Jonjo Shelvey (now playing for Çaykur Rizespor, on loan from Nottingham Forest)

[triggs]

He's more of a number 10,just add him to the list of number 10s in the squad.

He isn't, his long passing is his best attribute by a mile. He's not agile or skillful enough to be a number 10

[Ndegwa]

I don't get what he is. He's supposed to be a proficient long range passer (which is questionable imo), so should surely sit deeper...but he looks terrible there. He's not got the guile, agility or intelligence to play in behind a striker. He couldn't play anywhere on the sides due to his lack of athleticism...so what the hell is he? Really don't like him, technically or attitude-wise. English tho

[HawK]

I don't get what he is. He's supposed to be a proficient long range passer (which is questionable imo), so should surely sit deeper...but he looks terrible there. He's not got the guile, agility or intelligence to play in behind a striker. He couldn't play anywhere on the sides due to his lack of athleticism...so what the hell is he? Really don't like him, technically or attitude-wise. English tho

 

If we had a couple of engines in front of him, he would be fine imo

[Zero]

He is a midfielder with design fault. 

[ED209]

He is a midfielder with design fault. 

 

Which is?

 

Being crap?

[Dr Venkman]

I like him but in a functioning team his best position is probably on the bench.

[Cronky]

If he was playing in a team that was usually better than the opposition, he'd be fine because he'd have a bit more time and space in which to operate. In a team that's struggling, his lack of mobility and pace gets exposed.

[TRon]

I don't get what he is. He's supposed to be a proficient long range passer (which is questionable imo), so should surely sit deeper...but he looks terrible there. He's not got the guile, agility or intelligence to play in behind a striker. He couldn't play anywhere on the sides due to his lack of athleticism...so what the hell is he? Really don't like him, technically or attitude-wise. English tho

 

He can pick a good pass, of that there shouldn't be much doubt, there's been some beauties even in his short time here. The question should be, is the odd Hollywood pass more effective over 90 mins than a succession of quick short passes? If you compare with Leicester this season then you'd have to say no. The basics of hard work and team ethic come first.

[Alberto2005]

He'd probably be best in a midfield 3.

[Guest chopey]

He needs a free role because he's not disciplined enough to hold down a set position (a bit like Gerrard really)

[The College Dropout]

He needs a free role because he's not disciplined enough to hold down a set position (a bit like Gerrard really)

Aye - always struck me as one of Gerrard's shit offspring. Charlie Adam, Shelvey even Ramsey.

[joeyt]

Ramsey is a completely different player to Shelvey and Adam though

 

That is an absolutely absurd comparison

[Lush Vlad]

spot on Joey.

 

Ramsey is pretty mobile, is well suited to playing in the best passing team in the league, he can operate out wide, he can play behind the striker or as a centre mid.  I would say comparing him to Charlie Adam and Jonjo Shelvey, is a bit of an odd one? 

 

As for Shelvey.  I think Cronky is spot on with his assessment.  In a team that can control possession and dominate games.  I think he'd actually be a very good player.  For a team like us, that do neither of those things.  He's pretty ineffective and is actually a bit of a hindrance. 

[Sho Time]

Don't know why everyone keeps banging on about him being a luxury player, have you seen the points he does? The ones where he points at a player telling a player to pick the man up despite the fact that either 1) he's closer or 2) he's making no effort to close down the player closest to him with the ball. f***ing brilliant, man. Just what we need.

[The College Dropout]

Ramsey is mobile but he has zero positional discipline.  He leaves massive gaps in CM with his forward runs.  Without the ball unless he's charging around putting in tackles he's useless.  Often that charging leaves gaps to be exploited. 

 

To me that's the Gerrard legacy on British football. 'Central midfielders ' largely incapable of playing in a midfield 2 against players of similar ability because of ill-discipline off the ball and sometimes on it.  Lots of running and slide tackles masking the fact they leave the team vulnerable. In a midfield 2 - a tactical liability.  Perfectly fine in a midfield 3 btw. 

[Ndegwa]

TCD man! Fucking relentless  Can't remember the last time Aaron bloody Ramsey was flying into tackles

 

Don't know why everyone keeps banging on about him being a luxury player, have you seen the points he does? The ones where he points at a player telling a player to pick the man up despite the fact that either 1) he's closer or 2) he's making no effort to close down the player closest to him with the ball. f***ing brilliant, man. Just what we need.

 

 

A luxury player would also sort of mean that he has a specific ability that, in the right environment, is mercurial, special, useful or at least commendable. He doesn't.

[The College Dropout]

Ramsey makes far more challenges than you would imagine. On average, more so than Elniny(sp?) so far. He's also the player that has been dribbled around the most in the league (or he was a few weeks back).

 

 

[The College Dropout]

Oh and Fabregas is another from the Gerrard play book. Running forward all willy-nilly no idea what to do defensively in a midfield 2.  Penchant for the Hollywood ball too early. Main reason he didn't succeed in at Barca and was never considered to play as a CM regularly. 

[Lush Vlad]

Stop comparing players that are nothing alike.

[NEEJ]

Stop.

Edit: For the love of god.

[The College Dropout]

Stop comparing players that are nothing alike.

If you think they are not alike in regard to lack of discipline in a crucial role then you are clueless.

[morgs]

The problem is that as is being mentioned here, he is a luxury player. Except the level of luxury being talked about is a faltering alfa that gets you to the supermarket 1 time out of 10, the other 9 times you are ringing up roadside assistance.

[Lush Vlad]

Stop comparing players that are nothing alike.

If you think they are not alike in regard to lack of discipline in a crucial role then you are clueless.

 

Fabregas is completely immobile, can't tackle and doesn't look to play Shelvey/Gerrard type passes, at all.  But because he apparently lacks positional discipline.  You compare him to Gerrard?  It's as bad as the Ramsey, Charlie Adam, and Gerrard comparisons.  Just quit now, whilst you're behind. 

 

Such a mongrel. 

[The College Dropout]

Fabregas definitely tries to find the killer ball often. He's not always looking to switch play but he's going for the jugular a lot.  He's not immobile, he finds plenty of time to vacate his position with rouge forward runs.

 

He spent his final 2/3 years at Arsenal getting his game more like Gerrard's. More willing to break the lines as a CM with forward runs, no care for positional discipline or defensive tactics, a lot of focus on goals & assists rather than dictating play. Against better sides probably best used in a real midfield 3 or a #10.

 

"Guardiola's comment about the "anarchy" that Fabregas brings to the side was a backhanded compliment -- he also pointed out that he needed to hold his runs more. Other Barca insiders pointed the finger at Fabregas when the team's form started to slip. He had become too "English" in his style of play, they believed, too eager to attack quickly."

 

Back to Shelvey - so useless off the ball. Annoying pointing. Isn't even particularly good on the ball. Slow feet. Can barely move. Not sure he's any better than JC or VA.

[Tachikoma]

Bring Joey Barton back tbh.