Dave Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 He's not suing NUFC, he's suing the current owners of NUFC. Take them for as much as you can, KK. Re-read the very first sentence again mate. Why worry about Ashley taking a hit? If he runs the club into the ground, it's his loss. Someone will buy it eventually and run it properly. He's suing the corporate entity that is NUFC, not the individual Mike Ashley. Whatever settlement is reached will come from club funds, or do you really think Ashley will reach for his personal checkbook to pick up the tab? Wasn't favorable towards Keegan before and I certainly have no love for him now. I'd like to see people still argue that he "loves the club" when he seems willing to take a few million quid from our coffers when we're desperate for cash in January. but if he has been wronged be should stand up for himself (like he seems to be doing) regardless of his love for the club. I agree, he has the right. I would too if I was in his position I guess. Just saying that this should blow out of the water any idea that he ever held the club above his own financial benefit or pride. He's no Geordie Messiah, just another manager that's come and failed. (I'm talking about the second time around, not the first, so lets not get into that argument.) i'll bet if any of us were a contractor employed by the club and we got done over we'd have it up in court if need be. Most of us aren't swimming in money like Keegan is though. (Assuming he hasn't actually run himself to ground over the Soccer Circus like some have claimed) As if that makes a difference. I'd be very interested in hearing how it doesn't. Never heard of principles then? They're quite old, and I image they outdate the concept of money. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liam Liam Liam O Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Hope Keegan loses. The club is more important than him. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Hope Keegan loses. The club is more important than him. i just hope the truth comes out Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Hope Keegan loses. The club is more important than him. I hope whoever is in the wrong loses. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cronky Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 It could be difficult for Keegan to prove that a player was signed without his consent. Unless his signature is required, it may be a matter of one person's word against the other's. In Xisco's case, he actually met the player beforehand, so his grounds there may be a bit flimsy. That only leaves Gonzalez, who of course was a loan signing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldtype Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 He's not suing NUFC, he's suing the current owners of NUFC. Take them for as much as you can, KK. Re-read the very first sentence again mate. Why worry about Ashley taking a hit? If he runs the club into the ground, it's his loss. Someone will buy it eventually and run it properly. He's suing the corporate entity that is NUFC, not the individual Mike Ashley. Whatever settlement is reached will come from club funds, or do you really think Ashley will reach for his personal checkbook to pick up the tab? Wasn't favorable towards Keegan before and I certainly have no love for him now. I'd like to see people still argue that he "loves the club" when he seems willing to take a few million quid from our coffers when we're desperate for cash in January. but if he has been wronged be should stand up for himself (like he seems to be doing) regardless of his love for the club. I agree, he has the right. I would too if I was in his position I guess. Just saying that this should blow out of the water any idea that he ever held the club above his own financial benefit or pride. He's no Geordie Messiah, just another manager that's come and failed. (I'm talking about the second time around, not the first, so lets not get into that argument.) i'll bet if any of us were a contractor employed by the club and we got done over we'd have it up in court if need be. Most of us aren't swimming in money like Keegan is though. (Assuming he hasn't actually run himself to ground over the Soccer Circus like some have claimed) As if that makes a difference. I'd be very interested in hearing how it doesn't. Never heard of principles then? They're quite old, and I image they outdate money. When did I say what KK is doing is morally wrong? I'm just saying that this should put to bed any fantasies about him sacrificing his personal welfare out of his "love for the club." By the way Dave, the fact that consciously limit your arguments to pithy one line jabs doesn't make you any better than the rest of us rabble Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thespence Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Hope Keegan loses. The club is more important than him. I hope KK gets his loot like SBR did in the end. Hate seeing the club win legal shit, as most times when the cunts go to court I often think they are in the wrong. Was glad when they lost to the taxman. Was gutted when they beat the fans in S.O.S case. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Hope Keegan loses. The club is more important than him. I hope KK gets his loot like SBR did in the end. Hate seeing the club win legal s***, as most times when the c***s go to court I often think they are in the wrong. Was glad when they lost to the taxman. Was gutted when they beat the fans in S.O.S case. instead of hoping those ways why not hope that whoever is in the right wins their case ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnypd Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Hope Keegan loses. The club is more important than him. yeah we need the £8m, that works out at around 3 years worth of transfers under the ashley regime. the best solution would be a settlement out of court, avoiding airing our dirty laundry in public or being liable to the full amount. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robster Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 It could be difficult for Keegan to prove that a player was signed without his consent. Unless his signature is required, it may be a matter of one person's word against the other's. In Xisco's case, he actually met the player beforehand, so his grounds there may be a bit flimsy. That only leaves Gonzalez, who of course was a loan signing. I dont believe Keegan would begin legal action based on the argument being his word against the rest. He must have something solid. Honestly, I dont what to make of this news. Its more bad PR for the club which is disappointing Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitman Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Surely if he has a case then the club was at fault and he has every right to formally pursue it. Agreed. People's views on this will be coloured by whether they think he was forced out or "bottled" it. Personally I believe he was misled from the outset re transfers and his position was made untenable. I think he has every right to sue the club in that case and I don't think any the less of him for it, I would do exactly the same in his shoes. He is not stealing from the fans' pocket - Ashley owns the club not us - and this should not affect transfer funds one jot (I'm cynical over whether any money will be spent one way or another anyway). I wish it wasn't happening but the responsibility lies with Ashley imo. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 He's not suing NUFC, he's suing the current owners of NUFC. Take them for as much as you can, KK. Re-read the very first sentence again mate. Why worry about Ashley taking a hit? If he runs the club into the ground, it's his loss. Someone will buy it eventually and run it properly. He's suing the corporate entity that is NUFC, not the individual Mike Ashley. Whatever settlement is reached will come from club funds, or do you really think Ashley will reach for his personal checkbook to pick up the tab? Wasn't favorable towards Keegan before and I certainly have no love for him now. I'd like to see people still argue that he "loves the club" when he seems willing to take a few million quid from our coffers when we're desperate for cash in January. but if he has been wronged be should stand up for himself (like he seems to be doing) regardless of his love for the club. I agree, he has the right. I would too if I was in his position I guess. Just saying that this should blow out of the water any idea that he ever held the club above his own financial benefit or pride. He's no Geordie Messiah, just another manager that's come and failed. (I'm talking about the second time around, not the first, so lets not get into that argument.) i'll bet if any of us were a contractor employed by the club and we got done over we'd have it up in court if need be. Most of us aren't swimming in money like Keegan is though. (Assuming he hasn't actually run himself to ground over the Soccer Circus like some have claimed) As if that makes a difference. I'd be very interested in hearing how it doesn't. Never heard of principles then? They're quite old, and I image they outdate money. When did I say what KK is doing is morally wrong? I'm just saying that this should put to bed any fantasies about him sacrificing his personal welfare out of his "love for the club." Only daft people would have argued that, I'm sure. Strong ties to the club or otherwise, nobody is going to accept being shit on if they believe that's what happened. It doesn't matter whether they're already loaded or not. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liam Liam Liam O Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Hope Keegan loses. The club is more important than him. I hope KK gets his loot like SBR did in the end. Hate seeing the club win legal shit, as most times when the cunts go to court I often think they are in the wrong. Was glad when they lost to the taxman. Was gutted when they beat the fans in S.O.S case. That there is astounding tbh Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Surely if he has a case then the club was at fault and he has every right to formally pursue it. Agreed. People's views on this will be coloured by whether he was forced out or "bottled" it. Personally I believe he was misled from the outset re transfers and his position was made untenable. I think he has every right to sue the club in that case and I don't think any the less of him for it, I would do exactly the same in his shoes. He is not stealing from the fans' pocket - Ashley owns the club not us - and this should not affect transfer funds one jot (I'm cynical over whether any money will be spent one way or another anyway). I wish it wasn't happening but the responsibility lies with Ashley imo. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thespence Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Hope Keegan loses. The club is more important than him. I hope KK gets his loot like SBR did in the end. Hate seeing the club win legal s***, as most times when the c***s go to court I often think they are in the wrong. Was glad when they lost to the taxman. Was gutted when they beat the fans in S.O.S case. That there is astounding tbh Why? I don't think football clubs should claim VAT back on agents fee's. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Surely if he has a case then the club was at fault and he has every right to formally pursue it. Agreed. People's views on this will be coloured by whether they think he was forced out or "bottled" it. Personally I believe he was misled from the outset re transfers and his position was made untenable. I think he has every right to sue the club in that case and I don't think any the less of him for it, I would do exactly the same in his shoes. He is not stealing from the fans' pocket - Ashley owns the club not us - and this should not affect transfer funds one jot (I'm cynical over whether any money will be spent one way or another anyway). I wish it wasn't happening but the responsibility lies with Ashley imo. if the case is found against keegan then the responsibility was with keegan. also any monies leaving the club could well affect any future transfer expenditure. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
OzzieMandias Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Wasn't there supposed to be some clause in his contract whereby the club paid him £2 million if they sacked him, and he paid the club £2 million if he walked... I understood it as Ashley looking to deter Keegan from doing a runner, as he was already known to be prone to do. I reckon this might basically be a countering tactic by Keegan. He could simply be trying to get out of a £2 million liability. If that's true, and if he has enough of a case to cause the club problems, I reckon it'll get settled out of court. He may also have timed it for the moment when Ashley, unable to sell the club, is looking to sort things out with the supporters, figuring that Ashley can't afford to be seen anymore as the Bad Guy, and thus may pull his legal punches. The sentimentality of our supporters thus works in KK's favour. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Wasn't there supposed to be some clause in his contract whereby the club paid him £2 million if they sacked him, and he paid the club £2 million if he walked... I understood it as Ashley looking to deter Keegan from doing a runner, as he was already known to be prone to do. I reckon this might basically be a countering tactic by Keegan. He could simply be trying to get out of a £2 million liability. If that's true, and if he has enough of a case to cause the club problems, I reckon it'll get settled out of court. He may also have timed it for the moment when Ashley, unable to sell the club, is looking to sort things out with the supporters, figuring that Ashley can't afford to be seen anymore as the Bad Guy, and thus may pull his legal punches. The sentimentality of our supporters thus works in KK's favour. on the other hand if ashley thinks he could pin the blame on keegan in court ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robster Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Wasn't there supposed to be some clause in his contract whereby the club paid him £2 million if they sacked him, and he paid the club £2 million if he walked... I understood it as Ashley looking to deter Keegan from doing a runner, as he was already known to be prone to do. I reckon this might basically be a countering tactic by Keegan. He could simply be trying to get out of a £2 million liability. If that's true, and if he has enough of a case to cause the club problems, I reckon it'll get settled out of court. He may also have timed it for the moment when Ashley, unable to sell the club, is looking to sort things out with the supporters, figuring that Ashley can't afford to be seen anymore as the Bad Guy, and thus may pull his legal punches. The sentimentality of our supporters thus works in KK's favour. So he has been waiting all this time, just on the off chance that the club might not get sold and Ashley might have to get back in the good books of the fans. Thats some gamble on Keegans part Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liam Liam Liam O Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Hope Keegan loses. The club is more important than him. I hope KK gets his loot like SBR did in the end. Hate seeing the club win legal s***, as most times when the c***s go to court I often think they are in the wrong. Was glad when they lost to the taxman. Was gutted when they beat the fans in S.O.S case. That there is astounding tbh Why? I don't think football clubs should claim VAT back on agents fee's. Because that ultimately is our money. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitman Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Surely if he has a case then the club was at fault and he has every right to formally pursue it. Agreed. People's views on this will be coloured by whether they think he was forced out or "bottled" it. Personally I believe he was misled from the outset re transfers and his position was made untenable. I think he has every right to sue the club in that case and I don't think any the less of him for it, I would do exactly the same in his shoes. He is not stealing from the fans' pocket - Ashley owns the club not us - and this should not affect transfer funds one jot (I'm cynical over whether any money will be spent one way or another anyway). I wish it wasn't happening but the responsibility lies with Ashley imo. if the case is found against keegan then the responsibility was with keegan. also any monies leaving the club could well affect any future transfer expenditure. If the court decides against keegan then I'd reconsider. If his contract is paid up then he shouldn't have been constructively dismissed and he's entitled to it. In those circumstances the blame lies with Ashley and his minions not Keegan, and we'd have been better off getting 3 years of service out of him rather than forcing him out. Edit: nobody will take a wage cut to fund transfers btw, don't see how this is much different. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Surely if he has a case then the club was at fault and he has every right to formally pursue it. Agreed. People's views on this will be coloured by whether they think he was forced out or "bottled" it. Personally I believe he was misled from the outset re transfers and his position was made untenable. I think he has every right to sue the club in that case and I don't think any the less of him for it, I would do exactly the same in his shoes. He is not stealing from the fans' pocket - Ashley owns the club not us - and this should not affect transfer funds one jot (I'm cynical over whether any money will be spent one way or another anyway). I wish it wasn't happening but the responsibility lies with Ashley imo. if the case is found against keegan then the responsibility was with keegan. also any monies leaving the club could well affect any future transfer expenditure. If the court decides against keegan then I'd reconsider. If his contract is paid up then he shouldn't have been constructively dismissed and he's entitled to it. In those circumstances the blame lies with Ashley and his minions not Keegan, and we'd have been better off getting 3 years of service out of him rather than forcing him out. so instead of your posts being very pro-keegan shouldn't you be saying "wait till we see what comes out in court" Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitman Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Surely if he has a case then the club was at fault and he has every right to formally pursue it. Agreed. People's views on this will be coloured by whether they think he was forced out or "bottled" it. Personally I believe he was misled from the outset re transfers and his position was made untenable. I think he has every right to sue the club in that case and I don't think any the less of him for it, I would do exactly the same in his shoes. He is not stealing from the fans' pocket - Ashley owns the club not us - and this should not affect transfer funds one jot (I'm cynical over whether any money will be spent one way or another anyway). I wish it wasn't happening but the responsibility lies with Ashley imo. if the case is found against keegan then the responsibility was with keegan. also any monies leaving the club could well affect any future transfer expenditure. If the court decides against keegan then I'd reconsider. If his contract is paid up then he shouldn't have been constructively dismissed and he's entitled to it. In those circumstances the blame lies with Ashley and his minions not Keegan, and we'd have been better off getting 3 years of service out of him rather than forcing him out. so instead of your posts being very pro-keegan shouldn't you be saying "wait till we see what comes out in court" Not really. I believe Keegan's in the right here. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
OzzieMandias Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Wasn't there supposed to be some clause in his contract whereby the club paid him £2 million if they sacked him, and he paid the club £2 million if he walked... I understood it as Ashley looking to deter Keegan from doing a runner, as he was already known to be prone to do. I reckon this might basically be a countering tactic by Keegan. He could simply be trying to get out of a £2 million liability. If that's true, and if he has enough of a case to cause the club problems, I reckon it'll get settled out of court. He may also have timed it for the moment when Ashley, unable to sell the club, is looking to sort things out with the supporters, figuring that Ashley can't afford to be seen anymore as the Bad Guy, and thus may pull his legal punches. The sentimentality of our supporters thus works in KK's favour. on the other hand if ashley thinks he could pin the blame on keegan in court ? Who knows? It's Keegan who's brought the action, not Ashley. And whether it's deliberate or not, it's definitely bad timing from Ashley's point of view. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Surely if he has a case then the club was at fault and he has every right to formally pursue it. Agreed. People's views on this will be coloured by whether they think he was forced out or "bottled" it. Personally I believe he was misled from the outset re transfers and his position was made untenable. I think he has every right to sue the club in that case and I don't think any the less of him for it, I would do exactly the same in his shoes. He is not stealing from the fans' pocket - Ashley owns the club not us - and this should not affect transfer funds one jot (I'm cynical over whether any money will be spent one way or another anyway). I wish it wasn't happening but the responsibility lies with Ashley imo. if the case is found against keegan then the responsibility was with keegan. also any monies leaving the club could well affect any future transfer expenditure. If the court decides against keegan then I'd reconsider. If his contract is paid up then he shouldn't have been constructively dismissed and he's entitled to it. In those circumstances the blame lies with Ashley and his minions not Keegan, and we'd have been better off getting 3 years of service out of him rather than forcing him out. so instead of your posts being very pro-keegan shouldn't you be saying "wait till we see what comes out in court" Not really. I believe Keegan's in the right here. i believe we haven't got a clue what went on and for all it'll be ugly it's the only way to clear things up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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