Jonjo Shelvey (now playing for Çaykur Rizespor, on loan from Nottingham Forest)

[HaydnNUFC]

3. Huddersfield (a), Forest (h), West Ham (h).

[Aiston]

People are wrong to call him a bald racist c***, it's simply not true. He's a bald racist c*** of a liability.

 

 

He kicked out a few times last season that he got away with, as well so it's not just the racism incident or the 3 or so red cards. He's also been a liability at every club he's been at.

[xLiaaamx]

What's the fact he's got Alopecia got to do with anything?

[AyeDubbleYoo]

What's the fact he's got Alopecia got to do with anything?

 

Abuse and bullying as a child, therefore anger issues now.

[mozy]

The suggestion of selling him because he picked up a red card is absolute nonsense. He's still quite clearly our best central midfielder and that comes above all else. Should Man City have sold Fernandinho when he got 3 red cards in 6 weeks or whatever it was?

 

 

[Darth Crooks]

What's the fact he's got Alopecia got to do with anything?

 

Slippery character

[TRon]

What's the fact he's got Alopecia got to do with anything?

 

Abuse and bullying as a child, therefore anger issues now.

 

We should leave him out of the first team until he's had effective treatment of this issue if it's still ingrained when he's a full grown man.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

What's the fact he's got Alopecia got to do with anything?

 

Abuse and bullying as a child, therefore anger issues now.

 

We should leave him out of the first team until he's had effective treatment of this issue if it's still ingrained when he's a full grown man.

 

It could take years to work out that kind of issue. I might agree with you if he was punching people every couple of weeks, but it doesn't happen that often.

[Cronky]

Really for me is how he absolutely let himself, team, manager, and all of us down in our return to the PL at home on the big stage. Just shockingly stupid after being in great shape and having a fantastic preseason. Still seething at this as I'm convinced we'd have battled for at least a point.

 

Exactly, he really let the team down.  I think he's important to the way we play and he should go straight into the side when he gets back but he shouldn't wear the armband until he proves he has worked past these issues.  Dele was cuntish and either he was going to get a red or someone else was and Shelvey capitulated and let Dele off the hook.

 

I don't really see what Alli did that was so bad, he tapped the ball away to stop Shelvey picking it up quickly. If that's Shelvey's response after having psychological treatment you have to wonder when it's ever going to change.

 

I agree. How many times in a game to players kick the ball away or otherwise obstruct the opposition from taking a quick free kick. It's something professionals just have to deal with.

 

What particularly bothers me is that Shelvey didn't actually seem to lose his temper. He seemed to think that if he didn't tread on him very hard, it might look like an accident. That's the sort of delusion that you have to grow out of as a child.

[Darth Crooks]

He hasn't got anger issues like, he's just a snidey kyent

[Altamullan]

Regarding Shelvey seeing a psych, although it might sound a little silly, it certainly wouldn't take a Freudian long to formulate his problem, with the following 2 key concepts (lifted from Wikipedia) pretty much summing Shelvey up for mine:

 

ACTING OUT - "Acting out is a psychological term from the parlance of defense mechanisms and self-control, meaning to perform an action in contrast to bearing and managing the impulse to perform it." (In other words, no doubt many of us would feel drawn to stamping on Dele Alli, but most of us would resist the urge to do so in Shelvey's position on Sunday).

 

REPETITION COMPULSION - "Repetition compulsion is a psychological phenomenon in which a person repeats a traumatic event or its circumstances over and over again. This includes reenacting the event or putting oneself in situations where the event is likely to happen again." (So, unconsciously, Shelvey can't help but create situations like the one on Sunday, and then has very little self-control to manage those situations well. Although I have my doubts that Dele Alli is well schooled in Freudian theory, I suspect that his rat cunning - or perhaps Pochettino's pre-match instructions - basically gave him the same insight. If you look at the incident closely, you can see Alli turn his head and think "oh, it's you, I'll kick the ball away and see what happens", and Shelvey then immediately fell into the trap, while hoping that his ridiculous acting would make it seem like an innocent accident).

 

Unfortunately, unless the psych can help Shelvey to conquer the two things above, then he's always going to be prone to the sort of disaster that we saw on Sunday (just like Joey Barton was before him - Liverpool away during our relegation battle under Shearer springs to mind). To make matters worse, not only can such incidents occur in key moments or matches, but they are actually more likely to occur at those times, because the player is more emotionally charged than usual, so heaven help us if Shelvey ever takes to the pitch for us in a cup final (actually, I have my doubts about Mitro too, but with him there's at least a chance - albeit a slim one - that he will grow out of the tendency as he gets older).

