Dave Posted April 12, 2009 Share Posted April 12, 2009 Jonas = (movement + willingness to take the ball) = good. Nolan was the forward-most of the starting three yesterday and Jonas effectively replaced him rather than Guthrie. What a difference it made. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gallowgate Toon Posted April 12, 2009 Share Posted April 12, 2009 Just took it to Stoke, which is what we needed some endeavour, whether it was a tactical decision to run at tired legs which i doubt because Stoke are probably the fittest side in the league or it was just a rest, he proved when he came on he is vital. I'm looking forward to seeing what Al does with him tbh, hope he makes him play in this higher free role more often because we just need that creativity. Our midfield yesterday was just so lacking in anything and Stoke found that far too easy because it played straight into their hands getting numbers behind the ball and closing our options. I wonder if we'd have done better had Jonas started, but he must play every game from now on. A midfield of him, Barton, Guthrie and whoever else is a thousand times better than what we have at the minute, and i'm looking forward to the day they play together. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
toonpete1892 Posted April 12, 2009 Share Posted April 12, 2009 He made a very large impact yesterday as he helped wake up a pretty quiet midefiled. We stopped playing the long balls that were easily picked up by their bully back 4 but started to run at them from midfield. Instead of 2 defenders challenging shola for a long ball, we had 2 defenders closing the runner which helped create room for the rest of the team to run into - we even started using the the wings as outlets! He may not have put balls into the box but he opened the game up yesterday and helped to generate not only pressure but chances. His performance yesterday was summed up when he switched a pin-point ball from the right wing across the the left and was suddenly there to offer himself for the easy return ball. Even when he didn't receive the ball, he redirected his run and was automatically unmarked in a new position. The forward momentum he helped to generate (even if it doesnt work half the time) is something that will give us a fighting chance of staying up! Whether this would work for the full 90 mins is anyones guess but its definately an option we can't shy away from. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thespence Posted April 12, 2009 Share Posted April 12, 2009 Would we have got the same impact if Jonas had started? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robster Posted April 12, 2009 Share Posted April 12, 2009 Would we have got the same impact if Jonas had started? I think I said in another thread that I thought Shearer used him especially to have a greater impact as a sub. I think he would have had the shit kicked out of him had he started. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Snrub Posted April 12, 2009 Share Posted April 12, 2009 Was very impressive when he came on yesterday. Was very direct, made some good runs and always wanted to make things happen. Still can't cross for shite, though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronaldo Posted April 12, 2009 Share Posted April 12, 2009 disgusts me that he's been benched in favour of the likes of Duff and Nolan this season. Clear bias towards reputations tbh, hope Shearer puts it right Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Heneage Posted April 12, 2009 Share Posted April 12, 2009 disgusts me that he's been benched in favour of the likes of Duff and Nolan this season. Clear bias towards reputations tbh, hope Shearer puts it right Nah yesterday Shearer hit the nail on the head, he used him as an impact sub. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronaldo Posted April 12, 2009 Share Posted April 12, 2009 disgusts me that he's been benched in favour of the likes of Duff and Nolan this season. Clear bias towards reputations tbh, hope Shearer puts it right Nah yesterday Shearer hit the nail on the head, he used him as an impact sub. yeah, after we'd not threatened once all game, genius, he clearly got it wrong man Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Heneage Posted April 12, 2009 Share Posted April 12, 2009 disgusts me that he's been benched in favour of the likes of Duff and Nolan this season. Clear bias towards reputations tbh, hope Shearer puts it right Nah yesterday Shearer hit the nail on the head, he used him as an impact sub. yeah, after we'd not threatened once all game, genius, he clearly got it wrong man Right, when Jonas was on how much was he kicked and battered ? You put him on from the start, and you'll have a crocked player after 20 minutes. Jonas doesn't take the physical game well, it was the right decision, if it wasn't for his poor decision to start Carroll over Shola we would have won. