Why does it matter that Barry Moat doesn't have billions?

[Teasy]

I disagree. I think the post you made was a solid argument, but incorrect looking at context.

 

We needed stability 10 years ago, when billions weren't essential.

 

A well structured setup will enable you to improve, but the improvement will be limited.

 

It's a bit of a contradiction actually. Stability may be the way forward in the short term, baring in mind we're not currently even a Premier League side, but finance will be the only way to progress once we hopefully return there.

 

I think this is true. I worry that without significant investment the best we can hope to be is a yo-yo club.

 

I'd feel more comfortable if I knew a few more positive things about Moat and his vision/plan for the club other than that he's had a struggle to get the overdraft guaranteed and will appoint his mate Alan Shearer.

 

Newcastle bring in far more money then the majority of Premiership clubs, so how can you then come to the conclusion that the best we can hope for is to be a yoyo club without extra cash?   Why do you think all those clubs that bring in much less money then us aren't yoyo clubs?

 

This is complacency. We got ourselves into a lot of financial trouble in the Premiership under Shepherd and Hall once the flotation money ran out. What's going to be different this time?

 

I'm not saying it can't be done, but Moat has yet to offer anything to convince me that he's the one who can do it. Right now he's just the non-Ashley, like Ashley was the non-Shepherd. A negative rather than a positive. What's he got that will get us there, apart from Shearer's mobile number?

 

Complacency?  I'm not saying that the amount of money we make guarantees success..  All I'm saying is that lack of money is not going to be an obstacle to us re-establishing ourselves in the Premiership, because we generate far more money then most Premiership sides.  How the board and manager spend that money should be our only real concern IMO.

 

We didn't get into trouble last time round through lack of money.  We got into trouble because the people running the club squandered the 5th highest revenue in the league while producing a team that couldn't even regularly finish top 10!

[merlin]

I disagree. I think the post you made was a solid argument, but incorrect looking at context.

 

We needed stability 10 years ago, when billions weren't essential.

 

A well structured setup will enable you to improve, but the improvement will be limited.

 

It's a bit of a contradiction actually. Stability may be the way forward in the short term, baring in mind we're not currently even a Premier League side, but finance will be the only way to progress once we hopefully return there.

 

I think this is true. I worry that without significant investment the best we can hope to be is a yo-yo club.

 

I'd feel more comfortable if I knew a few more positive things about Moat and his vision/plan for the club other than that he's had a struggle to get the overdraft guaranteed and will appoint his mate Alan Shearer.

 

Agreed - people should avoid being drawn into the trap of thinking that you can have either money OR stability ; NUFC needs BOTH and without it will be just another middle ranking Prem club - at BEST.

[Delima]

Is trophy and glory REALLY that important ?

 

I fully understand that the purpose of a competition is to WIN, to win at all cost within the rules. There is only one champion in a competition, but football is just not football. Football embodies the many romanticsms of the vox populi, there can be many winners in football.

 

What's the point of winning, if the soul of the club is betrayed ? What is the point of winning, if all other aspects of the club is neglected ?

 

What does Newcastle United mean to us ? What do people positively associate Newcastle United with ?

 

I want to be a proud Newcastle United supporter. Like a proud Athletic Bilbao supporter, like a proud Arsenal supporter, like a proud Wigan supporter, like a proud Boro supporter, like a proud Stoke supporter, like a proud Barcelona supporter, like a proud Manchester United supporter. Some of these clubs are more successful than the others. But all these clubs are punching above their weight, the supporters of these clubs have something truely meaningful to be proud of.

 

Medals sure will help, but I prefer an owner that can give the club supporters something to be trully proud of.

 

Actually, I prefer the club to be fully owned by fans.

[bealios]

Two words. Arse. Nil.

 

Get the team playing well, get the crowds and corporate guys in, finish off the third section of the Gallowgate, and then look to generate revenue and market worldwide before the "Entertainers" are forgotten worldwide. We still have some global appeal if we get back their quick.

