merlin

This is an excellent summing-up of what is wrong...well said.

This HAS to be a wind-up - MON is streets ahead of Allardyce. Expand? Has won a trophy with a small club(Leicester) and got them into the Prem ; won Promotion at Wycombe ,took Celtic to final of major Euro comp on a limited budget , took over at Villa on eve of last season(no time to make many signings, club taken over just as NUFC were this time)and steadied a rocking ship - went through a poor patch in mid-season, BUT - unlike Allardyce - they got a fair number of draws, not defeats.. Has arguably made Villa the surprise team of this season and they play good attacking football but with a decent defence..I cannot see NUFC doing the same next year under Sam esp if they spend the same amount of money that O'Neill did this time...

i agree with that, but you can say that about any player, the more chances they get, the more they'll score, his conversion rate is just too low imo What is Torres conversion rate? Not saying Martins is better because he clearly isn't but Torres misses a lot of chances, the thing is he gets himself in the positions and with the chances created he will score. good point, i have to admit i dont have stats, but i watch martins more than i watch torres, seems torres cant quite lace up his shooting boots away from home but he looks deadly at anfield, torres is much the classier player though, excellent close control which means he can use his pace to go past people like they aren't there, martins just doesnt have that talent Spot On..

N'Zogbia is NOT a LB, and if you think he's doing OK there, you obviously missed the Chelsea game.... Enrique should have played more than he has - we do not have the luxury of buying 6m players and 'grooming' them for the future at this time.

Its how 'occasional' the skill appears that is the problem - erratic, just as NUFC have very often been in the past - we need to get away from inconsistency...

Let's ignore all the glaring deficiencies in his game too, eh? 23. Same age as Adebayor, Tevez and Torres then. Who are all much better players.....

This HAS to be a wind-up - MON is streets ahead of Allardyce.

IF are getting to the stage where relegation might be a threat, I would bring in George Graham until the season's end - he would certainly sort out the defence enough to get us enough points to survive.. Graham has the ability to do this with a club like NUFC OVER A SHORT PERIOD... Fans wouldn't like it(boring 1-0 wins, 0-0 draws etc), but needs must - relegation would be the ultimate disaster for this club... IF Allardyce is fired, a short-term appointment with top class experience is the best way until we can take a wider choice in Summer.

So yes then Yes what? They're down there because they can't win games. So because we're s*** they'll all turn into Brazil 1970? Just yes that there seems to be complacency that we arent capable of being dragged into it That is exactly the point - we ARE capable of being dragged into it - Wigan's point at Anfield illustrates just what can happen...don't forget, Wigan & Derby have new managers and there is always a honeymoon period when this happens,,also, in the case of Jewell, I reckon that had he come in earlier, they could have improved enough to make a realistic attempt at escape. I said on this site yesterday that we would be lucky to get 3 points out of games with Man U(twice), L'Pool away, Arsenal away , Villa away and Everton away - with Chelsea also to visit SJP...that leaves 11 games to secure another 14 points which would put us on 43 - an acceptable safety margin... We have a home game against Boro, and if they play as they did against Arsenal, we will get a point at best...after results during the first part of the season against largely mediocre opposition and the performances of late, can ANYONE put their house on the club NOT being threatened with relegation.?? If we lose at Stoke, Allardyce has either to be fired OR be given full backing in the transfer market - there is no middle way now and as I said before, its a really tough call for Mort & Ashley...if they let it drag on in limbo as we are now, then there could be real problems later in the season and I hope it doesn't come to that because this team are NOT equipped for a relegation scrap...

Spot on - a waste of 10m quid - what would we get for him now, I wonder..?? He has been well-sussed by Prem sides after his first season - they know that if you keep tight on him, he runs into blind alleys.

True, and lest we forget, a TOP manager gets the best out of players at the club and IMPROVES THEM - isn't that what O'Neill has done with Villa's Centre Backs ? OK, they signed Davies, and he's starting to look the business, but there were plenty on this site who didn't rate him as a prospect when he was at WBA.. If Allardyce is the genius some are suggesting, he should be improving our CBs, not just chopping & changing them - after all, he WAS a CB himself, whereas O'Neill was a midfielder so even less excuse.. Also, as for stating that Allardyce has come all the way from the Irish League to Europe, what the hell difference does that make ? He has ONLY managed ONE club in the top 2 Divisions and they were basically a small club by modern standards..past history needs to be examined in depth before assuming great things of people, and his successes have all been based on workrate primarily - this will NEVER succeed at the top level if it isn't accompanied by a large helping of skills and originality.. Allardyce is 54 next birthday and has NO TROPHIES as a manager - given his 5 year plan, he will presumably be retiring without winning one...

