brummie Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 2 hours ago, timeEd32 said: Do Villa have a lot of room once Grealish falls off the books? I don't know much about their situation other than their wages are ~£25m higher than ours on similar revenue. I am not entirely sure. I suspect we have some wiggle room, our net spend last 3 or 4 windows has been pretty low (I mean the last 4 windows since Grealish left so not including that 100m) and the academy sales will have added more room. I think it's more a case of how hard it is to buy anyone in the January window, regardless of your FFP position. I also read the other day that PL clubs are only allowed 2 loans at any one time now, which means with Lenglet and Zaniolo, we would need to send one back to get someone else in. Lenglet is needed because of the Mings situation, and Zaniolo has taken a while to get up to speed but Emery clearly really rates him and his application is top notch, so can't see much happening there. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteV Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 3 minutes ago, brummie said: I am not entirely sure. I suspect we have some wiggle room, our net spend last 3 or 4 windows has been pretty low (I mean the last 4 windows since Grealish left so not including that 100m) and the academy sales will have added more room. I think it's more a case of how hard it is to buy anyone in the January window, regardless of your FFP position. I also read the other day that PL clubs are only allowed 2 loans at any one time now, which means with Lenglet and Zaniolo, we would need to send one back to get someone else in. Lenglet is needed because of the Mings situation, and Zaniolo has taken a while to get up to speed but Emery clearly really rates him and his application is top notch, so can't see much happening there. Are Barca still paying some of Lenglet’s wages as it seems he’s on somewhere approaching £150k p/w, which seems mental for a loan player that doesn’t play the time? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brummie Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 1 minute ago, SteV said: Are Barca still paying some of Lenglet’s wages as it seems he’s on somewhere approaching £150k p/w, which seems mental for a loan player that doesn’t play the time? I wouldn't imagine we'd be paying anything like that for him. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteV Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 8 minutes ago, brummie said: I wouldn't imagine we'd be paying anything like that for him. It would be mental if you were. Suspect Barca must still be covering some of it. Just another example of the financial mess they’ve got themselves in. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
timeEd32 Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 33 minutes ago, brummie said: I am not entirely sure. I suspect we have some wiggle room, our net spend last 3 or 4 windows has been pretty low (I mean the last 4 windows since Grealish left so not including that 100m) and the academy sales will have added more room. I think it's more a case of how hard it is to buy anyone in the January window, regardless of your FFP position. I also read the other day that PL clubs are only allowed 2 loans at any one time now, which means with Lenglet and Zaniolo, we would need to send one back to get someone else in. Lenglet is needed because of the Mings situation, and Zaniolo has taken a while to get up to speed but Emery clearly really rates him and his application is top notch, so can't see much happening there. The wage bill seems high relative to revenue, which is what jumps out to me. Though it's not quite as high as it seems at a glance if Lenglet and Zaniolo are being subsidized (plus it's only one year anyway). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 Those Germans seem to be looking to spend some coin this window Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeyt Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 no idea if this is reliable but his career is amazing Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leffe186 Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 15 hours ago, 54 said: Ah man thats a bit gutting for Plymouth Even more gutting for West Brom - Villa poached him from them a couple of years ago. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 18 hours ago, timeEd32 said: Do Villa have a lot of room once Grealish falls off the books? I don't know much about their situation other than their wages are ~£25m higher than ours on similar revenue. Yes. They've sold £35m+ of youth products in the last 12 months iirc. And they've sold other players for decent money (eg Matt Targett for £15m), A lot of their investment is in wages rather than astronomical fees. They've only signed 1 player over 40m - Diaby. Then there's a couple 30m defenders. For Tonali & Isak (talking just transfer fees) they've got - Carlos, Torres, Tielemans, Kamara, Moreno, Diaby. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
timeEd32 Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 4 hours ago, The College Dropout said: Yes. They've sold £35m+ of youth products in the last 12 months iirc. And they've sold other players for decent money (eg Matt Targett for £15m), A lot of their investment is in wages rather than astronomical fees. They've only signed 1 player over 40m - Diaby. Then there's a couple 30m defenders. For Tonali & Isak (talking just transfer fees) they've got - Carlos, Torres, Tielemans, Kamara, Moreno, Diaby. This is why I'm on a crusade to get people to stop talking about just transfer fees. "A lot of their investment is in wages rather than astronomical fees" makes it sound like one is preferable to the other when it all gets added up together. When you factor in wages and amortisation, those six players are only £5m less per year than these five: Isak, Tonali, Botman, Gordon, and Livramento. Free transfers certainly aren't free when you're paying a player almost £8m per season. No doubt they did very well with Kamara, but I'm not sure I'd want to still be paying Tielemans £150k/wk a couple years from now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SEMTEX Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 I'm sure had we signed those players they all would have cost twice as much anyway, given the ol' Saudi tax. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andycap Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 How old that choupo mouting nowadays? Seems ancient I remember him at Blackburn. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Prontonise Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 1 minute ago, andycap said: How old that choupo mouting nowadays? Seems ancient I remember him at Blackburn. He played for Stoke not Blackburn. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lush Vlad Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 1 minute ago, andycap said: How old that choupo mouting nowadays? Seems ancient I remember him at Blackburn. Must have been on FM, then. As he never played for them it was Stoke he played for. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nufc123 Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 Manu back on the oldie train? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Menace Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 He's got the best agent in the industry Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeyt Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 that's a great price for someone in the summer Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrRaspberryJam Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 Just now, joeyt said: that's a great price for someone in the summer someone on here was going mental for Frimpong over Livramento in the summer. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
High Five o Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 Just now, MrRaspberryJam said: someone on here was going mental for Frimpong over Livramento in the summer. I remember, thought it was him or his agent like😂 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 (edited) 1 hour ago, timeEd32 said: This is why I'm on a crusade to get people to stop talking about just transfer fees. "A lot of their investment is in wages rather than astronomical fees" makes it sound like one is preferable to the other when it all gets added up together. When you factor in wages and amortisation, those six players are only £5m less per year than these five: Isak, Tonali, Botman, Gordon, and Livramento. Free transfers certainly aren't free when you're paying a player almost £8m per season. No doubt they did very well with Kamara, but I'm not sure I'd want to still be paying Tielemans £150k/wk a couple years from now. How do you reckon that? You think Tonali came for 60m euros to earn half of Youri Tielemans? Tielemans is rumoured to earn £8m p/a. Tonali is rumoured to earn £7m p/a. Isak similar. Tonali costs £18m per year FFP wise. That pays for Tielemans & Kamara (both rumoured to earn around £8m p/a) FFP wise. Isak is roughly £16.5 per year FFP wise. That almost pays for Pau Torres at £11.8m & Alex Moreno at £5.3m. In the short-term FFP wise ours are still much more expensive. Long-term - we are largely signing younger players with better resale value. Moreno, Diego Carlos are 30ish. But we could do a bit more mix and matching - especially with free transfers of young players or loans. Sometimes you need to do short-term things that contribute to long-term goals even if the action is contradictory. Edited January 4 by The College Dropout Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbandit Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 Was a dark day for that poster after we signed Tino. Don’t think they ever posted again Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shearergol Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 Tielemans is probably the least suited midfielder in the world for our system. I get your overall point isn't about that, just wanted to say it Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 3 minutes ago, Shearergol said: Tielemans is probably the least suited midfielder in the world for our system. I get your overall point isn't about that, just wanted to say it Agreed. Although he would fit in with how we've been playing recently. Especially Bruno off the ball. Watch him for one of the goals against Liverpool trying to track Szob.. that would go viral on Twitter. A similar video went viral some years back about Tielemans - when he made Rice look like Usain Bolt (Rice is rapid tbf). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
timeEd32 Posted January 4 Share Posted January 4 6 minutes ago, The College Dropout said: How do you reckon that? You think Tonali came for 60m euros to earn half of Youri Tielemans? Tielemans is rumoured to earn £8m p/a. Tonali is rumoured to earn £7m p/a. Isak similar. Tonali costs £18m per year FFP wise. That pays for Tielemans & Kamara (both rumoured to earn around £8m p/a) FFP wise. Isak is roughly £16.5 per year FFP wise. That almost pays for Pau Torres at £11.8m & Alex Moreno at £5.3m. In the short-term FFP wise ours are still much more expensive. Long-term - we are largely signing younger players with better resale value. Moreno, Diego Carlos are 30ish. Tonali is 17.3, Isak 16.3 (6 year deal when it was allowed for FFP), Botman and Gordon 11, and Tino 9. £64.83m/yr with all the proper decimals. Tielemans and Kamara 8, Diaby 16, Moreno 5 (cheap but also only a 3.5 year deal), Torres 11, and Carlos 11.8 (4 year deal). £59.77m/yr with all the actual numbers. It's a fairly random set of players, but I'm just trying to illustrate that it's quite pointless to talk about finances in terms of only transfer fees. The fact their wage bill is ~£25m more than ours is quite significant. And, if anything, it's probably preferable to be paying higher fees + lower wages because you can finesse the amortisation with contract extensions. Once you commit to paying someone £7.8m/yr then that's that, especially if they are unlikely to carry a lot of resale value. To even more neatly illustrate the point just take Gordon + Tino and Kamara + Diaby. With transfer fees only we spent £72m and they spent £47.5. But when you add wages and amoritisation it becomes £20.14m/yr for us and £24.06 for them. What looks like £25m more in all of the headlines is actually £4m less per year. Even if you want to remove all the funky accounting and amortisation from the equation, the actual five year outlay on those players is £120.3 for Villa and £100.7m for Newcastle. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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