 

No, we won't ever compete with Chelsea, Man City and Man Utd for cash, unless the benefactors start wanting a return on investment, but we can certainly look to compete with Liverpool, Arsenal long term.

 

[ohmelads]

We can't really judge the guy until we know a bit more about him. But if we get promoted this season - which is vital to our long term future - we will need a good level of investment to stay in the Premier League. There is no hiding from it, we'd have a lot of restructuring to do. Any normal club getting promoted would probably look to relegate some of their mediocre first-teamers to backup status and strengthen the first team where they can. But when your mediocre starting players are the likes of Butt, Geremi and several loan signings you have a problem. The ageing players on high wages simply need to be shifted yet will bring in little in sales. Replacing them with quality first team players will cost a lot of money, and then we will need to buy backup. Right now the only thing keeping us from a subs bench full of academy kids are loan signings.

 

Of course, the earlier someone comes in, the more time they will have to oversee these changes. Not only that but we need Ashley out as soon as possible because he will likely asset strip further in January. So I'd gladly welcome Moat in tomorrow, even though I know almost nothing about the guy. Sadly I don't see it happening, I just can't see Ashley selling us while we're top of the Championship.

[Zero]

Dave, I got your point, just that it does matter when the club needs cash injection just for paying the expenses.  I hope we won't be in this position but it is not impossible either.

[Hudson]

Stabillity in our club for once over Billions any day....

 

QFT

 

 

[LooneyToonArmy]

Yep, stability and getting rid of Ashley first and foremost......... but the gap between the rich Arab/American owned clubs will get wider and wider the longer we're without a wealthy owner in the future......making it extremely difficult for any club to compete for the top 4/5 places in the EPL.

 

Well we're a million miles away from that to begin with anyway....

 

Lets just get some stability and promoted and take it from there.

 

 

 

 

I'm getting tired of people moaning that the guy supposedly in pole position to buy the club:

 

• Doesn't have billions of pounds to his name
  
• Has 'struggled to scrape together the £100m'
  
• Has 'struggled to convince Barclays to let him take over'
  
• Won't be able to afford to buy players
  
• Won't be able to afford to run the club
  

 

Now don't get me wrong, I'm not saying this guy is perfect and I'm not saying he's automatically going to be better than Ashley (though it would be some going not to be), but the facts about him getting backing and having to convince Barclays don't necessarily have any bearing on his plans for the club whatsoever. £100m is a lot of money to find in one hit even for the rich and from what has been reported and rumoured about Ashley's methods of sale it's no surprise it's taken a while to get the cash together. Don't forget that the next lot absolutely will not want to get themselves into the situation Ashley has with regards to debts and 'hidden' costs. Also, Barclays will have been practically begging Ashley to stay because they know he's got the assets to secure the overdraft. It's no wonder they're dragging their heels.

 

Most of us would love the new guy to roll in with a load of disposable assets, making big noises about spending money and getting the club back to where it has been in the past. Sound familiar? That's right, it's exactly what Ashley did and look where that's got us. Ashley had and still does have f***ing loads of money, but that's not the be all and end all. You only have to look at the Keegan farce to see how shambolically the club has been operated under his stewardship. Shepherd went totally tits up in the last few years but he proved that with a few key decisions made well, this club can generate good levels of income and attract investment - enough to have us back in the Premier League with a positive future. Okay we might not be able to challenge for the title without megabucks but one step at a time, eh?

 

Let's stop focussing on how much money Moat has and hope that his decision-making skills are a massive improvement instead.

But how will we compete in the top league if we are on a tight budget.

 

Everton seem to be able to Compete on a tight Budget

 

Didn't Fellaini cost 15m?

 

Suppose that could be considered peanuts these days though

[Matt]

Of course we know nothing yet of Moat's un-named American backers and whether they are in a similar financial situation to Moat or have considerable extra wedge.

 

If you're buying a business in such a public way it's far better to plead poverty than turn up with a suitcase full of million pound notes.