And what bogey-man exactly does this idiot thinks is lurking the corridors of SJP , despite the fact that Shepherd & Co(AND Shearer) have gone..?? Mystic Meg, perhaps...? A Gypsy Curse(actually, McDermott DOES think the club is cursed.)? The only thing lurking around SJP is the stench of the years of failure and bad management , not to say some suspicious dealings - all these things could be changed by a genuinely-TOP manager and I am not convinced that Allardyce and his multitudes are that - but never mind - its easier to blame the 'impatient & vicious' fans who have the temerity to want some silverware in the trophy cabinet after already getting some 39 years ago..imagine - how greedy they are....!!! Incidentally, the Great And Untouchable Fergie was actually COMPLAINING about his own supporters yesterday because they were 'too quiet'...OH YEAH? Who was it blasting Newcastle fans for being too vocal and 'demanding'.... Cake and Eat it, anyone !??

I'm now thinking between 12th and 14th, that's simply not good enough. Does anybody think Allardyce should be here next season if we finish as low as 12th? No, I don't Mick - you can't justify this however you try and as for doing better against the top sides, how have we performed this season against Liverpool and Pompey at SJP..?? OK, we got a 'fighting' draw against Arsenal, but does anyone think we will do the same to Man U(twice),Arsenal(Away), Villa(away)and Liverpool(away)?? And I haven't even mentioned Everton(away) or Spurs(away - vastly different proposition under Ramos since we beat them earlier this season).. From those 7 games, I will be surprised if we get more than 3 points, so that leaves another 14 points to get from 12 games if we want 43 points........

Most of the dead wood was going anyway before Allardyce arrived. Also, we didn't beat Everton comfortably, it was 1-1 until the last 5 minutes. As for being a few points off the top 6, we're just as close to the bottom 6. If we've got a better manager and a better squad depth, why are we doing exactly the same position wise as last year when we had a s**** manager? We're currently 1 point better off than last year after the same number of games and we've got a harder 2nd half to the season, at the rate we're going Allardyce is in danger of doing less in a full season than Roeder. Agree with all that Mick - as it happens, I DIDN'T have anything against Allardyce when he arrived as I hoped he would adapt to working at a bigger club and bring some much-needed professionalism, but I have been disappointed. I am NOT convinced by either his tactics/selections OR his unnecessarily-large back-room staff ; the coaching looks decidedly-suspect and I can see no evidence of these so-called 'cutting edge' scientific methods improving the players ; his relationship with the fans has never been great and is deteriorating rapidly because they KNOW he views them with contempt , just as many of THEM feel likewise about him (and in case you say I'm 'speaking for myself' again, Coach HTT, try reading the blog responses in other NUFC sites or the Press - there are at least 50% of the fans unconvinced by either the man or his methods and that is up to HIM to put right - no amount of grandstanding on his behalf from the likes of his mate Fergie etc is going to change the supporters' minds - the need to see it working ON THE PITCH.) As I have said before, I doubt he will get fired unless we REALLY start going into freefall, but Billy Furious is entitled to his opinion - he may or may not have had an agenda before Allardyce was appointed, but I certainly didn't and I suspect that around 70% of fans were prepared to give him a chance..many of those have changed their minds and unless there is a rapid improvement those supporting him will be a definite minority by May.

Happy New Year to all from W.Australia - here's to some sensible team selections for 2008....

He played all of last season out of position and still managed 10 goals. He's very promising indeed, but I don't think he is ready for international football yet. Being too modest about the lad there, Brummie - he's a very good young player with pace & skill, so deserves his chance ; one of the best prospects in English Football in my opinion.. Only one problem - there are some on this site who would STILL want to keep Martins even if Villa offered us Agbonhalor in exchange....unbelievable as I know it sounds(don't suppose you WOULD like a swap, Brummie...!!??).

This is spot-on ; a totally stupid article written by a person who knows sweet FA about Football..- Oh, wait a minute - its a sports journalist ; that explains EVERYTHING..!!!!

This is correct - Shepherd's interference in transfer policy, PLUS(and this is probably the major issue) his handling of SBR and the manner of his sacking, were the major reasons why the club became a poisoned chalice for prosective managers. It WAS always that before SJH took over in 1992 - the likes of Joe Royle and Howard Kendall wouldn't touch us with a barge-pole, but the club could have got almost anyone after KK resigned in 1997, and would still have been able to if SBR had replaced him then and stayed for, say, 5 years. All the rest is in place - support, stadium, money(prior to Souness & Shepherd's last forays) - which other club outside of Man U Arsenal & Liverpool had such a lot going for it in 1997..?? I disagree about Dalglish, though - he was SACKED, didn't resign ; FS fired him after 2 games in 98-99, neither of which we lost - this was because he and Fletcher had fallen out. Don't forget some of the players he signed - Nobby, Hamman, Given - all still playing 10 years later...

Saw their game with L/Pool on Fox today(recorded last night). They were largely outplayed by the Scousers but battled grimly for a point ; if they perform similarly at SJP I reckon it will be a tough job to get 3 points. Dunne and Richards were very strong at the back.. An early goal for Newcastle is the best hope of winning (so they have to come out), but if they get in front this Newcastle side will find it hard to get past them.

