against nothing nations.

 

Different eras, man. 22 of Charlton's were scored in friendlies. Not banging the drum for Rooney, but it was a different time. I don't think comparisons can be made. Well done both, iyam.

[Guest Outlaw Pete]

I'm baffled how Rooney and Owen are so high in the records though given how many better strikers there's been play for England. Rooney still has a long time to go as well.

 

look up who they scored against.

 

Bobby Charlton scored far more important goals..but goals are goals

one more and Rooney is the best English goalscorer ever

Well done that troll footballer

[Deuce]

Rooney does get an unfair amount of abuse and I think it has a lot to do with the fact that he's never become the player England fans thought he should be, which is one of the top 5 in the world, on par with Messi and Ronaldo.

 

Lot of mileage in those legs now, but he really has been an excellent footballer over the course of his career.

[brummie]

I never new Charlton was a tory

 

Have heard a few stories about Sir Bobby Charlton, all of which suggest he's a huge cunt, so yes, he probably is a Tory.

[Guest Howaythetoon]

Rooney is a strange one. He has been England's best player for over a decade now and is arguably England's greatest talent since Gazza. While he has never quite lived up to the Euro 2004 Rooney, he has performed in general when called upon so for him to break the record is perhaps fitting given his performances and longevity while playing for his country, especially given how players from other countries can rack up 100+ caps easily.

 

For me, however, he is typical of England in that he has the talent and ability but hasn't quite fulfilled it right at the very top. Ronaldo, a former team-mate who for me is less talented in terms of vision, skill and technique, has superseded Rooney and massively so and that's because of his professionalism, desire to keep improving and him getting away from Man Utd which Rooney should have done along time ago.

 

Rooney has won a s*** load and has had a great career, but I feel the Everton Wayne Rooney was capable of Ronaldo/Messi like levels which Fergie knocked out of him, helped along by his own poor application when it came to his fitness and professionalism. He smokes and doesn't take training too personally either. Compare to Ronaldo...

 

Now I think he's finished, he is on his last legs. Too much football, too much selfless running around for his team and country and his poor application to training and his own body etc.

 

He will go down as England's all-time top goalscorer, but for me he ranks way down the pantheon of great English footballers. KK stands above him for example as does Gazza. Rooney is the perfect face of the PL era England!

 

[Stottie]

The big criticism of Rooney is that he's never done it at the World Cup finals or at the Euros, 2004 aside.

 

I think he'd had done much better if he'd had Beardsley, Hoddle, Waddle, and John Barnes setting him up like Lineker did. There's a big drop from them to Downing, Crouch, Lennon, and all the others Rooney's had to play with.

[ponsaelius]

The big criticism of Rooney is that he's never done it at the World Cup finals or at the Euros, 2004 aside.

 

I think he'd had done much better if he'd had Beardsley, Hoddle, Waddle, and John Barnes setting him up like Lineker did. There's a big drop from them to Downing, Crouch, Lennon, and all the others Rooney's had to play with.

 

Bit ridiculous to pick all the best players Lineker played with and comparing them to some of the shittest Rooney has had to.

 

May as well say Rooney has had Beckham, Lampard, Gerrard whereas Lineker had Steve Hodge, Carlton Palmer and Andy Sinton.

[Ronaldo]

Rooney's so much more than a goalscorer, though. It's not right to compare him to Lineker.

[Guest firetotheworks]

In all seriousness, has Rooney performed at all in tournaments since 2004? I can't imagine a worse showing than his in 2010.

[The College Dropout]

Rooney does get an unfair amount of abuse and I think it has a lot to do with the fact that he's never become the player England fans thought he should be, which is one of the top 5 in the world, on par with Messi and Ronaldo.

 

Lot of mileage in those legs now, but he really has been an excellent footballer over the course of his career.

On par with Messi and Ronaldo? He's not even the best British player of his generation. Messi and Ronaldo are on another planet but you have your Ibra's, Neymar, Suarez, Bale, Robben, Aguero etc. in that bracket below. Wayne isn't even close to that. He's in the bracket below that but has been extremely consistent. That's the problem.

[The College Dropout]

Think Cronaldo has always had more natural skill and technique than Rooney tbf. He's always struck a ball extremely well. Consistent first touch and dribbling skills throughout his career.

 

Wayne's been a consistent and versatile player. He gets slightly under-rated for never reaching a top, top level of form for more than a year. Being versatile has been to his individual detriment.

 

Not a good a #10 as Beardsley but a very good one none the less. Not as good a #9 as Linekar but a very good one none the less. Neither of the other 2 could play both roles however.