[cp40]

This is like Star Wars (yes I'm a geek) and the Force. The Dark Side is faster, easier, quicker... but stronger? No. I expect many tears at City and Chelsea in the long term, when billionaires get bored (Chelsea will be pretty screwed in a couple years)

 

you spend too much time polishing your helmet.

[Cronky]

There are so many unknowns. A lot will depend on whether these backers of his are expecting a regular return on their investment or whether they're prepared to sit tight for the long-term and get rewards in terms of publicity - or even just the thrill of the ride. The nature of the beast is it's extremely difficult for top English clubs to turn a profit. The competition is so fierce that every buck tends to get swallowed up in transfer fees and wages. In America, the competition is much more regulated and the top sports clubs are more secure. I just hope the Yanks know what they're getting into.

 

The local man issue could also go either way. He could be a Sir John Hall or a Freddie Shepherd. Sir John Hall had that element of detachment whereas Freddie the fan was headstrong and got over-involved in the football side.

 

PS - One significant positive is that Moat has been involved with the club for a while and as far as I can see is on the inside track. A big problem with the Ashley takeover was that a lot of experience and expertise was lost. The new regime seemed to be learning on the hoof, and made some very costly mistakes.

[Isegrim]

Some people are behaving like there is a queue of billionairs lining up to invest in Newcastle. The club is on the market for a year now and they have not shown up. Maybe they will show up in future. But the first step will be to make the club attractive again. Winning promotion isn't the only thing, but also removing the (media) tag of being uncontrolable. To gain this, I'd rather take an owner with little money but the right intentions but an disgruntled, incompetent fat tw*t who might have the money but is lacking positive intentions and brain cells.

[matta]

stability and a postive economy and we can do well. no need for players on £100k p/w wages, or even £60k. structure is something we desperately need.

[OzzieMandias]

I disagree. I think the post you made was a solid argument, but incorrect looking at context.

 

We needed stability 10 years ago, when billions weren't essential.

 

A well structured setup will enable you to improve, but the improvement will be limited.

 

It's a bit of a contradiction actually. Stability may be the way forward in the short term, baring in mind we're not currently even a Premier League side, but finance will be the only way to progress once we hopefully return there.

 

I think this is true. I worry that without significant investment the best we can hope to be is a yo-yo club.

 

I'd feel more comfortable if I knew a few more positive things about Moat and his vision/plan for the club other than that he's had a struggle to get the overdraft guaranteed and will appoint his mate Alan Shearer.

 

Newcastle bring in far more money then the majority of Premiership clubs, so how can you then come to the conclusion that the best we can hope for is to be a yoyo club without extra cash?   Why do you think all those clubs that bring in much less money then us aren't yoyo clubs?

 

This is complacency. We got ourselves into a lot of financial trouble in the Premiership under Shepherd and Hall once the flotation money ran out. What's going to be different this time?

 

I'm not saying it can't be done, but Moat has yet to offer anything to convince me that he's the one who can do it. Right now he's just the non-Ashley, like Ashley was the non-Shepherd. A negative rather than a positive. What's he got that will get us there, apart from Shearer's mobile number?

so the option is stay under ashley? a regime without any credibility whatsoever? even freddie had more credibility at his worst than ashley has now. As it stands its damn difficult for him to be any worse. Whats needed is stability and dignity to bring decency back to all levels of the football club not just with Hughton and the players

 

So in what ways is Moat equipped to provide stability and dignity to bring decency back to all levels of the football club?

[AyeDubbleYoo]

I realise we don't have any better offers etc etc, but I really doubt whether we'll be happy with an owner who can't invest serious money in the squad. Yes, he'll be better than Ashley, almost certainly... but will we really be happy scraping bottom half with Bolton and Stoke?

[TRon]

It would be nice if we pulled a wealthy foreign investor so we could compete with the big boys but in the event we don't we have to live within our means. This is one aspect of Ashley's ownership I agree with to some extent. While the fat fool took it too far and has proven to be completely dishonest, the club will be better off in the long term through budgeting properly. If Moat comes in all I would really expect is that the money generated from a club like ours is pumped back into future development, it's madness to pay inflated fees and wages to the likes of Michael Owen to railroad them into coming here.

