Mike Ashley (former owner)

[Interpolic]

Love Tin Tin me like

[ToonArmy1892]

 

Who cares? Everything he says is bollocks

 

This, i couldn't think of anything worse on a Friday night than reading that.

 

When the c*** is silent for long. Hearing a load of his bullshit is music to my ears

 

Why?

[Guest chopey]

Righto - and warning this is pretty boring tbh so only read on if you have insomnia,

 

So this all centres on online sales made to customers in Belgium, basically in every EU country there is a threshold of annual sales (Belgium is €35,000) after which you have to register for VAT in that country and pay local VAT at their rates - you don't pay it to HMRC as well.

 

Back in 2017 HMRC lost a case where they wanted all SD sales to be under UK VAT and outside of the above rule, from this point a Belgian bill was always going to come (I'd actually wager that SD sell sufficient values to have this situation in every EU country) and they really should have been accounting for it (hence my earlier comment that they've known about this for 2 years).

 

Certainly up to 2017 all VAT would have been paid to HMRC an this will be reclaimable. Hopefully (for the innocent shareholders) they have continued to pay VAT on Belgian sales to HMRC after this point and if so then is also fully recoverable. The problem they have though is that VAT in Belgium is 21% and they can go back to the point at which it should have been payable - 1% on all sales to Belgium over say 10 years is a lot of VAT to pay. The authorities can also levy fines and interest on the full amount that should have been paid, not just the difference in VAT rates. My gut feeling is that SD have not disclosed the bill to Belgium, and it has been the Belgian authorities who have made the first move.

 

If so, and with SD being a plc with massive EU sales, the fines will be significant - in Italy it could be up to 500% of the liability in fines and interest on top.

 

I've lived this for 2 years after joining an online retailer with a total turnover of £20m, unwinding a bill of £2m - 30% of this being fines and interest after we made the disclosure and it being a genuine oversight of a company with no accounting function prior to me joining.

 

Boring bit over.

 

Ashley can't be found personally liable for any of this so talk of tax evasion etc is fanciful. He does however have responsibilities as a director to make good decisions and this along with the HoF debacle could lead to him losing his position in SD.

 

Impact on NUFC? HMRC will have looked into our transactions after finding irregularities in SD and it wouldn't surprise me if this was what started the whole transfer investigation. I think apart from this investigation there interest in us is done.

 

Will it lead to him taking more cash out of NUFC? Unlikely as you would actually want to keep yourself and SD as low on cash as possible until it is resolved so you can plead poverty and an inability to pay. It could actually make him more likely to go on a spending spree.

 

Could there be more? Potentially - all 27 EU countries will be looking at this unless SD are paying VAT there already. If Italy get involved it would dwarf this. The way its been handled today may lead to the shareprice absolutely tanking on Monday. I don't think SD will be in the FTSE100 for long if it does. They won't pay €600k, with the HMRC reclaim it will be €200-€300k max imo. It will be a pain in the ass for the finance team anyway.

 

What we should all hope is that this is just the tip of the iceberg on how they account for things and a new auditor rips apart the acquisitions they have made. on its own its a technical correction to make, but if there is anything else dodgy going on it will now be found and if serious fraud charges may follow on the directors with prison being a possibility as well as a ban on being a director for any UK company for a while and failing the F&P test.

 

Takeover impact? I can see him having enough of public life and retiring to the Bahamas so it could make him a more receptive seller

 

TLDR - on its own its an irritation to him but it may be the thread that when pulled makes the whole thing collapse

 

This could be the end, Nick Frost will play him in the Rise and Fall movie

[Wallsendmag]

Is the HMRC investigation still ongoing or has that all been wrapped up now.

[Shelveys Hair]

Righto - and warning this is pretty boring tbh so only read on if you have insomnia,

 

So this all centres on online sales made to customers in Belgium, basically in every EU country there is a threshold of annual sales (Belgium is €35,000) after which you have to register for VAT in that country and pay local VAT at their rates - you don't pay it to HMRC as well.

