NUFC Transfer Rumours

[Optimistic Nut]

14 minutes ago, macphisto said:

Agreed, not necessarily saying Bowen but one or two players like Burn and Trippier, arguably our two best pound-for-pound transfers under PIF. Players with top level experience bought for the here and now.

 

Definitely a market there for one or two experienced players who just don't "fit" at another club where we'd get 2-3 years of service. A very high risk market to operate but shouldn't be quickly discounted.

 

It's important to try and keep the 4-5 players happy who we have who could get moves to the Sky 5. Signing young prospects is good, but we still need top current players. 

[The College Dropout]

5 minutes ago, The Larch said:

It looked to me like we were pushing for a more technical style last season.

 

We used to hit them on the break and throw in a speculative ball for someone to run onto, or at the edge of their box we'd do the trips/miggy/bruno triangle thing followed by a whip into the box. This season we've consistently seen a much slower build up, usually followed by a pass back to our defence.

 

In terms of how we've played...its either a feast or a famine at the back, with loads of us behind the ball absorbing pressure until we concede (as opposed to the previous front foot), or we're caught napping and have half the opposition team running at our defence with little to no cover from midfield.

You don't sign Anthony Elanga or Yoan Wissa or even Rasmey with the intention of moving to a slower more possession style. There's no way.

 

We still hit speculative balls into space - see Osula header against Brighton was it? We do it regularly. Give it Bruno or Tonali and they'll just put it in behind and someone will go chase.

 

I was a massive Almiron critic. But he liked to layt it off and move aggresively and quickly into space for Bruno or Trippier to find him. Neither Elanga or Murphy have that movement and we don't have prime Trippier to find a pass.

 

Teams now know how to disrupt our build up. They know Pope will shank it into the stands or dangerously under a bit of pressure. We don't have Trippier, Schar or Botman finding great passes through the lines or over the top. Tino is limited, Thiaw is a limited passer, Hall dribbles more than he breaks lines with passes at the moment. So yeh it's going to be a more urgid buildup. Add to that teams know to block passing lanes into Bruno - none of the other midfielders have a regular cute pass in them. Essentially we are a known entity now.

 

That;s partially why we looked so good with Miley at FB. We had disribution from RB that we had not seen since prime Trippier days. Him and Bruno linked up so well and could find a winger or attacker in a bit of space. 

 

There's very little for Bruno to play with these days.

 

IMO Howe's system is personnel-dependent going forward. Those combinations are natural and not taught/coached imo. See Schar to Joelinton pass straight through a team. If one of those doesn't play - we don't attempt that move. It's a player with some strikers instinct in movement and another that can see and execute a pass from distance- nothing to do with Howe's coaching.

[The College Dropout]

I was advocating heavily for Akliouche last summer. If we signed him I would think aye, we are trying to play a bit more football, someone that is meant to spot a pass. When we signed Elanga - it was an indication of more of the same.

 

I also thought Woltemade was a sign we wanted to play more. Maybe play with a 10 or 2 up top at times, play through the lines a bit more. Turns out that was entirely wrong. Zero intention of that. Would rather play Osula who fits the actual direct style of play.

 

And everything Howe says - indicates it. Doesn't want possession for the sake of it. ANd Longstaff's comments have haunted me all year. He made it sound like we barely train on the ball. Which would go a long way to explaining why we look clueless in possession. It's not intentionally slow. The players just don't know what to do. Sideways sideways sideways, no movement.

I actually think that's why Tonali sometimes struggles. He doesn't know what he's meant to do or where he's meant to run. Funnily enough Bruce players adapted better to Howe because they were used to attacking on the fly - the press was a new dimension for them. Willock, Almiron, Joelinton, Wilson, even Longstaff - their movement in the Howe attack works a lot better than the new guys. Elanga - doesn't know where to run, where to stand, when to go deep, when to go long.

[kingxlnc]

Hear me out

 

Honestly think Sancho would be worth a punt

 

He's free, only 25 years old, and Howe is perfect for his development and to put an arm around him etc. 

 

Not saying he is a Gordon replacement but has the pedigree and for a two year deal it's worth to see if he can get anywhere near his Dortmund form. Away from the limelight it could be possible?

[GeordieDazzler]

Bissouma released from Spurs too, wonder where he’ll end up 

[Optimistic Nut]

Sancho - Villa

Bissouma - Palace or Fulham 

 

 

[Nucasol]

1 minute ago, kingxlnc said:

Hear me out

 

Honestly think Sancho would be worth a punt

 

He's free, only 25 years old, and Howe is perfect for his development and to put an arm around him etc. 

 

Not saying he is a Gordon replacement but has the pedigree and for a two year deal it's worth to see if he can get anywhere near his Dortmund form. Away from the limelight it could be possible?

Fucking hell no. Let him go back to Germany and tear it up in the Bundesfarmer. He’s had multiple bites to get it right at three different clubs and failed dismally. 