[Mowen]

I basically agree with you Dave. So long as Moat surrounds himself with people who understand football and have his full trust, uses common sense and is reasonably ambitious with the club I'll be fairly happy. If we improve (which I wouldn't have thought would be too hard from where we are now) our budget will grow considerably. The only real alternative is the sillyness of mental billionaires and, much as I'd enjoy that, I'm not sure it's really what I want.

[Guest Roger Kint]

I basically agree with you Dave. So long as Moat surrounds himself with people who understand football and have his full trust, uses common sense and is reasonably ambitious with the club I'll be fairly happy. If we improve (which I wouldn't have thought would be too hard from where we are now) our budget will grow considerably. The only real alternative is the sillyness of mental billionaires and, much as I'd enjoy that, I'm not sure it's really what I want.

 

Am with you and Dave here. 

[Hudson]

I basically agree with you Dave. So long as Moat surrounds himself with people who understand football and have his full trust, uses common sense and is reasonably ambitious with the club I'll be fairly happy. If we improve (which I wouldn't have thought would be too hard from where we are now) our budget will grow considerably. The only real alternative is the sillyness of mental billionaires and, much as I'd enjoy that, I'm not sure it's really what I want.

 

Am with you and Dave here. 

 

Count me in to, we just cannot compete with the oil money. Short term it would be great to have that investment. Long term is another problem.

 

Just look at where it has gotten Chelsea

[Guest icemanblue]

I basically agree with you Dave. So long as Moat surrounds himself with people who understand football and have his full trust, uses common sense and is reasonably ambitious with the club I'll be fairly happy. If we improve (which I wouldn't have thought would be too hard from where we are now) our budget will grow considerably. The only real alternative is the sillyness of mental billionaires and, much as I'd enjoy that, I'm not sure it's really what I want.

 

Am with you and Dave here. 

 

Same here. The expectations of some people are bordering on the insane.

[Lagerstedt]

Stability every day of the week.

 

It would be nice got get a really wealthy owner in and spend hundreds of millions, but it has no charm. And to be honest, we have all seen the various Disney films and you always end up cheering for the underdogs, the one's with the true passion (unless you're Barney Stinsen and want that other kid to win in Karate Kid).

 

Stability, good youth set-up and attacking football (read Arsenal) and the rest will follow

[SEMTEX]

Stability every day of the week.

 

It would be nice got get a really wealthy owner in and spend hundreds of millions, but it has no charm. And to be honest, we have all seen the various Disney films and you always end up cheering for the underdogs, the one's with the true passion (unless you're Barney Stinsen and want that other kid to win in Karate Kid).

 

Stability, good youth set-up and attacking football (read Arsenal) and the rest will follow

 

The thing is, I'm Barney Stinson.

[BONTEMPI]

I'd rather have a bloke that cares about running the club, even on an overdraft than a very rich tosser that does no investment in the team and couldn't give two hoots.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

If we're assuming that it's just a choice between Ashley and Moat then we may as well end this thread now.

 

Will he better than Ashley (or at least, will the fans like him more)? Almost certainly.

 

Does it matter that he isn't mega-rich? It would be better if he was!

[Guest]

I basically agree with you Dave. So long as Moat surrounds himself with people who understand football and have his full trust, uses common sense and is reasonably ambitious with the club I'll be fairly happy. If we improve (which I wouldn't have thought would be too hard from where we are now) our budget will grow considerably. The only real alternative is the sillyness of mental billionaires and, much as I'd enjoy that, I'm not sure it's really what I want.

 

Am with you and Dave here. 

 

Count me in to, we just cannot compete with the oil money. Short term it would be great to have that investment. Long term is another problem.

 

Just look at where it has gotten Chelsea

 

6 seasons of top 3 finishes, cup wins, Champions League Finals & Semi-Finals.

 

Tragic I know!