The Prophet Posted February 26 Share Posted February 26 11 minutes ago, Keegans Export said: So they gave them back four points on the basis that Everton's calculations were just a mistake, rather than intentionally inaccurate and that they didn't consider relevant precedents when handing out the punishment? Doesn't bode well for their second charge imo. It seems that the findings of FFP breaches weren't wrong, just that the punishment was too severe. Kind of always been the case. Everton have admitted wrongdoing, it's just the Premier League are all over the show as a supposed regulator. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
timeEd32 Posted February 26 Share Posted February 26 So presumably they end up with something similar again (ie another 6 points)? That would currently put them 18th on 19 points, one behind Luton. But if Forest get similar then they'd be 18th. Going to be messy at the bottom. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronson333 Posted February 26 Share Posted February 26 So is six points the maxmium fine due to over spending? If so, we should go on a spending spree in the summer and take the hit. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keegans Export Posted February 26 Share Posted February 26 5 minutes ago, timeEd32 said: So presumably they end up with something similar again (ie another 6 points)? That would currently put them 18th on 19 points, one behind Luton. But if Forest get similar then they'd be 18th. Going to be messy at the bottom. Surely there's a chance we end the season without knowing who is going to be relegated? They haven't confirmed any punishments for Everton (2nd) & Forest yet and they'd both have the right to appeal - the season will be over in less than three months! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Prophet Posted February 26 Share Posted February 26 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Ronson333 said: So is six points the maxmium fine due to over spending? If so, we should go on a spending spree in the summer and take the hit. Based on the EFL reference, it might depend on the size of the breach. Everton were what, £19 million over? Edited February 26 by The Prophet Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
timeEd32 Posted February 26 Share Posted February 26 2 minutes ago, Keegans Export said: Surely there's a chance we end the season without knowing who is going to be relegated? They haven't confirmed any punishments for Everton (2nd) & Forest yet and they'd both have the right to appeal - the season will be over in less than three months! I imagine the PL wants to avoid that scenario at all costs. Relegating someone after the fact would be a disaster. Now that the appeal is done I'd think they'll use that as a benchmark to quickly announce Everton's 2nd and Forest's punishments. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RodneyCisse Posted February 26 Share Posted February 26 3 hours ago, Ronson333 said: So is six points the maxmium fine due to over spending? If so, we should go on a spending spree in the summer and take the hit. Some might think about doing this now, then just go down the route of “oh, sorry officer” Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infatuation Junkie Posted February 26 Share Posted February 26 2 minutes ago, RodneyCisse said: Some might think about doing this now, then just go down the route of “oh, sorry officer” They will make another rule up depending on the team an how they are getting on. man city. Small fine of few mill. 6 point deduction if they are 7 points ahead. newcastle 20 point deduction and transfer freeze for 5 years. Cos they are cunts Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotty66 Posted February 26 Share Posted February 26 But surely the bar has now been set. If we did it and got fined 10 points we could just appeal and use this example and get it reduced to six which is what Everton have done using the 10 points deduction from the EFL rules. There's absolutely no chance a club can do the same as Everton and get a bigger points deduction and not win an appeal is there? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonas Posted February 26 Share Posted February 26 (edited) It could end up like when Swindon get double-demoted. Finding out in the middle of a world cup who has gone down, stayed up, won the league, gone up, made the play-offs and qualified for Europe. Edited February 26 by Jonas Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keegans Export Posted February 26 Share Posted February 26 18 minutes ago, Scotty66 said: But surely the bar has now been set. If we did it and got fined 10 points we could just appeal and use this example and get it reduced to six which is what Everton have done using the 10 points deduction from the EFL rules. There's absolutely no chance a club can do the same as Everton and get a bigger points deduction and not win an appeal is there? The 10 points was at least partly based on the amount they were over the limit though wasn't it? So if we went £500m over we'd get a much larger (initial) punishment than 10pts, even if it was then reduced on appeal. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Prophet Posted February 26 Share Posted February 26 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbandit Posted February 26 Share Posted February 26 Just have to find a £110m buyer for Caicedo, can’t be too hard Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloydianMag Posted February 26 Share Posted February 26 22 minutes ago, Scotty66 said: But surely the bar has now been set. If we did it and got fined 10 points we could just appeal and use this example and get it reduced to six which is what Everton have done using the 10 points deduction from the EFL rules. There's absolutely no chance a club can do the same as Everton and get a bigger points deduction and not win an appeal is there? The solution is not to break the rules, it’s to get rid of the rules!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ikri Posted February 26 Share Posted February 26 Everton are still likely fucked. Even if they stay up this season they're being sued by the clubs that were relegated in the last couple of seasons whilst they were overspending. They may survive in the league only to owe tens of millions to rival clubs. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dokko Posted February 26 Share Posted February 26 32 minutes ago, ikri said: Everton are still likely fucked. Even if they stay up this season they're being sued by the clubs that were relegated in the last couple of seasons whilst they were overspending. They may survive in the league only to owe tens of millions to rival clubs. Wonder if the payouts would be classed under ffp? If so, doubly fucked. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ikri Posted February 26 Share Posted February 26 14 minutes ago, Dokko said: Wonder if the payouts would be classed under ffp? If so, doubly fucked. Presumably. West Ham agreed to pay Sheffield United £15m back in 2009 when they went to court over their relegation. 15 years later I would expect that figure to double, maybe more. With 4 or 5 clubs involved as well they could be looking at having to pay out hundreds of millions. For Everton, that wouldn't just be them screwed under FFP for a few years, it would be administration and the complete collapse of the club. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pata Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 Think it would be extremely harsh if Everton got another deduction this season. Surely it should be moved to next season and they should be fine after that if they can still stay up. Deducting points twice during one season for offences done on separate seasons just doesn't sit right with me. And if they want to keep FFP a thing, IMO these charges should be decided during the summer before the season with a fixed schedule and if the league misses the cutoff date they automatically get moved to the next season. Everton and Forest have no idea where they stand and we are in March soon ffs. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abacus Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 I agree that it would be extremely harsh to punish Everton twice this season, and that the way this whole thing is being handled is shambolic just for sporting reasons if nothing else. From what I understand (and please correct me if I'm wrong), a large part of the problem stems from interest costs on debt for building their new stadium. You'd have initially assumed that this would be outside of FFP as it relates to spending on infrastructure, but no. I mean, as well as other spending and COVID losses etc. Either way, they had owners who were prepared to invest in the playing squad, albeit badly. It now looks like they have been driven to sell to new owners in 777 who are struggling to pass the tests, with the whole thing being dragged out again by the PL. Whatever the intent of FFP, to maintain club solvency supposedly, it's had the complete opposite effect. Whatever you think about individual owners, their source of wealth etc, surely now nobody with ambition would invest in a club outside of a certain few with the intent to establish them as a major club again, as the rules are so heavily stacked against this. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keegans Export Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 I have limited sympathy for Everton really. The PL brought in the rule about punishment/deductions being decided within the following accounting period this season, which is why Everton may get hit with deductions this season for the previous accounting period (along with Forest) and the one before that (the -6pts that has been confirmed). However, if the rule had been in place last season, they would have been deducted 6pts in 22/23 and been relegated. You could argue that if the double points deduction sees them relegated this season then it's the same result just a season late. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjohnson Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 Well too bad. Its about time Everton were relegated...they've become the mackemesq turd that just won't flush. They've broke rules...admittedly due to circumstances not entirely in their control. But if the league genuinely think ffp is so important then its time to enforce it properly. Its hamstrung us as we're so afraid of any breaches that will almost inevitably prevent us being able to challenge in the short to mid term, so if we're abiding by them then it should be the same for any other club. No doubt Chelsea and Man City will tie the league up for years with lawyers and escape, but everyone knows that they've spent more than they should have. See you in 2034 when the pl might show some backbone and inflict punishment on them Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wallace Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 This season’s points deduction should have happened last season but didn’t due to the protracted process of their hearing and if had done then Everton would have been relegated. They made changes this season so that these breaches are addressed more promptly hence this possible second points deduction hanging over them. They got lucky last season and now have plenty of time to win enough games to safely avoid relegation even if they get a further points deduction. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 If the league won't hit Everton twice in the same season, then surely Forest can't be done either? You cant punish one club for breaking rules during one time period but delay the punishment for the other. The current setup of FFP stinks, Forest possibly losing points because they waited for a better selling price. Surely the FFP windows need align with transfer windows. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloydianMag Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 3 minutes ago, Adam said: If the league won't hit Everton twice in the same season, then surely Forest can't be done either? You cant punish one club for breaking rules during one time period but delay the punishment for the other. The current setup of FFP stinks, Forest possibly losing points because they waited for a better selling price. Surely the FFP windows need align with transfer windows. FFP and FMV stink and should go. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gallowgate Toon Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 Unbelievable but utterly unsurprising how much of a mess this is. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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