 

Back in 2017 HMRC lost a case where they wanted all SD sales to be under UK VAT and outside of the above rule, from this point a Belgian bill was always going to come (I'd actually wager that SD sell sufficient values to have this situation in every EU country) and they really should have been accounting for it (hence my earlier comment that they've known about this for 2 years).

 

Certainly up to 2017 all VAT would have been paid to HMRC an this will be reclaimable. Hopefully (for the innocent shareholders) they have continued to pay VAT on Belgian sales to HMRC after this point and if so then is also fully recoverable. The problem they have though is that VAT in Belgium is 21% and they can go back to the point at which it should have been payable - 1% on all sales to Belgium over say 10 years is a lot of VAT to pay. The authorities can also levy fines and interest on the full amount that should have been paid, not just the difference in VAT rates. My gut feeling is that SD have not disclosed the bill to Belgium, and it has been the Belgian authorities who have made the first move.

 

If so, and with SD being a plc with massive EU sales, the fines will be significant - in Italy it could be up to 500% of the liability in fines and interest on top.

 

I've lived this for 2 years after joining an online retailer with a total turnover of £20m, unwinding a bill of £2m - 30% of this being fines and interest after we made the disclosure and it being a genuine oversight of a company with no accounting function prior to me joining.

 

Boring bit over.

 

Ashley can't be found personally liable for any of this so talk of tax evasion etc is fanciful. He does however have responsibilities as a director to make good decisions and this along with the HoF debacle could lead to him losing his position in SD.

 

Impact on NUFC? HMRC will have looked into our transactions after finding irregularities in SD and it wouldn't surprise me if this was what started the whole transfer investigation. I think apart from this investigation there interest in us is done.

 

Will it lead to him taking more cash out of NUFC? Unlikely as you would actually want to keep yourself and SD as low on cash as possible until it is resolved so you can plead poverty and an inability to pay. It could actually make him more likely to go on a spending spree.

 

Could there be more? Potentially - all 27 EU countries will be looking at this unless SD are paying VAT there already. If Italy get involved it would dwarf this. The way its been handled today may lead to the shareprice absolutely tanking on Monday. I don't think SD will be in the FTSE100 for long if it does. They won't pay €600k, with the HMRC reclaim it will be €200-€300k max imo. It will be a pain in the ass for the finance team anyway.

 

What we should all hope is that this is just the tip of the iceberg on how they account for things and a new auditor rips apart the acquisitions they have made. on its own its a technical correction to make, but if there is anything else dodgy going on it will now be found and if serious fraud charges may follow on the directors with prison being a possibility as well as a ban on being a director for any UK company for a while and failing the F&P test.

 

Takeover impact? I can see him having enough of public life and retiring to the Bahamas so it could make him a more receptive seller

 

TLDR - on its own its an irritation to him but it may be the thread that when pulled makes the whole thing collapse

 

Hope you mean millions instead of thousands 

[Colos Short and Curlies]

Is the HMRC investigation still ongoing or has that all been wrapped up now.

 

Ongoing. Although the mounts here are nowhere near the Belgian amounts, if found guilty we could see some serious charges levied against Ashley and Charnley and we would be sold and would be hit with some hefty FA/PL penalties as it is genuine tax evasion and fraud that is being investigated, not a technical oversight

[Colos Short and Curlies]

Righto - and warning this is pretty boring tbh so only read on if you have insomnia,

 

So this all centres on online sales made to customers in Belgium, basically in every EU country there is a threshold of annual sales (Belgium is €35,000) after which you have to register for VAT in that country and pay local VAT at their rates - you don't pay it to HMRC as well.

 

Back in 2017 HMRC lost a case where they wanted all SD sales to be under UK VAT and outside of the above rule, from this point a Belgian bill was always going to come (I'd actually wager that SD sell sufficient values to have this situation in every EU country) and they really should have been accounting for it (hence my earlier comment that they've known about this for 2 years).

