Ronaldo Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 Against Italy and Uruguay we failed to attack as a team or defend as a team. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 I don't disagree about the gameplan. In hindsight, it simply didn't work. Gerrard wasn't suited for his role in particular. But even then, there were a few positives from the approach in contrast to previous tournaments. They showed enough at times to get results and didn't. England are out of this tournament because of errors from players that know better and lapses in concentration. With a little character, England have at least two points at this point, despite the squad and despite the gaps in Roy's 4-2-3-1. Just s*** themselves. Them's the fine lines of international football though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 Against Italy and Uruguay we failed to attack as a team or defend as a team. Agreed. Largely because it's a brand new team. Always thought it was a bad idea to suddenly go for youth at the WC finals. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cronky Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 Liverpool were given a lot of praise in the second half of the season, and it then seemed like 4-2-3-1 with Henderson and Sterling became the answer to England's problems as well. Over the years, I've seen several England managers succumb to that kind of bandwagon from the media and supporters. They're under a lot of pressure. Ultimately the biggest problem - and one that probably no amount of shuffling with formations or personnel could completely sort out - was our lack of defensive quality in the back four. That's been apparent for some time. We could have done better for sure, but we were always liable to get found out. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incognito Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 One thing Sven did which he doesn't get much credit for - was his concentration of youth. He kept most of the old-guard but largely on the bench. Brought in Gerrard, Cole, Heskey, Ferdinand as starters straight away. The team that lost to Germany was very different to the 5-1 team. They qualified for the tournament getting great experience. Out went some very good players too. Roy's kept Cole, Lampard & Gerrard. Then decided to ditch Cole for a 29 year-old at the last. Now, not all of this is Roy's fault. Obviously, the players aren't coming through at club level. Phil Jagielka ffs, it's a very difficult position. Keegan brought in Gerrard. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 One thing Sven did which he doesn't get much credit for - was his concentration of youth. He kept most of the old-guard but largely on the bench. Brought in Gerrard, Cole, Heskey, Ferdinand as starters straight away. The team that lost to Germany was very different to the 5-1 team. They qualified for the tournament getting great experience. Out went some very good players too. Roy's kept Cole, Lampard & Gerrard. Then decided to ditch Cole for a 29 year-old at the last. Now, not all of this is Roy's fault. Obviously, the players aren't coming through at club level. Phil Jagielka ffs, it's a very difficult position. Keegan brought in Gerrard. As a starter? I'm sure Gerrard spent a lot of his younger days injured. But Sven put Gerrard at the heart of the team. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incognito Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 One thing Sven did which he doesn't get much credit for - was his concentration of youth. He kept most of the old-guard but largely on the bench. Brought in Gerrard, Cole, Heskey, Ferdinand as starters straight away. The team that lost to Germany was very different to the 5-1 team. They qualified for the tournament getting great experience. Out went some very good players too. Roy's kept Cole, Lampard & Gerrard. Then decided to ditch Cole for a 29 year-old at the last. Now, not all of this is Roy's fault. Obviously, the players aren't coming through at club level. Phil Jagielka ffs, it's a very difficult position. Keegan brought in Gerrard. As a starter? I'm sure Gerrard spent a lot of his younger days injured. But Sven put Gerrard at the heart of the team. Yep. Played against Germany in Euro 2000. Edit: Sorry as a sub. Didnt fully read your post. But KK definitely introduced him to international football. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heron Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 Haven't really read the thread as of late but I assume everyone is kicking off saying how s*** we were / are? I for one think we haven't really let ourselves down that much. Most realists had England down to struggle to get out of the group due to conditions and quality of the opponents anyways. We've given a few youngsters a chance and maybe could have operated with different players, or players in different positions but the top and bottom of it is that our players like Gerrard and Rooney aren't in the same bracket as Pirlo and Suarez. The Costa Rica game is a good opportunity for the youngsters to really step it up and play with freedom. That freedom will be limited though because the media are desperate for us to lose so they can sell more papers. The media are as much the problem for England as anything. They build it up so we all buy the papers and once the team is back to it's high heights, with lots of support they (the team) come up short and the papers make millions as we all buy the s**** about how they were dreadful and had no heart. Got to stick with what we have for me, and Gerrard and the likes should retire. Let the youngsters learn of the likes off him at club level and make their own destiny for England. After all, we have won f*** all since '66... Roy Hodgson is a top bloke and dignified leader for me. Stick with him. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronaldo Posted June 23, 2014 Share Posted June 23, 2014 You people. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 23, 2014 Share Posted June 23, 2014 I think it's the fact he's English that's kept him in the job this time tbh. Yes there's potential, performances weren't too bad...but I reckon if that had been an overseas manager there'd have been a media clamber to force him out. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanshithispantz Posted June 23, 2014 Share Posted June 23, 2014 Probably the same 'realists' who've allowed Alan Pardew to still be managing Newcastle United mid way through 2014. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incognito Posted June 23, 2014 Share Posted June 23, 2014 I think it's the fact he's English that's kept him in the job this time tbh. Yes there's potential, performances weren't too bad...but I reckon if that had been an overseas manager there'd have been a media clamber to force him out. We're out despite not playing too bad though. There is a small sense of injustice, maybe not deserving of what has happened. We got through this stage 4 years ago playing far worse than this. Agree about press reaction to a foreign manager mind. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varadi Posted June 23, 2014 Share Posted June 23, 2014 Lampard in for Gerrard tomorrow, Barkley and Shaw to start: http://www.bbc.com/sport/0/football/27967383 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paully Posted June 23, 2014 Share Posted June 23, 2014 Mourinho will be the next England manager! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted June 23, 2014 Share Posted June 23, 2014 Lampard in for Gerrard tomorrow, Barkley and Shaw to start: http://www.bbc.com/sport/0/football/27967383 Should have just tried a side without Gerrard and Rooney IMO, not that it matters either way. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesse Pinkman Posted June 23, 2014 Share Posted June 23, 2014 I just don't think Roys the right man in the long term and I'll put good money on him going after 2016. We want to play fluid passing football with the onus being on the front foot, that's great but that's not a Roy Hodgson team, it's not the type of teams Roy has built his whole career. We are now starting to get attacking technical players slowly but surely breaking through but not a manger or the coaches to boot. So I suppose the million pound question is which English managers have a track record of building fluid attacking teams? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
loki679 Posted June 23, 2014 Share Posted June 23, 2014 I just don't think Roys the right man in the long term and I'll put good money on him going after 2016. We want to play fluid passing football with the onus being on the front foot, that's great but that's not a Roy Hodgson team, it's not the type of teams Roy has built his whole career. We are now starting to get attacking technical players slowly but surely breaking through but not a manger or the coaches to boot. So I suppose the million pound question is which English managers have a track record of building fluid attacking teams? Front foot attacking football? I can think of one.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan Posted June 23, 2014 Share Posted June 23, 2014 I just don't think Roys the right man in the long term and I'll put good money on him going after 2016. We want to play fluid passing football with the onus being on the front foot, that's great but that's not a Roy Hodgson team, it's not the type of teams Roy has built his whole career. We are now starting to get attacking technical players slowly but surely breaking through but not a manger or the coaches to boot. So I suppose the million pound question is which English managers have a track record of building fluid attacking teams? Front foot attacking football? I can think of one.... Only way we'll ever get rid of the cunt. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Duper Branko Strupar Posted June 23, 2014 Share Posted June 23, 2014 This has to be a Giggs, right? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted June 23, 2014 Share Posted June 23, 2014 Honestly, wouldn't a British manager do? