England

[Kimbo]

35 minutes ago, leffe186 said:

Is Tyrick Mitchell any good? Wasn’t being facetious - he looks good but I’d never heard of him.

 

 

 

 

I’d never heard of him either. I’m so out of touch.

[Super Duper Branko Strupar]

1 hour ago, Shak said:

Haha Leffe can't get a full erection.

 

 

[hakka]

Have to admit, do love a Harry Kane penalty. Bloke doesn't fuck about, hits them hard and clean. Keeper went right way today and was never anywhere near it.

[Disco]

6 hours ago, leffe186 said:

Is Tyrick Mitchell any good? Wasn’t being facetious - he looks good but I’d never heard of him.

 

 

 

Never not been impressed watching him for Palace, didn’t realise he was 22. Bit like a budget Ashley Cole.

[astraguy]

Am i the only person who doesn't rate Southgate? Used to love watching England now i couldn't give a  shit  

 

[hakka]

5 minutes ago, astraguy said:

Am i the only person who doesn't rate Southgate? Used to love watching England now i couldn't give a  shit  

 

 

Tbf, he took me from not giving shit (Remember Iceland 2016?) back to giving a shit since 2018. I guess despite results improving and tournament finishing positions too, he isn't setting us up to be exciting to watch.

[gbandit]

England have mostly been awful to watch in my lifetime (35 years old), especially at major tournaments. I’d say that both the quality of football and of course the results have been significantly better under Southgate. You can make the argument that it’s because we’ve got the best crop of players in years but Southgate deserves huge credit

[PeepShow4life]

1 hour ago, astraguy said:

Am i the only person who doesn't rate Southgate? Used to love watching England now i couldn't give a  shit  

 

Never rated him.

He has benefited hugely from favourable draws and the football we play is awful.

In the previous world cup we should have beat Croatia and I remember most of the goals we scored were set pieces or penalties.

Wasn't impressed at the Euros either, Germany game aside which was very impressive. We had the best squad we've arguably ever had whilst Italy one of the worst they've had in years and still couldn't beat them.

Think he gets a lot of leeway because he seems like a really nice guy and speaks well. Howe is a hundred times better as a manager though. If Southgate gets another club role he will be found out quickly.

[Holloway]

that Croatia game had me gnashing on about Shelvey and Fabian Delph

[astraguy]

22 minutes ago, PeepShow4life said:

Never rated him.

He has benefited hugely from favourable draws and the football we play is awful.

In the previous world cup we should have beat Croatia and I remember most of the goals we scored were set pieces or penalties.

Wasn't impressed at the Euros either, Germany game aside which was very impressive. We had the best squad we've arguably ever had whilst Italy one of the worst they've had in years and still couldn't beat them.

Think he gets a lot of leeway because he seems like a really nice guy and speaks well. Howe is a hundred times better as a manager though. If Southgate gets another club role he will be found out quickly.

This,I've been called a fool for two tournaments for writing off England's chances but i've called everyone bare germany,Had faith in Sven/Fabio  but sadly the players seemed too divided 

[Yorkie]

1 hour ago, astraguy said:

Am i the only person who doesn't rate Southgate? Used to love watching England now i couldn't give a  shit  

 

 

In a nation where tens of millions of people have at least a passing interest in the national team and an opinion on its manager? Yes. You are the only one. 

[The Prophet]

What irritates me about the Southgate debate is like anything else these days, there's no nuance to it at all. You can think Southgate is a limited tactician, whilst acknowledging he's done an absolutely superb job to reach a final and a semi final, whilst uniting team and fanbase for the first time in decades.

[Pilko]

Supposedly 2004-2010 was "golden generation" and yet we shit out and looked absolutely chod at every single tournament (and didn't even qualify in '08). Southgate does have certain limitations but the way he's overhauled the national team setup and got us to a point where we're genuinely competing for trophies is deserving of massive credit IMO. I think it's fair enough to debate that he's maybe negative and I really hate the obsession with Mount that he has, but to say you don't rate him at all despite the results we've had versus years of chronic underachievement (with arguably way better players) is just plain daft.

 

[Ronaldo]

6 minutes ago, Pilko said:

Supposedly 2004-2010 was "golden generation" and yet we shit out and looked absolutely chod at every single tournament (and didn't even qualify in '08). Southgate does have certain limitations but the way he's overhauled the national team setup and got us to a point where we're genuinely competing for trophies is deserving of massive credit IMO. I think it's fair enough to debate that he's maybe negative and I really hate the obsession with Mount that he has, but to say you don't rate him at all despite the results we've had versus years of chronic underachievement (with arguably way better players) is just plain daft.

 

We were good in 2006 to be fair. Just really lacking a striker. 

[STM]

We are sleep walking into a disaster in Qatar because of Gareths "never let me down", policy. Given the club form of Shaw, Maguire, Pickford at times, you can't expect them to continue to ride their luck in tournaments. 

 

Also, I get Mount is good but I don't understand what he offers above others. Surely given the fact you have 3 Man City attacking players, who are tuned into one another, you simply have to play them alongside Saka?

 

Front six of:

 

                              Henderson

         Bellingham

                                            Foden      

   Saka                                  Sterling/Grealish

                            Kane

 

[Joey Linton]

21 minutes ago, STM said:

We are sleep walking into a disaster in Qatar because of Gareths "never let me down", policy. Given the club form of Shaw, Maguire, Pickford at times, you can't expect them to continue to ride their luck in tournaments. 