[Ben]

I dont think we'll sign anyone over the age of 24 no matter who they are, we have more than enough older players in the team 

[AyeDubbleYoo]

4 minutes ago, Optimistic Nut said:

Sancho - Villa

Bissouma - Palace or Fulham 

 

Bissouma might not get a taker in the PL TBH, he's been awful. Maybe a promoted club. 

[The Larch]

38 minutes ago, The College Dropout said:

You don't sign Anthony Elanga or Yoan Wissa or even Rasmey with the intention of moving to a slower more possession style. There's no way.

 

We still hit speculative balls into space - see Osula header against Brighton was it? We do it regularly. Give it Bruno or Tonali and they'll just put it in behind and someone will go chase.

 

I was a massive Almiron critic. But he liked to layt it off and move aggresively and quickly into space for Bruno or Trippier to find him. Neither Elanga or Murphy have that movement and we don't have prime Trippier to find a pass.

 

Teams now know how to disrupt our build up. They know Pope will shank it into the stands or dangerously under a bit of pressure. We don't have Trippier, Schar or Botman finding great passes through the lines or over the top. Tino is limited, Thiaw is a limited passer, Hall dribbles more than he breaks lines with passes at the moment. So yeh it's going to be a more urgid buildup. Add to that teams know to block passing lanes into Bruno - none of the other midfielders have a regular cute pass in them. Essentially we are a known entity now.

 

That;s partially why we looked so good with Miley at FB. We had disribution from RB that we had not seen since prime Trippier days. Him and Bruno linked up so well and could find a winger or attacker in a bit of space. 

 

There's very little for Bruno to play with these days.

 

IMO Howe's system is personnel-dependent going forward. Those combinations are natural and not taught/coached imo. See Schar to Joelinton pass straight through a team. If one of those doesn't play - we don't attempt that move. It's a player with some strikers instinct in movement and another that can see and execute a pass from distance- nothing to do with Howe's coaching.

You're right about not signing wissa/elanga for possession, but I'd argue that you would for Ramsey and you definitely would for woltemade.

 

Like I said, i hope you're right about wanting to play his usual brand of football, but i think we're transitioning to a more possession based style because as you say, we've been found out.

 

Maybe Eddie was just hedging his bets and going for different types of player so he could mix it up depending on the opposition.  Incredibly difficult to do that well though.

[TheInfiniteOdyssey]

34 minutes ago, Ben said:

I dont think we'll sign anyone over the age of 24 no matter who they are, we have more than enough older players in the team 

It does seem like that's the way we're going, judging by the transfer links and reporting so far. 

[The College Dropout]

1 hour ago, The Larch said:

You're right about not signing wissa/elanga for possession, but I'd argue that you would for Ramsey and you definitely would for woltemade.

 

Like I said, i hope you're right about wanting to play his usual brand of football, but i think we're transitioning to a more possession based style because as you say, we've been found out.

 

Maybe Eddie was just hedging his bets and going for different types of player so he could mix it up depending on the opposition.  Incredibly difficult to do that well though.

Ramsey best games come with transition when pressed. Doesn't find cute or penetrative passes from deep but can play a killer ball in transition. He still works best in a direct team.

Woltemade I agree but ht doesn't fit the system which sums it up.

[TRon]

2 hours ago, The College Dropout said:

I was advocating heavily for Akliouche last summer. If we signed him I would think aye, we are trying to play a bit more football, someone that is meant to spot a pass. When we signed Elanga - it was an indication of more of the same.

 

I also thought Woltemade was a sign we wanted to play more. Maybe play with a 10 or 2 up top at times, play through the lines a bit more. Turns out that was entirely wrong. Zero intention of that. Would rather play Osula who fits the actual direct style of play.

 

And everything Howe says - indicates it. Doesn't want possession for the sake of it. ANd Longstaff's comments have haunted me all year. He made it sound like we barely train on the ball. Which would go a long way to explaining why we look clueless in possession. It's not intentionally slow. The players just don't know what to do. Sideways sideways sideways, no movement.

I actually think that's why Tonali sometimes struggles. He doesn't know what he's meant to do or where he's meant to run. Funnily enough Bruce players adapted better to Howe because they were used to attacking on the fly - the press was a new dimension for them. Willock, Almiron, Joelinton, Wilson, even Longstaff - their movement in the Howe attack works a lot better than the new guys. Elanga - doesn't know where to run, where to stand, when to go deep, when to go long.

 

Pretty much why I am still on the fence about Howe staying for next season. I still can't see how buying young technical players will fit into the system he's used for the past couple of years. He'll have to change how we play, or buy better versions of Elangas/Wissas etc.

 

But who knows. Maybe he's already planning on revamping our style next season and he is confident he can work with different type of forwards. I guess we'll find out. 

[Optimistic Nut]

1 hour ago, TheInfiniteOdyssey said:

It does seem like that's the way we're going, judging by the transfer links and reporting so far. 

