Newcastle United 0-2 West Ham United (25/11/24)

[Kid Icarus]

25 minutes ago, Smal said:

 

we have created 0.54 xG per 90 for Isak this season vs 0.81 last season. That's a huge drop off. 

 

Do you mean Isak's xG is lower, or that there's a specific 'created for...' metric? Just that xG on its own doesn't really cover how chances come about.

 

 

We've had 3 matches now where we've massively underperformed our xG. As I've said Isak can excuse himself because he has hit some form, but Gordon’s has been shocking and both of their decision making hasn't been great either. Harvey Barnes, the player who seems to get the most flack, is the only one really upholding his end of the bargain as an impact sub.

[Big River]

Bowen was a different class. it'd be nice having someone like him in our team.

 

fkn Murphy man

[Kid Icarus]

2 hours ago, Shak said:

Surely it's natural for people to look for problems that we can address, though?

 

I'm not sure what you can do other than hope Isak starts putting them away. There's no other option to take his place, realistically.

 

Definite argument to be made that Barnes could start ahead of Gordon given how wasteful the latter has been in front of goal this season.

100%, it's natural to examine everything and that's what the forum's for. It just feels a bit can't see the wood for the trees to really get down to every possible problem we might have but kind of skip what to me seems to be the most glaring problem we have.

 

As great as he's still been, Isak's had 4 or 5 "I cannot believe he's missed that" moments this season and that sentence has basically defined Gordon’s.

 

I get that you can't over rely on players, but all of your front 3 having the same issue and Barnes seemingly only being useful from the bench is a real problem that needs addressing before even thinking about anything else imo.

 

I think we've seen how when we do put chances away all of our other perceived issues melt away.

 

 

Edited 1 hour ago by Kid Icarus

[TRon]

12 minutes ago, Sempiternal said:

Yeah I thought they were fucking awful. Though Wan Bisaka’s finish was class. And Bowen is a lovely player to watch 

 

I missed the first half in fairness, but West Ham didn't look awful in the second. They were trying to pass their way through us with some aggressive intent, reminded me a bit of Fulham. Bowen was definitely causing us some problems, and as soon as I saw Soucek in the line up I was nervous he'd score. One of those pain in the arse players a bit like Antonio.

[Sempiternal]

Just now, TRon said:

 

I missed the first half in fairness, but West Ham didn't look awful in the second. They were trying to pass their way through us with some aggressive intent, reminded me a bit of Fulham. Bowen was definitely causing us some problems, and as soon as I saw Soucek in the line up I was nervous he'd score. One of those pain in the arse players a bit like Antonio.

It’s obvious to say but the first goal really killed us. They just had something to hang onto. I thought we were bad second half rather than anything they did, but agree Bowen is great. 

[Kid Icarus]

2 hours ago, Lush Vlad said:

Isak should have scored the left footed chance, granted. Gordon missed a snap shot that fell to him because a West Ham player decided to put it on a plate for him. Still should be scoring, but his finishing has been crap all season. 
 

We had 2 shots on target all night and outside of that and some decent early runs from Isak. We were wasteful and didn’t create decent chances. We’ve basically created one really good chance all night. The Isak half volley.  
 

We always look like that in the final third. All a bit slow and clueless. Probably why people are complaining as it isn’t like Fabianski has had a MOTM performance or we were regularly creating. It was the Brighton game all over again. Chances to score. But overall a big lack of quality in and around the box. 

 

2 shots on target all night is the point, we can't finish and aren't making the right decisions. Maybe I just see it differently but in those moments the creation/pressing stage is complete and it's about decision making and finishing.

 

Isak half volley, Gordon straight at the 'keeper/skied it/skewed wide, Willock missing from the edge of the area, even Hall in the 2nd half. I agree that it was Brighton allover again, we can't keep being wasteful, expect the chances to keep coming and rely on the opposition not taking their own chances.

[Lush Vlad]

I thought Bowen was a passenger first half. Totally different 2nd half. Even more so after we went 4-4-2. 

[joeyt]

I thought Soler and Paqueta just completely ran the midfield second half

[Smal]

yeah, as soon as we went to a midfield 2 of Tonali and Bruno without the use of his hip it was over. They are visibly a very bad team with poor players and coaching but they still had all the control.

 

Was proper embarrassing and enraging to watch in equal measure

[Lush Vlad]

Just now, Kid Icarus said:

 

2 shots on target all night is the point, we can't finish and aren't making the right decisions. Maybe I just see it differently but in those moments the creation/pressing stage is complete and it's about decision making and finishing.