Kin hell! Sigmund Fraud... Wheeling him out is equivalent in footy terms to considering how the laces in the leather balls influence spin in free kicks.

 

Freud's ideas are alive and well in the 21st century, and form the basis of a living, breathing, and evolving intellectual tradition, spanning psychoanalysis and various forms of psychodynamic psychotherapy.

 

Your resistance to this truth suggests that you could benefit from some time on the couch 

Yep, like shite. That's the way you Fraudians roll. Theory can't be bollocks, so if you can't see the truth of it must be something needs theraping. Bet you were right at home in the Ashley-Pardew zone, similar mind-viruses.

[The Bard of Byker]

Regarding Shelvey seeing a psych, although it might sound a little silly, it certainly wouldn't take a Freudian long to formulate his problem, with the following 2 key concepts (lifted from Wikipedia) pretty much summing Shelvey up for mine:

 

ACTING OUT - "Acting out is a psychological term from the parlance of defense mechanisms and self-control, meaning to perform an action in contrast to bearing and managing the impulse to perform it." (In other words, no doubt many of us would feel drawn to stamping on Dele Alli, but most of us would resist the urge to do so in Shelvey's position on Sunday).

 

REPETITION COMPULSION - "Repetition compulsion is a psychological phenomenon in which a person repeats a traumatic event or its circumstances over and over again. This includes reenacting the event or putting oneself in situations where the event is likely to happen again." (So, unconsciously, Shelvey can't help but create situations like the one on Sunday, and then has very little self-control to manage those situations well. Although I have my doubts that Dele Alli is well schooled in Freudian theory, I suspect that his rat cunning - or perhaps Pochettino's pre-match instructions - basically gave him the same insight. If you look at the incident closely, you can see Alli turn his head and think "oh, it's you, I'll kick the ball away and see what happens", and Shelvey then immediately fell into the trap, while hoping that his ridiculous acting would make it seem like an innocent accident).

 

Unfortunately, unless the psych can help Shelvey to conquer the two things above, then he's always going to be prone to the sort of disaster that we saw on Sunday (just like Joey Barton was before him - Liverpool away during our relegation battle under Shearer springs to mind). To make matters worse, not only can such incidents occur in key moments or matches, but they are actually more likely to occur at those times, because the player is more emotionally charged than usual, so heaven help us if Shelvey ever takes to the pitch for us in a cup final (actually, I have my doubts about Mitro too, but with him there's at least a chance - albeit a slim one - that he will grow out of the tendency as he gets older).

Kin hell! Sigmund Fraud... Wheeling him out is equivalent in footy terms to considering how the laces in the leather balls influence spin in free kicks.

 

Freud's ideas are alive and well in the 21st century, and form the basis of a living, breathing, and evolving intellectual tradition, spanning psychoanalysis and various forms of psychodynamic psychotherapy.

 

Your resistance to this truth suggests that you could benefit from some time on the couch 

Yep, like shite. That's the way you Fraudians roll. Theory can't be bollocks, so if you can't see the truth of it must be something needs theraping. Bet you were right at home in the Ashley-Pardew zone, similar mind-viruses.

 

Yes. Unfalsifiable nonsense.

[Odear]

So if Shearer had been sent off back when Neil Lennon head butted his boot, would we have called him a thick cunt?

 

It was dumb. But that David Platt from Corrie lookalike playing for Spurs is a complete scumbag. He was going into to headers and throwing elbows all game and getting away with it.

 

I'd have wanted to break his ankle too

[HaydnNUFC]

So if Shearer had been sent off back when Neil Lennon head butted his boot, would we have called him a thick c***?

 

It was dumb. But that David Platt from Corrie lookalike playing for Spurs is a complete scumbag. He was going into to headers and throwing elbows all game and getting away with it.

 

I'd have wanted to break his ankle too

If he so desperately wanted to stamp on him, at least try and shatter the cunt's kneecap, otherwise what's the point of doing it?

[Odear]

Intelligence is not something you associate footballers with.

[loki679]

Iain Dowie did a Masters in Engineering before he became a footballer

[STM]

That's only because he wanted reconstruct his own face.

[nemtizz]

I couldn't possibly think of a reason why Shearer might be treated differently to Jonjo fucking Shelvey.

[Menace]

Shearer was a cunt, but he was our cunt.

 

Jonjo is a cunt no one wants to claim.

[Altamullan]

Shearer was a c***, but he was our c***.

 

Jonjo is a c*** no one wants to claim.

Like your use of the spurs Dele Alli line. But I am delighted to claim Mr Shelvey as ours. Irrespective of the occasional brain fart.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

Shelvey's edge is different because it rarely seems to benefit us. Whereas the likes of Bellamy used his in the right way mostly.