I agree, and do those who are happy to wait 5 years(for what, incidentally ? Top 4, Europe, WHAT ?), do you really think clubs like Villa, City & Everton are going to sit around waiting for NUFC to fulfill their 5 year plan and take their places in the Top 5(or whatever it is by then)? Absolutely NOT... We are already behind schedule in any sensible person's judgment because we are losing games to relegation-threatened teams - by any stretch, we should be able to beat these sides and at least give the Top 4 a real battle at SJP, even if we lose.. By year 2 we should be able to reasonably expect a Top 7 finish(KK got us to 3rd in his first Prem season of 93/94 WITHOUT too much spending..) By Year 3, a challenge for Top 5, and a good run in the FA Cup By Year 4, European Football AND a challenge for top 4 By Year 5, Top 4/5 status and a realistic shot at the CL... So come on - WHAT exactly does everyone else view as progress for a club with the support of NUFC with a billionaire as owner..? As Jaehyun said, Stalin also had 5 Year plans - I suppose the Moskvitch was the result of one of these..!

The biggest problem with firing the manager is the media and Football Insiders' reaction - the media are just waiting for another opportunity to criticize the club/fans and the Football Mafia would attempt to close ranks to 'protect their own'... They would try to ensure we didn't get a decent replacement by bad-mouthing us at every opportunity - they would rather we were relegated than fired Allardyce and appointed someone who may make a difference to the club more rapidly than is currently the case.... That is why the current situation is so serious - unless the side start winning games that they SHOULD be winning, we could end up in serious trouble ; people are laughing at the thought of relegation, but if we get beaten in the games we have against the Top 4, that points gap could easily be eroded by a decent run from teams like Wigan or even the Mackems...nothing is certain in football, esp with NUFC..!! As people have said, we are NOT expecting Top 4 football or results, but the performances so far have been below an acceptable standard for a club with any ambition whatsoever - as to all the theories about off-field scientific improvements, well, there doesn't seem to be any sign that these are making the players better in any respect...there doesn't seem to be any increase in fitness etc. It is starting to look like a case of Bull----t baffling brains........ I reckon most people see the sense in being able to re-assess the situation in May(when the media will have other things on their minds and the club can act in a calmer atmosphere), but the big question will be whether we have the luxury of that - it will be too late if we get to March and find that the slump has continued and we are being dragged into the relegation struggle.... That is why I think Ashley & Mort have a really tough quandary to sort out....

I'm obviously not questioning the man-management abilities of those mentioned, not at all. In that respect, I doubt there's few in the modern game who come even close. But the game itself has evolved, and more so the last 10 years than before, is what I think anyway. You can get quite far by playing it simple, but tactics play such a huge part in it, and the tactics being used by the managers previously mentioned would've been torn apart by the likes of Wenger and Mourinho. There's always a counter to any given tactical factor, and the very best managers of today all have something in common; they exploit the weaknesses and counter the other teams tactics. Which is why they are so successful. Anyway, it's a sidetrack really. I'm obviously at the deep end here, seeing as I've never actually had an opportunity to see the teams of Clough, Shankly et al. And I'm not saying they were no good. There's just alot more to it now than motivation and brow-beating players. And I still maintain it's too hard to compare, even for managers. Not to mention fruitless, seeing as we'll never have an answer to it anyway. I see the point you are trying to make, but I still disagree - Clough, Shankly and Revie etc were NOT just about standing up in the Dressing Room and screaming at players in an attempt to motivate them - in fact, they hardly EVER resorted to those sort of tactics, and I think you'll find that it was Man U players of fairly recent vintage who termed a rocket from Alex Ferguson 'The Hairdryer Treatment', and I'm sure you don;t consider Ferguson to be inferior to Mourinho & Wenger..... I DID have the good fortune(although as a NUFC fan it wasn't always pretty!)to see these guys' teams in action, and I can assure you that they DID use different approaches to different games - Leeds-Liverpool games were always tight affairs, even though L/Pool used to try to steamroller teams at Anfield ; they realised that Leeds were too clever for that, and had to use a more measured approach , esp at Elland Road - Clough's teams were always built from the back(think Colin Todd & Roy McFarland at Derby), but always had wingers who could be withdrawn into midfield to shore it up when necessary. Motivation was important, but it wasn't the only tool in their box - as you say, though, we'll never be able to prove the theory - sadly...

Load of garbage in the NOTW article - as usual. Ashley doesn't HAVE to sack all the backroom staff - he can get rid of the manager & two coaches ; this should be enough to satisfy any incoming replacement who will want his close cronies with him and most usually only have one or two. The other 18(goodness knows what THEY all do) should remain at the club and have targets as to their positions e.g. the Scouts have to find at least x no of decent youngsters/prospective signings per year, and these must be approved by the incoming manager.. if not, then they will have failed to meet the terms of their contracts and should be fired WITHOUT the usual ridiculous compensation. Does anyone on this site have the security of knowing that if they mess up at work, they will get a 3-year pay-off...!?? What makes Football management so special that THEY have to be feather-bedded in this way? They should receive a MAX of 1 years' Salary , no more unless they happen to be unfortunate like Houllier and have heart attack etc.

Agreed. Seconded.