 

One of the problems with holding on the the likes of Murphy, Burn & Schar a season or two too long, I guess? 

[The Prophet]

Do we expect things to go quiet until teams begin to exit the World Cup?

[TheInfiniteOdyssey]

2 minutes ago, Optimistic Nut said:

 

One of the problems with holding on the the likes of Murphy, Burn & Schar a season or two too long, I guess? 

Yeah probably. I think people underestimate how difficult it is to shift these players on as well tbh. Not that I would want to see Burn and Schar go at this point in time.

[Ben]

7 minutes ago, The Prophet said:

Do we expect things to go quiet until teams begin to exit the World Cup?

 

It looks like the stadiums are going to be empty so there will be plenty of space for Scouts and Directors of Football to get deals done 

[Optimistic Nut]

7 minutes ago, TheInfiniteOdyssey said:

Yeah probably. I think people underestimate how difficult it is to shift these players on as well tbh. Not that I would want to see Burn and Schar go at this point in time.

 

I also think PSR is causing some of it. Cheaper to keep tagging a year or two on their contracts even if we'd prefer not to, than it is to release and spend £20-30m on an upgrade. 

 

 

Edited 3 hours ago by Optimistic Nut

[TRon]

34 minutes ago, The Prophet said:

Do we expect things to go quiet until teams begin to exit the World Cup?

 

 

I'm assuming the only reason we aren't invoking the release clause for Munoz is that we are pretty confident he's coming here and we can negotiate the price down. 

[Doops]

2 hours ago, kingxlnc said:

Hear me out

 

Honestly think Sancho would be worth a punt

 

He's free, only 25 years old, and Howe is perfect for his development and to put an arm around him etc. 

 

Not saying he is a Gordon replacement but has the pedigree and for a two year deal it's worth to see if he can get anywhere near his Dortmund form. Away from the limelight it could be possible?

If you think this then you have never really watched him properly. He has all the intensity of a slug. He is a flat track bully

[The Prophet]

7 minutes ago, TRon said:

 

 

I'm assuming the only reason we aren't invoking the release clause for Munoz is that we are pretty confident he's coming here and we can negotiate the price down. 

 

Potentially. Could also be...

 

We aren't in for him.

 

He has multiple suitors and/or he's hoping a decent World Cup will get him a bigger move.

[wong989]

2 hours ago, kingxlnc said:

Hear me out

 

Honestly think Sancho would be worth a punt

 

He's free, only 25 years old, and Howe is perfect for his development and to put an arm around him etc. 

 

Not saying he is a Gordon replacement but has the pedigree and for a two year deal it's worth to see if he can get anywhere near his Dortmund form. Away from the limelight it could be possible?

No, it’s bad enough we’ve made the likes of Wissa near enough a top earner for one good year at Brentford after which he went on strike same as Isak. Got what we deserved for that. Sancho has shown exactly who and what he is. Hes premier league disproven, and a dickhead whats more

[J7]

4 hours ago, nufcjmc said:

Wissa has been "fit" since Jan and despite no preseason we know preseason prep isn't 4 or 5  months long. 

 

I dont think signing older players should be an instant no but with current financial restrictions in place Bowen is 30 at the end of the year he's not wissa and has done amazing at his current club.

 

Would this translate elsewhere?

How big of a fee would they demand is there if no relegation clause?

If we signed him and got 4 years out of him and he left on a free Would that be financially wise or viable?

 

I can see why the club would be cautious about any older player. I have said this before no signing is a gaurentee slam dunk its all about mitigation and risk signing players with no resale value adds to that risk.

I’m not defending Wissa to be fair. I think his lack of fitness was a disgrace, another thing I wouldn’t expect from Bowen, but I see no comparison in potentially signing him. 

[nufcjmc]

27 minutes ago, J7 said:

I’m not defending Wissa to be fair. I think his lack of fitness was a disgrace, another thing I wouldn’t expect from Bowen, but I see no comparison in potentially signing him. 

You can't compare them its 2 different players only thing they share is they are older in footballing terms and are attackers.

 

Point still stands wissa had 19 non pen goals in the league before coming to us. Plenty of players have been excellent elsewhere and a transfer for some reason hasn't worked.

 

The rest of my point stands the club cant afford to take big risks when he's older, not going to come cheap, isn't gaurenteed to work here and is a write off in terms of resale even if he does work.

 

So while I dont have an issue with it mixed in with young raw potential I can see why the club wouldnt be jumping at the chance.

 

Our older players so far prior to wissa were 12m burn, 12m trips and 10m pope all of which are a much small fee to simply "write off" if we need to for what they brought. 

 

We all know should bowen move unless there is a relegation clause it won't be for that.

 

 

Edited 1 hour ago by nufcjmc

[black_n_white]

3 hours ago, The Prophet said:

Do we expect things to go quiet until teams begin to exit the World Cup?

I can’t imagine there will be much activity until until after the tournament