[Guest firetotheworks]

 

 

Rooney does get an unfair amount of abuse and I think it has a lot to do with the fact that he's never become the player England fans thought he should be, which is one of the top 5 in the world, on par with Messi and Ronaldo.

 

Lot of mileage in those legs now, but he really has been an excellent footballer over the course of his career.

On par with Messi and Ronaldo? He's not even the best British player of his generation. Messi and Ronaldo are on another planet but you have your Ibra's, Neymar, Suarez, Bale, Robben, Aguero etc. in that bracket below. Wayne isn't even close to that. He's in the bracket below that but has been extremely consistent. That's the problem.

 

I don't think you read that bit of Deuce's post.

 

[The College Dropout]

My point is.. our aim for him wasn't even as high as that. Or at least he hasn't even gotten close. He's never been one of the top 10 players in the world let alone 5. Has he ever been in the bracket just above himself... which is still pretty far from where we thoght he might end up he wouldn't be looked at so negatively. He's a LOOOONG way back.

[mrmojorisin75]

My point is.. our aim for him wasn't even as high as that. Or at least he hasn't even gotten close. He's never been one of the top 10 players in the world let alone 5. Has he ever been in the bracket just above himself... which is still pretty far from where we thoght he might end up he wouldn't be looked at so negatively. He's a LOOOONG way back.

 

at 17 he could have been in that bracket had he developed in the right way, that's surely the point?

[The College Dropout]

Aye but he's not "just" short. He's way short.

[Guest firetotheworks]

My point is.. our aim for him wasn't even as high as that. Or at least he hasn't even gotten close. He's never been one of the top 10 players in the world let alone 5. Has he ever been in the bracket just above himself... which is still pretty far from where we thoght he might end up he wouldn't be looked at so negatively. He's a LOOOONG way back.

Rooney was 16 years old and looked a cut above most players in the league. Messi wasn't on the scene and Ronaldo wasn't at that level at that point. He did look like he could become one of the best players in the world. I think it's revisionism to suggest we didn't, he was an incredible talent for his age.

[Guest firetotheworks]

Aye but he's not "just" short. He's way short.

Who says he's 'just short' now like? Never at any point in the top ten players in the world though? What a load of shit.

 

[The College Dropout]

My point is.. our aim for him wasn't even as high as that. Or at least he hasn't even gotten close. He's never been one of the top 10 players in the world let alone 5. Has he ever been in the bracket just above himself... which is still pretty far from where we thoght he might end up he wouldn't be looked at so negatively. He's a LOOOONG way back.

Rooney was 16 years old and looked a cut above most players in the league. Messi wasn't on the scene and Ronaldo wasn't at that level at that point. He did look like he could become one of the best players in the world. I think it's revisionism to suggest we didn't, he was an incredible talent for his age.

 

Aye but not only did he never develop into a world beater. He ultimately, didn't get anywhere close. That's where the real issue lies. He's not Beardsley let alone Maradona.

[Disco]

In all seriousness, has Rooney performed at all in tournaments since 2004? I can't imagine a worse showing than his in 2010.

 

Two goals in major tournaments since then. He has as many goals as red cards in the World Cup.

[Yorkie]

In all seriousness, has Rooney performed at all in tournaments since 2004? I can't imagine a worse showing than his in 2010.

 

Two goals in major tournaments since then. He has as many goals as red cards in the World Cup.

 

That's the bottom line, really.

[Guest firetotheworks]

My point is.. our aim for him wasn't even as high as that. Or at least he hasn't even gotten close. He's never been one of the top 10 players in the world let alone 5. Has he ever been in the bracket just above himself... which is still pretty far from where we thoght he might end up he wouldn't be looked at so negatively. He's a LOOOONG way back.

Rooney was 16 years old and looked a cut above most players in the league. Messi wasn't on the scene and Ronaldo wasn't at that level at that point. He did look like he could become one of the best players in the world. I think it's revisionism to suggest we didn't, he was an incredible talent for his age.

 

Aye but not only did he never develop into a world beater. He ultimately, didn't get anywhere close. That's where the real issue lies. He's not Beardsley let alone Maradona.

The entire point that Deuce made was that he didn't become what people expected him to be. Exactly what are you arguing with here? Also, loved Beardsley, best NUFC player I've seen and a remarkable talent but he and Rooney are apples and oranges as a comparison. Gazza is the more often used comparison because when Rooney emerged on the scene there were a lot of similarities in their styles.

 

Honestly, I don't even know what you're on about, you're basically agreeing with everyone as if you're arguing your own case.