 

Certainly up to 2017 all VAT would have been paid to HMRC an this will be reclaimable. Hopefully (for the innocent shareholders) they have continued to pay VAT on Belgian sales to HMRC after this point and if so then is also fully recoverable. The problem they have though is that VAT in Belgium is 21% and they can go back to the point at which it should have been payable - 1% on all sales to Belgium over say 10 years is a lot of VAT to pay. The authorities can also levy fines and interest on the full amount that should have been paid, not just the difference in VAT rates. My gut feeling is that SD have not disclosed the bill to Belgium, and it has been the Belgian authorities who have made the first move.

 

If so, and with SD being a plc with massive EU sales, the fines will be significant - in Italy it could be up to 500% of the liability in fines and interest on top.

 

I've lived this for 2 years after joining an online retailer with a total turnover of £20m, unwinding a bill of £2m - 30% of this being fines and interest after we made the disclosure and it being a genuine oversight of a company with no accounting function prior to me joining.

 

Boring bit over.

 

Ashley can't be found personally liable for any of this so talk of tax evasion etc is fanciful. He does however have responsibilities as a director to make good decisions and this along with the HoF debacle could lead to him losing his position in SD.

 

Impact on NUFC? HMRC will have looked into our transactions after finding irregularities in SD and it wouldn't surprise me if this was what started the whole transfer investigation. I think apart from this investigation there interest in us is done.

 

Will it lead to him taking more cash out of NUFC? Unlikely as you would actually want to keep yourself and SD as low on cash as possible until it is resolved so you can plead poverty and an inability to pay. It could actually make him more likely to go on a spending spree.

 

Could there be more? Potentially - all 27 EU countries will be looking at this unless SD are paying VAT there already. If Italy get involved it would dwarf this. The way its been handled today may lead to the shareprice absolutely tanking on Monday. I don't think SD will be in the FTSE100 for long if it does. They won't pay €600k, with the HMRC reclaim it will be €200-€300k max imo. It will be a pain in the ass for the finance team anyway.

 

What we should all hope is that this is just the tip of the iceberg on how they account for things and a new auditor rips apart the acquisitions they have made. on its own its a technical correction to make, but if there is anything else dodgy going on it will now be found and if serious fraud charges may follow on the directors with prison being a possibility as well as a ban on being a director for any UK company for a while and failing the F&P test.

 

Takeover impact? I can see him having enough of public life and retiring to the Bahamas so it could make him a more receptive seller

 

TLDR - on its own its an irritation to him but it may be the thread that when pulled makes the whole thing collapse

 

Hope you mean millions instead of thousands 

 

I do - its Friday, its late and my dealings in this have been in the thousands (my defence your honour)

[gdm]

[Sifu]

Don’t really care if it affects the club or not, just want him to experience as much pain and failure as possible.

 

This 100%. Hope karma strikes the fucking cunt.

[Shelveys Hair]

Righto - and warning this is pretty boring tbh so only read on if you have insomnia,

 

So this all centres on online sales made to customers in Belgium, basically in every EU country there is a threshold of annual sales (Belgium is €35,000) after which you have to register for VAT in that country and pay local VAT at their rates - you don't pay it to HMRC as well.

 

Back in 2017 HMRC lost a case where they wanted all SD sales to be under UK VAT and outside of the above rule, from this point a Belgian bill was always going to come (I'd actually wager that SD sell sufficient values to have this situation in every EU country) and they really should have been accounting for it (hence my earlier comment that they've known about this for 2 years).

 

Certainly up to 2017 all VAT would have been paid to HMRC an this will be reclaimable. Hopefully (for the innocent shareholders) they have continued to pay VAT on Belgian sales to HMRC after this point and if so then is also fully recoverable. The problem they have though is that VAT in Belgium is 21% and they can go back to the point at which it should have been payable - 1% on all sales to Belgium over say 10 years is a lot of VAT to pay. The authorities can also levy fines and interest on the full amount that should have been paid, not just the difference in VAT rates. My gut feeling is that SD have not disclosed the bill to Belgium, and it has been the Belgian authorities who have made the first move.