 

Also, I get Mount is good but I don't understand what he offers above others. Surely given the fact you have 3 Man City attacking players, who are tuned into one another, you simply have to play them alongside Saka?

 

Front six of:

 

                              Henderson

         Bellingham

                                            Foden      

   Saka                                  Sterling/Grealish

                            Kane

Plays Mount ineffectually and totally stifles everything Rice is good at playing him in a strict holding two when he has everyone available. 

 

I think Henderson will be back up come the summer (or winter as it is) too. 

[STM]

1 minute ago, Joey Linton said:

Plays Mount ineffectually and totally stifles everything Rice is good at playing him in a strict holding two when he has everyone available. 

 

I think Henderson will be back up come the summer (or winter as it is) too. 

Forgot about Rice.

[AJ9]

Are we officially starting the cycle of Southgate is shit/boring/clueless now then? 

 

Can we not just save the gnashing of teeth and frustration and accept that he’s not an amazing manager, but he’s the best one we’ve had for a while. He may not win us a World Cup, but we have no right to do that, and newsflash, there are other pretty good teams out there too. 

[St. Maximin]

5 minutes ago, AJ9 said:

Are we officially starting the cycle of Southgate is shit/boring/clueless now then? 

 

Can we not just save the gnashing of teeth and frustration and accept that he’s not an amazing manager, but he’s the best one we’ve had for a while. He may not win us a World Cup, but we have no right to do that, and newsflash, there are other pretty good teams out there too. 

I think you’ve summed him up well there. That doesn’t mean people criticising him think he’s ‘shit/boring/clueless’. They might just think he’s similar to how you’ve described him. 
 

In general I find when managers get criticism people react too much like their critics think the manager is terrible and wants him sacked, when really they are often commenting on their limitations as you might with a player you still like. 
 

I’ve said before I like Southgate and by no means want him sacked soon, but I do question some of his moves. As above the with Mount I always find a funny one - great player without doubt, but when we are blessed with attacking talent not sure what he was offering us on left-wing in the Euros final. 

 

 

Edited March 27, 2022 by St. Maximin

[AJ9]

2 minutes ago, St. Maximin said:

I think you’ve summed him up well there. That doesn’t mean people criticising him think he’s ‘shit/boring/clueless’. They might just think he’s similar to how you’ve described him. 
 

In general I find when managers get criticism people react too much like their critics think the manager is terrible and wants him sacked, when really they are often commenting on their limitations as you might with a player you still like. 
 

I’ve said before I like Southgate and by no means want him sacked soon, but I do question some of his moves. As above the with Mount I always find a funny one - great player without doubt, but when we are blessed with attacking talent not sure what he was offering us on left-wing in the Euros final. 

 

 

 

Fair points. I’m just a bit tired of the debate around him, which seem to be driven a bit by our country’s need to criticise. Seems like an endless stream of “why isn’t x player playing” or “why are we playing three at the back” every time we get to a tournament. He’s gone closer than anyone else in most people’s lifetime, and is a genuinely decent guy too.

[Wullie]

This "the greatest squad England have ever had" nonsense really needs knocking on the head like.

 

The only basis for the claim is in the results that Southgate himself has got out of them, it's certainly not in the personnel or what they have done in their career.

[AJ9]

Just now, Wullie said:

This "the greatest squad England have ever had" nonsense really needs knocking on the head like.

 

The only basis for the claim is in the results that Southgate himself has got out of them, it's certainly not in the personnel or what they have done in their career.

Exactly. They’ve done well because he’s done lots with them as a collective, as opposed to the years of relying on a saviour player to bend football to their will which was what England/the press was all about before.

[Joey Linton]

37 minutes ago, AJ9 said:

Are we officially starting the cycle of Southgate is shit/boring/clueless now then? 

 

Can we not just save the gnashing of teeth and frustration and accept that he’s not an amazing manager, but he’s the best one we’ve had for a while. He may not win us a World Cup, but we have no right to do that, and newsflash, there are other pretty good teams out there too. 

No mate, we're discussing our opinions on where things could potentially improve. That's what football forums are for. Discussion. 

[Kid Icarus]

35 minutes ago, Wullie said:

This "the greatest squad England have ever had" nonsense really needs knocking on the head like.

 

The only basis for the claim is in the results that Southgate himself has got out of them, it's certainly not in the personnel or what they have done in their career.

 

It's utterly bizzare. I'd understand it if we'd had the players below 50 years ago, but it was literally the consistent generation before this one. The likes of Michael Carrick, Jermaine Defoe, Ledley King, and Jonathan Woodgate often couldn't get in that squad let alone the team, but the current England players are the best we've had in a lifetime? Laughable.

 

 

 

Edited March 27, 2022 by Kid Icarus

[Kid Icarus]

Arguably the 2 best Premier League Centre backs of all time, 2 of the league's best central midfielders of all time, England's last wonderkid who despite underachieving is this country's all time leading goalscorer, the best crosser of a ball I've seen in my life, and comfortably the best English left back in my lifetime.

 

Compared with:

Harry Maguire and John Stones

Declan Rice and Kalvin Phillips

Phil Foden (outstanding but nowhere near the hype Rooney had)

TAA (the nearest player England has to Beckham) who only plays when tactics call for it

Luke Shaw

 

 

Southgate's created a team far greater than the sum of its parts, that doesn't suddenly mean the parts are better than in previous teams, it means he's achieved something he should be getting credit for.

 

 

Edited March 27, 2022 by Kid Icarus