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howaythetoon Posted June 23, 2014 Share Posted June 23, 2014 Whoever gave a shout out for Rafa, he would be a very good appointment for England. As for England, we need to make wholesale changes to our entire game if we are to ever succeed at this level and we need to start at the very root of the cause - kids' football. We then need to work our way up and into every layer of our game, from the football pyramid right to the Premier League itself. Fans also need to change, in fact the entire fabric of our game and culture needs to change. Kids' football - big pitches, big goals, an emphasis on power, strength, physicality, speed and over coaching. As Wenger said, the game is the best coach. Let kids play for the sheer joy and fun, let them develop their own game. Mams and dads - you mean well, but your kid doesn't need shouted at from the touchline or instructed on how to play. Let them enjoy themselves. Kevin Keegan, one of our nation's greatest ever players and one of NUFC's greatest ever manager's pretty much lays his whole football philosophy and his success at his dad's feet who turned up to watch KK play, but never tried to coach him or inhibit him. That's the way it needs to be. Encourage not discourage. Same applies to coaches. Also big pitches and big goals?! Smaller pitches, smaller goals all the way up until a player is 14. Also school football - its a joke these days, its far too competitive and too centred around the bigger lads. Fans on the stands - we all love a crunching tackle, but give me Colo over fucking Steven Taylor any day of the week. We all love to see our team's pour forward too, but patient possession football is a good thing too. Too many fans demand crunching tackles, players running around 'grafting' etc. and it is to the detriment of our game. Look at Ben Arfa... our manager doesn't pick him because he doesn't defend enough or work hard enough and a large percentage of fans would agree with him - the fucking idiots. The Premier League - I'd make it a rule that only 6 foreigners can feature in the starting 11. I'm not one of these anti-foreigner people, they have been the best thing to happen to our game, but our youngsters are simply not getting games and if they do and do well, they soon get snapped up by the bigger clubs and end up on the bench or out on loan, constantly in limbo. Its about developing our younger players and giving them the time to do so. Look at Daniel Sturridge - from Villa to Coventry to Man City to Bolton to Cheslea to Liverpool. Its a minor miracle he has made it into the top top player he has become and that's undoubtedly down to an outrageous talent more than anything else. Lesser talented players have no chance really. Unless we give them the chance, that is. Lallana and Lambert for example have proved themselves to be very good players, but both are coming towards the tail end of their careers and they have had to do it the bloody hard way. Who is to say if Liverpool had of given Lambert his chance, they would have had a 20 a season man for a decade or so?! Its too easy to not give a young kid a chance though. Demands of fans for big name players and instant success. Too much money from SKY etc. and the need to play catch up with others makes it damned hard for any youngster coming through unless they have instant world-class ability ala Wayne Rooney, Gazza et al. Its not just that though, look at our own Carroll. One big money move has fucked his career. Ha he stayed at NUFC as limited as I think he was or is, he would have went to this WC and maybe even started. He is now a journey man striker who will never be the player his early potential and promise showed. Too much too soon. Greed. Its rife in our game from clubs to players. There is so much wrong with our game really it needs ripped up and started over again. Ironically some of the good stuff that is happening is at conference level and lower down the league RE academies, coaching etc. For a nation as obsessed with football as our own, our success or lack of at international level is nothing short of embarrassing really. Unless we make major changes starting now, we will go a hundred years or so without winning a major honour. Uruguay, Costa Rica et al are better equipped for international football than we are and that says it all! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Posted June 23, 2014 Share Posted June 23, 2014 This has to be a Giggs, right? Jesus Christ. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Posted June 23, 2014 Share Posted June 23, 2014 @SamWallaceIndy 17m Hodgson announces team for Costa Rica: Foster Jones - Smalling - Cahill - Shaw Milner - Lampard - Wilshere Barkley - Sturridge - Lallana Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pixelphish Posted June 23, 2014 Share Posted June 23, 2014 Milner Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeyt Posted June 23, 2014 Share Posted June 23, 2014 No Sterling Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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