 

If so, and with SD being a plc with massive EU sales, the fines will be significant - in Italy it could be up to 500% of the liability in fines and interest on top.

 

I've lived this for 2 years after joining an online retailer with a total turnover of £20m, unwinding a bill of £2m - 30% of this being fines and interest after we made the disclosure and it being a genuine oversight of a company with no accounting function prior to me joining.

 

Boring bit over.

 

Ashley can't be found personally liable for any of this so talk of tax evasion etc is fanciful. He does however have responsibilities as a director to make good decisions and this along with the HoF debacle could lead to him losing his position in SD.

 

Impact on NUFC? HMRC will have looked into our transactions after finding irregularities in SD and it wouldn't surprise me if this was what started the whole transfer investigation. I think apart from this investigation there interest in us is done.

 

Will it lead to him taking more cash out of NUFC? Unlikely as you would actually want to keep yourself and SD as low on cash as possible until it is resolved so you can plead poverty and an inability to pay. It could actually make him more likely to go on a spending spree.

 

Could there be more? Potentially - all 27 EU countries will be looking at this unless SD are paying VAT there already. If Italy get involved it would dwarf this. The way its been handled today may lead to the shareprice absolutely tanking on Monday. I don't think SD will be in the FTSE100 for long if it does. They won't pay €600m, with the HMRC reclaim it will be €200-€300m max imo. It will be a pain in the ass for the finance team anyway.

 

What we should all hope is that this is just the tip of the iceberg on how they account for things and a new auditor rips apart the acquisitions they have made. on its own its a technical correction to make, but if there is anything else dodgy going on it will now be found and if serious fraud charges may follow on the directors with prison being a possibility as well as a ban on being a director for any UK company for a while and failing the F&P test.

 

Takeover impact? I can see him having enough of public life and retiring to the Bahamas so it could make him a more receptive seller

 

TLDR - on its own its an irritation to him but it may be the thread that when pulled makes the whole thing collapse

 

Hope you mean millions instead of thousands 

 

I do - its Friday, its late and my dealings in this have been in the thousands (my defence your honour)

 

Sounds good to me mate.. anything that could possibly cause this cunt to sell is a plus. 

 

And if he got hit from most of the countries in the EU that would be the icing on the cake.

[Happinesstan]

Righto - and warning this is pretty boring tbh so only read on if you have insomnia,

 

So this all centres on online sales made to customers in Belgium, basically in every EU country there is a threshold of annual sales (Belgium is €35,000) after which you have to register for VAT in that country and pay local VAT at their rates - you don't pay it to HMRC as well.

 

Back in 2017 HMRC lost a case where they wanted all SD sales to be under UK VAT and outside of the above rule, from this point a Belgian bill was always going to come (I'd actually wager that SD sell sufficient values to have this situation in every EU country) and they really should have been accounting for it (hence my earlier comment that they've known about this for 2 years).

 

Certainly up to 2017 all VAT would have been paid to HMRC an this will be reclaimable. Hopefully (for the innocent shareholders) they have continued to pay VAT on Belgian sales to HMRC after this point and if so then is also fully recoverable. The problem they have though is that VAT in Belgium is 21% and they can go back to the point at which it should have been payable - 1% on all sales to Belgium over say 10 years is a lot of VAT to pay. The authorities can also levy fines and interest on the full amount that should have been paid, not just the difference in VAT rates. My gut feeling is that SD have not disclosed the bill to Belgium, and it has been the Belgian authorities who have made the first move.

 

If so, and with SD being a plc with massive EU sales, the fines will be significant - in Italy it could be up to 500% of the liability in fines and interest on top.

 

I've lived this for 2 years after joining an online retailer with a total turnover of £20m, unwinding a bill of £2m - 30% of this being fines and interest after we made the disclosure and it being a genuine oversight of a company with no accounting function prior to me joining.

 

Boring bit over.