 

Isak half volley, Gordon straight at the 'keeper/skied it/skewed wide, Willock missing from the edge of the area, even Hall in the 2nd half. I agree that it was Brighton allover again, we can't keep being wasteful, expect the chances to keep coming and rely on the opposition not taking their own chances.

But I feel it is a bit of both here. We are not regularly creating enough good chances IMO. Both games mentioned, Gordon and Isak should score, I agree. But time and again we get in good areas and are so wasteful. The passing and creativity around the edge of the box is so often lacking. We’re really static and don’t have that player to unlock defences. The skied chances and the Willock chance you reference are not really ones you expect to see go in I don’t think. They happen at both ends of the pitch every week. That feels like you’re now just listing shots that we’ve had to strengthen your argument. 
 

I get that it is fine margins and games are tight at the top level. But our gameplan is too dependent on your last point. We are too reliant on nicking a goal from somewhere and winning by the odd goal on the basis the opposition miss their chances. We rarely score early goals this season and all. Which really nullifies our gameplan. Especially if we concede first like

last night.
 

Bar Forest, Wolves and Bournemouth. We have also finished a lot of games tamely after running out of ideas. Weirdly those 3 were away games. 

 

We don’t create enough decent quality chances in games is the point I was originally making. Hence why our scoring record is so poor. I don’t think it is just purely down to us pinpointing say 2-3 good chances a week. Other teams fans would say the same every week, I’m sure. They’re not all going to go in and I don’t think I come away from games thinking we’ve been robbed or should have scored a lot more (less than 0 would be a good start)  

[alexf]

Willock and Longstaff were anonymous first half. But the decision to bring Barnes on, move Joelinton back into a midfield 3 that has been proven not to work and then moving Gordon into number 10 all massively back fired. 

 

We score first then we win comfortably I think but as soon as they got that soft goal I feared the worst. However 2nd half was a car crash and that was probably on Howe. None of his changes worked. 

[TRon]

8 minutes ago, Lush Vlad said:

But I feel it is a bit of both here. We are not regularly creating enough good chances IMO. Both games mentioned, Gordon and Isak should score, I agree. But time and again we get in good areas and are so wasteful. The passing and creativity around the edge of the box is so often lacking. We’re really static and don’t have that player to unlock defences. The skied chances and the Willock chance you reference are not really ones you expect to see go in I don’t think. They happen at both ends of the pitch every week. That feels like you’re now just listing shots that we’ve had to strengthen your argument. 
 

I get that it is fine margins and games are tight at the top level. But our gameplan is too dependent on your last point. We are too reliant on nicking a goal from somewhere and winning by the odd goal on the basis the opposition miss their chances. We rarely score early goals this season and all. Which really nullifies our gameplan. Especially if we concede first like

last night.
 

Bar Forest, Wolves and Bournemouth. We have also finished a lot of games tamely after running out of ideas. Weirdly those 3 were away games. 

 

We don’t create enough decent quality chances in games is the point I was originally making. Hence why our scoring record is so poor. I don’t think it is just purely down to us pinpointing say 2-3 good chances a week. Other teams fans would say the same every week, I’m sure. They’re not all going to go in and I don’t think I come away from games thinking we’ve been robbed or should have scored a lot more (less than 0 would be a good start)  

 

The co commentators mentioned our poor quality of delivery as well. I realise that they aren't always good judges of a game but it's been pretty apparent anyway. Our football is not great this season. In our CL qualifying season we were playing consistently better and more impressive football, and that was with a less expensive squad.

[BlueStar]

Apparently there were two West Ham podcasters/influencers/YouTubers/wankers whatever they're called filming for their channel at the front of the Leazes stand, giving it large (in exaggerated influencer style) after their goals and then turning around to glower at people for ruining their shots when they kept getting pinged on the back of the head with the rubber bands from the ISAK display flags or called names.  Not sure if anyone's seen anything about that or knows what channel it was, I'm sure it'll be very selectively edited though to make them look less wet.

[Cf]

Overall whilst we can't really argue with the result we could have easily got something from that game. I don't think it was an end of the world performance though the second half was a bit alarming. 

 

Thoughts on some players:

 

Kelly: One to forget and whilst ok in parts makes me look forward to getting Burn back.

 

Hall: Superb. He's basically first name on the team sheet at the moment. 

 

Livramento: I really like him but when he gets forward I can't help but wish he was Trippier instead. Really needs to work on that side of his game. 

 

Longstaff: Obviously brings something to the team but a clear drop in quality compared to the players around him. 

 

Gordon: Performed above par last season and below par this season so the drop is quite noticeable. Needs to sort himself out. Having Murphy on instead at the end doesn't reflect well on him.