 

I do think we need to keep Shelvey in perspective through, he doesn't get sent off that often and his general attitude has definitely improved.

[Guest chopey]

Shelvey will have shit in his own nest if Merino comes in and does well, his stupid stamp will relegate him to cup duty at best.

[TRon]

Shearer was a c***, but he was our c***.

 

Jonjo is a c*** no one wants to claim.

Like your use of the spurs Dele Alli line. But I am delighted to claim Mr Shelvey as ours. Irrespective of the occasional brain fart.

 

Just read today that our cunt is on 70k a week while Spurs cunt is on 50k. Does that make you any less delighted?

 

 

[Guest Bordertoon]

Regarding Shelvey seeing a psych, although it might sound a little silly, it certainly wouldn't take a Freudian long to formulate his problem, with the following 2 key concepts (lifted from Wikipedia) pretty much summing Shelvey up for mine:

 

ACTING OUT - "Acting out is a psychological term from the parlance of defense mechanisms and self-control, meaning to perform an action in contrast to bearing and managing the impulse to perform it." (In other words, no doubt many of us would feel drawn to stamping on Dele Alli, but most of us would resist the urge to do so in Shelvey's position on Sunday).

 

REPETITION COMPULSION - "Repetition compulsion is a psychological phenomenon in which a person repeats a traumatic event or its circumstances over and over again. This includes reenacting the event or putting oneself in situations where the event is likely to happen again." (So, unconsciously, Shelvey can't help but create situations like the one on Sunday, and then has very little self-control to manage those situations well. Although I have my doubts that Dele Alli is well schooled in Freudian theory, I suspect that his rat cunning - or perhaps Pochettino's pre-match instructions - basically gave him the same insight. If you look at the incident closely, you can see Alli turn his head and think "oh, it's you, I'll kick the ball away and see what happens", and Shelvey then immediately fell into the trap, while hoping that his ridiculous acting would make it seem like an innocent accident).

 

Unfortunately, unless the psych can help Shelvey to conquer the two things above, then he's always going to be prone to the sort of disaster that we saw on Sunday (just like Joey Barton was before him - Liverpool away during our relegation battle under Shearer springs to mind). To make matters worse, not only can such incidents occur in key moments or matches, but they are actually more likely to occur at those times, because the player is more emotionally charged than usual, so heaven help us if Shelvey ever takes to the pitch for us in a cup final (actually, I have my doubts about Mitro too, but with him there's at least a chance - albeit a slim one - that he will grow out of the tendency as he gets older).

Kin hell! Sigmund Fraud... Wheeling him out is equivalent in footy terms to considering how the laces in the leather balls influence spin in free kicks.

 

Freud's ideas are alive and well in the 21st century, and form the basis of a living, breathing, and evolving intellectual tradition, spanning psychoanalysis and various forms of psychodynamic psychotherapy.

 

Your resistance to this truth suggests that you could benefit from some time on the couch 

Yep, like s****. That's the way you Fraudians roll. Theory can't be bollocks, so if you can't see the truth of it must be something needs theraping. Bet you were right at home in the Ashley-Pardew zone, similar mind-viruses.

 

Yes. Unfalsifiable nonsense.

 

For what little it's worth, I'm actually not a Freudian, but was simply struck by how readily Shelvey's behaviour is explainable within that theoretical framework. I also think that any potential insights that spread beyond "Shelvey is an idiot", "get rid, he's a liability", or "he's a racist, baldy cunt" can be of value, because the matter is far more complex and far more important than that, given that he is one of precious few quality creative players that we have in our squad.

 

Btw, I don't think that we'll resolve the never ending "Freud Wars" here, nor is there is any reason to bore others in a pseudo intellectual attempt to do so, so I'll let you both have the (meaningless) "last words" on that front. However, I'm pretty sure that all theoretical perspectives can agree that literally nothing "needs theraping", and that they would all caution against drawing ridiculous and insulting links between entirely unrelated things, such as a person's (incorrectly) assumed adherence to Freud, and their views on the Ashley-Pardew zone.

[Jayson]

I don't think the psychology of it is that complicated. He's likely grown up having the p*ss taken out of him & he's learnt to fight back/stand his ground. He clearly has insecurities though so personalises situations like that as someone trying to "put him in his place" in a similar way & thinks he's being walked over if he lets it go.

 

Another player wouldn't personalise it in the same way & would just see Alli throwing the ball away as him being petulant rather than a lack of respect for whoever wants it. He probably wouldn't respect anyone in that moment. Shelvey took it personally.