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slim Posted April 12, 2009 Share Posted April 12, 2009 disgusts me that he's been benched in favour of the likes of Duff and Nolan this season. Clear bias towards reputations tbh, hope Shearer puts it right Nah yesterday Shearer hit the nail on the head, he used him as an impact sub. yeah, after we'd not threatened once all game, genius, he clearly got it wrong man Right, when Jonas was on how much was he kicked and battered ? You put him on from the start, and you'll have a crocked player after 20 minutes. Jonas doesn't take the physical game well, it was the right decision, if it wasn't for his poor decision to start Carroll over Shola we would have won. The best managers LEARN from their mistakes..lets see Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cubaricho Posted April 12, 2009 Share Posted April 12, 2009 disgusts me that he's been benched in favour of the likes of Duff and Nolan this season. Clear bias towards reputations tbh, hope Shearer puts it right Nah yesterday Shearer hit the nail on the head, he used him as an impact sub. yeah, after we'd not threatened once all game, genius, he clearly got it wrong man Right, when Jonas was on how much was he kicked and battered ? You put him on from the start, and you'll have a crocked player after 20 minutes. Jonas doesn't take the physical game well, it was the right decision, if it wasn't for his poor decision to start Carroll over Shola we would have won. The best managers LEARN from their mistakes..lets see That's if you think Shearer made a "mistake" by not starting Jonas. He clearly was using him as an "impact" sub and it worked great. Let the workhorses like Duff, Nolan, Guthrie run the defence tired and then let Jonas who has a bit of real pace come on and run at them some more when they are already tired. Jonas would have not been as effective had he started yesterday. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sicsfingeredmong Posted April 13, 2009 Share Posted April 13, 2009 disgusts me that he's been benched in favour of the likes of Duff and Nolan this season. Clear bias towards reputations tbh, hope Shearer puts it right Nah yesterday Shearer hit the nail on the head, he used him as an impact sub. yeah, after we'd not threatened once all game, genius, he clearly got it wrong man Right, when Jonas was on how much was he kicked and battered ? You put him on from the start, and you'll have a crocked player after 20 minutes. Jonas doesn't take the physical game well, it was the right decision, if it wasn't for his poor decision to start Carroll over Shola we would have won. The best managers LEARN from their mistakes..lets see That's if you think Shearer made a "mistake" by not starting Jonas. He clearly was using him as an "impact" sub and it worked great. Let the workhorses like Duff, Nolan, Guthrie run the defence tired and then let Jonas who has a bit of real pace come on and run at them some more when they are already tired. Jonas would have not been as effective had he started yesterday. That 'impact sub' role you speak of was best suited to a youngster - in Lua Lua - now on loan. Through poor squad management, the same player has been inadvertently placed in the shop window under the proviso that he impresses during his 1st team spell down the season's stretch. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skirge Posted April 13, 2009 Share Posted April 13, 2009 MUST START EVERY GAME !! HAS TO JUST HAS TO!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gallowgate Toon Posted April 13, 2009 Share Posted April 13, 2009 Seriously doubt he was an impact sub, Stoke are arguably the fittest side in the league. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
themanupstairs Posted April 13, 2009 Share Posted April 13, 2009 Clearly an impact substitution. No doubt in my mind. Jonas was warming up all game long before coming on. Smith was the other impact sub we had ready in case we took the lead and brought him on to protect it. After singing his praises, and going on about needing to feed Owen with a steady supply of chances, surely Shearer meant to throw Jonas on when he did, and when some Stoke players were already on yellows/tiring etc.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gallowgate Toon Posted April 13, 2009 Share Posted April 13, 2009 I think we would have done better if he'd started tbh we looked very devoid of ideas, he must start, and i think he'll play better because he'll be playing higher up the field instead of covering every blade of grass. Him, Barton and Guthrie is a mouth watering prospect considering the current crop. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sicko2ndbest Posted April 13, 2009 Share Posted April 13, 2009 Ideal as an impact player, however we do not have good enough alternatives to start in place of him Has to start either behind the front 2 or on the left Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gallowgate Toon Posted April 13, 2009 Share Posted April 13, 2009 Ideal as an impact player, however we do not have good enough alternatives to start in place of him Has to start either behind the front 2 or on the left Disagree, showing against Man U proves that he's best as a starter. Something has obviously happened to Jonas since we saw him against them, he's either been trying to do too much or being told to play in a way that doesn't suit him etc. Obvious to me that we've not being seeing the 'real' Jonas for some time, but he's still played well for Argentina and it doesn't seem a coincidence to me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jayson Posted April 13, 2009 Share Posted April 13, 2009 Said before, Argentina suits him more. He has ability dont get me wrong, but for Argentina he doesnt have to do it all himself. He can go past a player and tap it to another lad who can go past 1 or 2.... Makes it far easier for him. For us he has to go past 2, run down the line...look to find players that arent even attempting to move into space or try to cross the ball before the two lads that were marking him get back to cover. Already a fair test of ability....add into that having to track back endlessly to help our defence and the lads probably shattered after a half hour let alone to be doing it all himself again the rest of the game as much as he can. So in that way he probably is just trying to do to much for us as the other players rely on him more when hes on. Just knock it to jonas and expect him to do a bursting run with it everytime. Most of our midfielders seriously fail at making runs towards the box without the ball...or any kind of runs atall to help out. He can still be great for us if he starts though, the other players just have to work more with him. Enrique especially when hes fit. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronaldo Posted April 13, 2009 Share Posted April 13, 2009 disgusts me that he's been benched in favour of the likes of Duff and Nolan this season. Clear bias towards reputations tbh, hope Shearer puts it right Nah yesterday Shearer hit the nail on the head, he used him as an impact sub. yeah, after we'd not threatened once all game, genius, he clearly got it wrong man Right, when Jonas was on how much was he kicked and battered ? You put him on from the start, and you'll have a crocked player after 20 minutes. Jonas doesn't take the physical game well, it was the right decision, if it wasn't for his poor decision to start Carroll over Shola we would have won. mate, by the time Jonas came on we couldn't have really complained if we were 2 or 3-0 down. In my book, that makes his exclusion a mistake. A 3-5-2 formation is perfect for him to be honest, cant understand at all why he wasn't started Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorJ_01 Posted April 13, 2009 Share Posted April 13, 2009 It's bloody annoying not knowing whether he was dropped or an impact sub or whatever. But surely Shearer has to see he is a key player! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmojorisin75 Posted April 14, 2009 Share Posted April 14, 2009 Said before, Argentina suits him more. He has ability dont get me wrong, but for Argentina he doesnt have to do it all himself. He can go past a player and tap it to another lad who can go past 1 or 2.... Makes it far easier for him. For us he has to go past 2, run down the line...look to find players that arent even attempting to move into space or try to cross the ball before the two lads that were marking him get back to cover. Already a fair test of ability....add into that having to track back endlessly to help our defence and the lads probably shattered after a half hour let alone to be doing it all himself again the rest of the game as much as he can. So in that way he probably is just trying to do to much for us as the other players rely on him more when hes on. Just knock it to jonas and expect him to do a bursting run with it everytime. Most of our midfielders seriously fail at making runs towards the box without the ball...or any kind of runs atall to help out. He can still be great for us if he starts though, the other players just have to work more with him. Enrique especially when hes fit. a lot of that is fair imo - he can beat a man or two with his eyes closed but he's not a natural crosser of the ball, however if he was playing in a team with a midfield containing more movement than a shop front full of mannequins i think he's more than capable of getting his head up and dropping a little pass into space and causing damage as long as he plays with duff, nolan & butt he's not getting that movement owen in the hole + jonas could work though Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
QBG Posted April 14, 2009 Share Posted April 14, 2009 Said before, Argentina suits him more. He has ability dont get me wrong, but for Argentina he doesnt have to do it all himself. He can go past a player and tap it to another lad who can go past 1 or 2.... Makes it far easier for him. For us he has to go past 2, run down the line...look to find players that arent even attempting to move into space or try to cross the ball before the two lads that were marking him get back to cover. Already a fair test of ability....add into that having to track back endlessly to help our defence and the lads probably shattered after a half hour let alone to be doing it all himself again the rest of the game as much as he can. So in that way he probably is just trying to do to much for us as the other players rely on him more when hes on. Just knock it to jonas and expect him to do a bursting run with it everytime. Most of our midfielders seriously fail at making runs towards the box without the ball...or any kind of runs atall to help out. He can still be great for us if he starts though, the other players just have to work more with him. Enrique especially when hes fit. a lot of that is fair imo - he can beat a man or two with his eyes closed but he's not a natural crosser of the ball, however if he was playing in a team with a midfield containing more movement than a shop front full of mannequins i think he's more than capable of getting his head up and dropping a little pass into space and causing damage as long as he plays with duff, nolan & butt he's not getting that movement owen in the hole + jonas could work though A bit unfair on Duff, who I thought did ok on Saturday, I remember the movement of him and N'Zogbia tearing apart Everton at their place in the 2-2 game. I agree though, ideally with everyone fit I'd play a midfield of Jonas, Barton, Guthrie and Duff. However, in the situation that we're in I think we should play Jonas in the hole to get the best out of him. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted April 14, 2009 Share Posted April 14, 2009 I'd love to think that Shearer kept him back on purpose against Stoke, but I just think he made an error. Jonas should start, the stats probably say his 'end product' isn't great but the difference he makes to our team is huge. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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