 

Ashley can't be found personally liable for any of this so talk of tax evasion etc is fanciful. He does however have responsibilities as a director to make good decisions and this along with the HoF debacle could lead to him losing his position in SD.

 

Impact on NUFC? HMRC will have looked into our transactions after finding irregularities in SD and it wouldn't surprise me if this was what started the whole transfer investigation. I think apart from this investigation there interest in us is done.

 

Will it lead to him taking more cash out of NUFC? Unlikely as you would actually want to keep yourself and SD as low on cash as possible until it is resolved so you can plead poverty and an inability to pay. It could actually make him more likely to go on a spending spree.

 

Could there be more? Potentially - all 27 EU countries will be looking at this unless SD are paying VAT there already. If Italy get involved it would dwarf this. The way its been handled today may lead to the shareprice absolutely tanking on Monday. I don't think SD will be in the FTSE100 for long if it does. They won't pay €600m, with the HMRC reclaim it will be €200-€300m max imo. It will be a pain in the ass for the finance team anyway.

 

What we should all hope is that this is just the tip of the iceberg on how they account for things and a new auditor rips apart the acquisitions they have made. on its own its a technical correction to make, but if there is anything else dodgy going on it will now be found and if serious fraud charges may follow on the directors with prison being a possibility as well as a ban on being a director for any UK company for a while and failing the F&P test.

 

Takeover impact? I can see him having enough of public life and retiring to the Bahamas so it could make him a more receptive seller

 

TLDR - on its own its an irritation to him but it may be the thread that when pulled makes the whole thing collapse

 

Hope you mean millions instead of thousands 

 

I do - its Friday, its late and my dealings in this have been in the thousands (my defence your honour)

 

Sounds good to me mate.. anything that could possibly cause this cunt to sell is a plus. 

 

And if he got hit from most of the countries in the EU that would be the icing on the cake.

 

If he was hit by all the other countries would he also be in a position to reclaim tax paid to HMRC?

[gdm]

[Robster]

The fucking cunt

 

 

[WarrenBartonCentrePartin]

Fucking troll.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

Fuck him in every orifice, hope he dies a horrible death.

[Facundo Ferreyra]

The f***ing c***

 

 

What an absolute load of fucking bollocks. Why's he got such a hard-on for Joelinton? Definitely something shady there.

[Shelveys Hair]

Don’t really care if it affects the club or not, just want him to experience as much pain and failure as possible.

 

This 100%. Hope karma strikes the fucking cunt.

 

In a coincidental turn of events it was Sir Bobby's last appearance at Saint James Park 10 years ago today.

 

[gdm]

'My view always was we had to keep Rafa. For my own personal safety we had to keep Rafa. I thought he had us offside, he had us cornered, it wasn't fair, it wasn't right, I've been totally out-manoeuvred, I probably shouldn't own a football club, it's ridiculous, but I'm a big boy.

 

Sell it you fuckin dopey cunt

[midds]

Here comes the smear. Took longer than I thought tbh.

[Dunce]

According to various reports i have read ,  sd profits rose 5% to 143 million

While total revenue rose 10% to 3.7 billion.

3.7BILLION for 143 million profit ?

How much revenue would be required to make that much profit at sjp?

I bet it woudnt be anywhere near half as much.

He is never ever selling nufc.

He will sell sd before he sells nufc.

 

[Ameritoon]

'My view always was we had to keep Rafa. For my own personal safety we had to keep Rafa. I thought he had us offside, he had us cornered, it wasn't fair, it wasn't right, I've been totally out-manoeuvred, I probably shouldn't own a football club, it's ridiculous, but I'm a big boy.'

 

what the fuck

[Guest Yerdas El Savon]

God, I hate him

[taxfree]

"I think I could own this football club for ever. That is my new mental state."

 

fuck off you utterly horrific parasite

[Shelveys Hair]

Knew the cunt would try hammer the fans with this shit.. hope he gets taken to the fucking cleaners

[Guest]

Sad thing is a lot of people will buy it.