Newcastle United Supporters Trust (NUST)

[InspectorCoarse]

15 minutes ago, alijmitchell said:

Okay, fine. Perhaps the tone of my posts don't help the discussion. The reasons I am pledging are as follows;

 

1. I have some hope for a better Newcastle in the future, which I want to bring my son to. I desperately want him to be able to experience the joy of supporting this mad, mad club.

2. In my own life I have spent a lot of time in community organising, and I understand how small actions started now can make a big difference in the future. Okay there are no guarantees but nothing is ever guaranteed.

3. I'd rather this club spent a decade in the bloody northern league with an active and involved fan ownership model than this hollow shell of a club we have now.

4. I don't miss the money each month, as, to me, it's basically the cost of 2 pints.

5. I see how the Hearts foundation have managed to develop here and I see no reason why we cannot do similar. 

6. The aim of 1% ownership is not a fantasy - more like saving to buy your house. You start now, and in future, who knows when the place you want might be up for sale.

7. 1% ownership and a position on the board is by far and away better representation in NUFC related matters than anything we have ever had. 

8. I don't really mind if it fails and my money goes to charity.

 

Hope that clears some stuff up.

 

 

 

Ok here goes :

2. Any examples you can point to ?

5. Hearts are tiny compared to us - Chalk and cheese

6. 1% = No say or control over anything - its the ultimate feel good but pointless gesture

7. Why would any club give someone / an entity owning a mere 1% of shares a seat on the board or any say in how the club is run . That IS fantasy

8. You might as well cut out the middleman and give it to charity - except do it now instead of years in the future - they need your £ now and they need it much more than NUST do 

[AJ9]

2 minutes ago, InspectorCoarse said:

Ok here goes :

2. Any examples you can point to ?

5. Hearts are tiny compared to us - Chalk and cheese

6. 1% = No say or control over anything - its the ultimate feel good but pointless gesture

7. Why would any club give someone / an entity owning a mere 1% of shares a seat on the board or any say in how the club is run . That IS fantasy

8. You might as well cut out the middleman and give it to charity - except do it now instead of years in the future - they need your £ now and they need it much more than NUST do 

 

Sorry, are you asking me to provide examples of community organising work I've been involved in? Is this a job interview?

[AJ9]

Anyway, I've given my views on why I'm behind it in response to @reefatoon's post. I can't and won't change people's minds, so I'll just leave my post at that and let everyone move on. 

[InspectorCoarse]

1 minute ago, alijmitchell said:

 

Sorry, are you asking me to provide examples of community organising work I've been involved in? Is this a job interview?

Im asking you when small actions you have witnessed ( community organising ) have turned into something that made a huge difference to the future . Simple question - its not a proposition for Lichtenstein 

[InspectorCoarse]

1 minute ago, alijmitchell said:

Anyway, I've given my views on why I'm behind it in response to @reefatoon's post. I can't and won't change people's minds, so I'll just leave my post at that and let everyone move on. 

So you're not willing to defend or argue any of your points ? How will you ever succeed in getting people to part with their £££ if you can't be bothered to debate with them ?

[Superior Acuña]

7 minutes ago, InspectorCoarse said:

Im asking you when small actions you have witnessed ( community organising ) have turned into something that made a huge difference to the future . Simple question - its not a proposition for Lichtenstein 

 

I mean you shouldn't need an example of that - just vaguely follow history or politics.

[AJ9]

Well I have shared are my own personal views on why am pledging, as asked, and no, I don't feel the need to defend my own personal reasons for pledging, because they are personal, and undoubtedly wrapped up in my emotional relationship to the club as much as anything else. I'm also not trying to convince you to part with your money - I'm not here to persuade you, I'm certainly not interested in the 'sell'. 

 

BTW there are literally thousands of community interest organisations, social enterprises and projects around that are doing amazing things that change people's lives up here including community ownership of land, men's sheds, refuweegee, freedom bakery, all the parkruns, gala day organising committees, the children's wood. If you have look through Foundation Scotland's website there are lots and lots of projects that have received small grants, but who started from nothing.

[relámpago blanco]

Literally all entirely pointless, I appreciate all of their efforts though. 

 

There is nothing we can do unless we can raise 300 Million to buy the club then another 300 Million that it desperately needs in investment.  The sooner people realise that and get on with their lives the better.  

 

The club now has league 1 coaching, infrastructure and staffing.

 

St James is an absolute mess as well which is a travesty.

 

 

[InspectorCoarse]

13 minutes ago, alijmitchell said:

Well I have shared are my own personal views on why am pledging, as asked, and no, I don't feel the need to defend my own personal reasons for pledging, because they are personal, and undoubtedly wrapped up in my emotional relationship to the club as much as anything else. I'm also not trying to convince you to part with your money - I'm not here to persuade you, I'm certainly not interested in the 'sell'. 

