Kid Icarus Posted August 19, 2022 Share Posted August 19, 2022 27 minutes ago, KaKa said: Pretty sure someone on here said we should have just pushed the boat out for Botman in January, which would have meant paying that £50 million. £14 million more than what we ended up paying. That difference in price has effectively allowed us to get an extra player in Dan Burn that has greatly improved our squad depth. So easy to brush over and overlook though. Probably influenced by the fact we had none of this calmness when we spent £25m on Chris Wood tbf Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LFEE Posted August 19, 2022 Share Posted August 19, 2022 7 minutes ago, Yorkie said: Definitely not. Bruno, Schar and Botman (if his stats are anything to go by) are all better. They aren’t. Passing is something you judge with your eyes. So on that basis Jonjo is the better medium and long passer with Schar probably second. Bruno the better short passer and is very adapt at threaded passes (which I like) and now happening more regularly from medium distance but has struggled a bit when spaying the ball out wide with distance where Jonjo excels. Not seen enough of Botman but has shown potential to surpass Schar. SLongstaff has potential too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdm Posted August 19, 2022 Share Posted August 19, 2022 34 minutes ago, KaKa said: Pretty sure someone on here said we should have just pushed the boat out for Botman in January, which would have meant paying that £50 million. £14 million more than what we ended up paying. That difference in price has effectively allowed us to get an extra player in Dan Burn that has greatly improved our squad depth. So easy to brush over and overlook though. Easy to say in Hindsight. We were well in the shit when whoever said that about Botman. It’s easier this window to look at things in a calmer way Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaKa Posted August 19, 2022 Share Posted August 19, 2022 2 minutes ago, gdm said: Easy to say in Hindsight. We were well in the shit when whoever said that about Botman. It’s easier this window to look at things in a calmer way The comment was made recently and not in January. The claim being that it would have saved us having to 'waste' budget on Burn. The reality though, with the new information in that article, is that the same money has instead got us the two players. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkie Posted August 19, 2022 Share Posted August 19, 2022 8 minutes ago, LFEE said: 24 minutes ago, Yorkie said: Definitely not. Bruno, Schar and Botman (if his stats are anything to go by) are all better. They aren’t. Passing is something you judge with your eyes. Yeah sure, but just as a general point, Botman's passing stats at Lille were fantastic so you wouldn't rule out him being better. Shelvey can definitely ping a pass but I think his talent where that is concerned has generally been overrated. So many games in the past have been so frustrating to watch because we're relying on Shelvey to dictate the play. Bruno's undoubtedly the best, anyway, imo. Don't think Shelvey has ever delivered a ball like his for Almiron's Palace worldie last season. And some of them balls through (again to Miggy) against Forest were just daft. Inch perfect. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaKa Posted August 19, 2022 Share Posted August 19, 2022 1 minute ago, POOT 2.0 said: I hear you, but If we had paid £50m for Botman in January, we'd all have thought it was still a great deal and we'd never have even given Dan Burn any thought. Hindsight is a fine thing, and it's hardly a wild opinion to have in the middle of a scary relegation fight. The opinion wasn't made back then but recently. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdm Posted August 19, 2022 Share Posted August 19, 2022 5 minutes ago, KaKa said: The comment was made recently and not in January. The claim being that it would have saved us having to 'waste' budget on Burn. The reality though, with the new information in that article, is that the same money has instead got us the two players. Fair enough Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest HTT II Posted August 19, 2022 Share Posted August 19, 2022 39 minutes ago, KaKa said: Pretty sure someone on here said we should have just pushed the boat out for Botman in January, which would have meant paying that £50 million. £14 million more than what we ended up paying. That difference in price has effectively allowed us to get an extra player in Dan Burn that has greatly improved our squad depth. So easy to brush over and overlook though. Hindsight is a wonderful thing… We could have just as easily went down and looking back, had we pushed the boat out and overspent on Botman and he helped keep us up, it’s well, money well spent. It obviously worked out great at both ends of the spectrum as we stayed up having not got our man and then went on to get him at a reduced price. But that’s the same kind of position we are in right now, albeit a stronger position. Us spending say 60m max on Maddison or refusing to go above 40m or so could be the difference between finishing say tenth or 6th. We have to start taking chances at some point and we will have to overspend on some of our targets if we are to land them, like this Watford kid. I think thus far we have spent really well, such good value for money. Pope looks like a 25m ‘keeper. Trippier for 12m is a steal, just as a leader never mind what he brings as a footballer. Burn and Targett are bargains. Bruno’s ceiling is so high he could one day be a 100m player. Botman could and hopefully will be our Kompany. Wood at 25m is the anomaly, but he was a necessity at the time and the club needs to look at current targets on that basis. Is or was he worth 25m, no way, did we overspend, massively, but it worked. My good friend is a Liverpool fan. Posts on Rawk, I won’t name him, he used to go to uni here and has a soft spot for Newcastle, he thought we would have went for a Coutinho or a Dembele and was shocked at how wisely we spent and the players we’ve brought in and how well they have all done as they, apart from Trippier and maybe the unknown (to us) Bruno, were deemed nothing or average players. We talk regularly and he said LFC were getting quoted silly prices for players especially once clubs knew they were flush with money following the sale of Coutinho, and they apparently almost walked away from signing VVD because of how much Southampton were asking. I think City and Man Utd were sniffing around him so they decided fuck it, we will make them an offer they couldn't refuse and they got their man and the rest is history. I’ve said it before, if our scouts rate someone so highly and the data analysis points towards nothing but good stuff, we have to trust all of that and pay a premium, whether it’s a PL premium, a NUFC Saudi premium or because a club doesn’t really want to sell one of their better players unless it’s for crazy money. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUPERTOON Posted August 19, 2022 Share Posted August 19, 2022 42 minutes ago, KaKa said: There's been a ton of great stuff posted on Pedro on here now. I more and more convinced that Almiron's place on that right hand side is going to be under serious threat from him, if he doesn't take advantages of the opportunities he's been getting there. Longer term he may well take over from Wilson as a striker, but in the short term I think he may force his way into the team out wide. He has the work rate Almiron provides but looks a far more direct runner with the ball and does a great job in general link up play. Those Bruno through balls will be right on his stronger right foot too, and I don't see him not pulling the trigger like Almiron has failed to do a number of times now. I’m assuming as well that we have decided as we can’t land our top targets, the likes of Diaby and Harrison, then we have decided to wait for them or someone of similar quality next summer. Definitely they smart play but would still have liked us to get a loan in that area to cover. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Menace Posted August 19, 2022 Share Posted August 19, 2022 Been a slow summer but when you reflect that they've been here less than a year and could potentially sign another 2 by end of August and 2-3 by Jan, I'm happy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LV Posted August 19, 2022 Share Posted August 19, 2022 1 hour ago, xLiaaamx said: "Jonjo Shelvey, the teams best passer" Not having that like I thought that. It’s definitely Bruno. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hhtoon Posted August 19, 2022 Share Posted August 19, 2022 49 minutes ago, r0cafella said: So, if they are after 2 permanent signings and we know JP is one of them we can estimate we have about 60m more to spend. Are we talking cash or FFP? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vinny Green Balls Posted August 19, 2022 Share Posted August 19, 2022 11 minutes ago, LV said: I thought that. It’s definitely Bruno. Shelvey is a good passer, but that seemed a bit much from George. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SUPERTOON Posted August 19, 2022 Share Posted August 19, 2022 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Icarus Posted August 19, 2022 Share Posted August 19, 2022 Think it's debateable tbh, Bruno undoubtedly gets into positions to make his passes more cutting, but Shelvey is underrated in general on here I think. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vinny Green Balls Posted August 19, 2022 Share Posted August 19, 2022 Just now, Kid Icarus said: Think it's debateable tbh, Bruno undoubtedly gets into positions to make his passes more cutting, but Shelvey is underrated in general on here I think. Oh I totally think he is underrated. Bruno just seems on a different level to me. But I was always impressed with Shelvey’s accuracy, and am one who thinks he is a big miss right now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
r0cafella Posted August 19, 2022 Share Posted August 19, 2022 8 minutes ago, Hhtoon said: Are we talking cash or FFP? I’m just estimating and I’m referring to headline fees. Not cash or FFP specifically. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
STM Posted August 19, 2022 Share Posted August 19, 2022 Long range, I'd fancy Shelvey as much as anyone on the world. Short and medium range passing Bruno is different gravy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sushimonster85 Posted August 19, 2022 Share Posted August 19, 2022 I think the issue with Shelvey hasn't been his ability to play those sorts of balls, I think if you stuck a target 50+ yards Shelvey would be able to hit it more consistently than most in the league, its knowing when and where to play those balls. He has gotten a lot better since Howe came in, but for most of his career he tendedd to try these long cross field Hollywood passes at inopportune times without much regard for who he was passing to, or what the team needed in that particular moment. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Posted August 19, 2022 Share Posted August 19, 2022 Remember when you were a kid and you asked your dad for money and he said no so you went behind his back and asked your mam, can Eddie not just do that with the Saudis ? instead of been a goodie two shoes and trusting the fantastically qualified professionals that now run the club, I'm sure that would keep the numpty fans happy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanshithispantz Posted August 19, 2022 Share Posted August 19, 2022 (edited) Schar passes from a much safer area of the pitch, he's good on the ball for a centre back but there's no chance he could knock the ball about like Shelvey can in the middle. His debut against West Ham made him look like KdB, he's become a very safe and 'boring' midfielder but there's obviously a lot a team can gain from that. Edited August 19, 2022 by Hanshithispantz Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coffee_Johnny Posted August 19, 2022 Share Posted August 19, 2022 (edited) 32 minutes ago, STM said: Long range, I'd fancy Shelvey as much as anyone on the world. Short and medium range passing Bruno is different gravy. Acknowledging my limited knowledge of world football, but in terms of players I have seen a lot of I would put Shelvey in the same bracket as Paul Scholes who, although he wasn’t reliant on this part of his all round first class game, was incredibly accurate with long passes. Edited August 19, 2022 by Coffee_Johnny Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
STM Posted August 19, 2022 Share Posted August 19, 2022 Scholes is still the benchmark for English midfielders. Despite what the PFMs and Pundits would say, he was way above Gerrard and Lampard in all around play. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest HTT II Posted August 19, 2022 Share Posted August 19, 2022 8 minutes ago, STM said: Scholes is still the benchmark for English midfielders. Despite what the PFMs and Pundits would say, he was way above Gerrard and Lampard in all around play. He was the ultimate all-round midfielder, he could play anywhere, such an intelligent footballer. He lacked pace, but it didn’t effect his game or his team’s game, he wasn’t dynamic in terms of running with the ball, but he was so tidy with the ball at his feet he could wriggle away from tight spaces or pressure by another player and his vision, game intelligence and technique in terms of passing, touch, striking etc. was unreal. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
relámpago blanco Posted August 19, 2022 Share Posted August 19, 2022 59 minutes ago, SUPERTOON said: Tbh, I don't think Eddie would say otherwise unless we'd agreed a fee and it was just down to details Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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