 

BTW there are literally thousands of community interest organisations, social enterprises and projects around that are doing amazing things that change people's lives up here including community ownership of land, men's sheds, refuweegee, freedom bakery, all the parkruns, gala day organising committees, the children's wood. If you have look through Foundation Scotland's website there are lots and lots of projects that have received small grants, but who started from nothing.

If even NUST supporters can't be arsed to prosletize / advocate / argue / debate etc on its behalf then its dead in the water

[Rafalove]

Even if (and it’s a gigantic if), we were able to obtain £350m to fund the sale of the club. How would we fund it moving forward? If you think it’d become self-sustainable, you’re deluded.

 

How am I deluded? some of the most successful clubs in the world are fan owned. In Spain it just so happens that the three most successful clubs are all fan owned(Barca, Madrid, Bilbao).  Clubs that have all never been relegated. Fan ownership is the norm in Germany where fans feel a deeper connection and pride to their club, with I imagine greater satisfaction.

 

Where would the millions (and millions) of investment needed in the facilities come from? Would we have another 20 year whip round?

 

We could take out a loan, which is not uncommon. Personally I feel owners putting money in to clubs is bad for the game anyway, and reduces football to a "who has the richest billionaire game". It will also be the case that whatever happens we certainly wouldn't own 100% anyway certainly not for a long time so if we decided we were okay with owners putting money in, Perhaps whoever owns the remaining %would want to invest. We could fund part of the improvements through sponsorship. perhaps the "insert sponsorship" academy. We're already underperforming commercially so there is a lot of scope for improvement. being a fan owned club would give us a unique selling point, while I hate to use such corporatist language and perhaps slightly cheapen a supporters connection to said football club, it's true. We would gain more fans from oversee's and within the uk, because people would see us as a club with real identity, something that means something. So we would benefit from both more fans and a more profitable image.

 

What about the initial investment in players that’d be needed? Shall we buy players on tick like Man Utd where they pay a tenner a month?

 

 

We would struggle initially I think, but by running the club well we would gradually claw our way upwards. I mean imagine if we owned our club now, imagine how much better off we would be simply by getting rid of Bruce. Then imagine we kept Rafa, imagine we kept Rafa and we didn't spunk 40 mil on Joelinton. Then imagine better comercial interests and ab etter atmosphere within the club and from the stands. We're allready miles better off right there.

 

 

 

 

You don’t honestly think owning 1% of the football club would secure any of that, do you? 

 

 

Yes. It offers transparency. it's much harder to bullshit fans if you have sort of liaison sitting in watching what happens and reporting back to fans. Having a fan representative at the club relaying back and forth between supporters and club I am sure would make even this grubby regime a much better one.

 

We might think we can ‘run the club’ better than Ashley. But 1% won’t achieve that. 1% won’t get us any more say than we already do have. None.

 

 

Like i've said 1% would hopefully be the start.

 

 

If Ashley (or the next owner) wants to run the club like a sack of shit, having Alex with a toenail in the door won’t prevent that.

 

See my reply above the last one

 

 

@Fantail Breeze

[Rafalove]

9 minutes ago, InspectorCoarse said:

If even NUST supporters can't be arsed to prosletize / advocate / argue / debate etc on its behalf then its dead in the water

 

 

We can. 

[AJ9]

 

9 minutes ago, InspectorCoarse said:

If even NUST supporters can't be arsed to prosletize / advocate / argue / debate etc on its behalf then its dead in the water

 

 

That's the post of a total troll to be honest. It's disingenuous to state that a) people haven't advocated their views and b) to imply that you're open to debate. You're asking me to waste my time to try and convince you of something you have no intention of being convinced about, and you're acting the tit about it to boot. 

[InspectorCoarse]

1 minute ago, alijmitchell said:

 

 

 

That's the post of a total troll to be honest. It's disingenuous to state that a) people haven't advocated their views and b) to imply that you're open to debate. You're asking me to waste my time to try and convince you of something you have no intention of being convinced about, and you're acting the tit about it to boot. 

Ive asked you some simple questions . You can't answer them . 

[AJ9]

I look forward to hearing about your research finding about all the interesting and valuable community-led initiatives that have changed people's lives btw @InspectorCoarse. You can tell us all about the examples you've found out about. 

[AJ9]

3 minutes ago, InspectorCoarse said:

Ive asked you some simple questions . You can't answer them . 

 

"Ok here goes :

2. Any examples you can point to ?

5. Hearts are tiny compared to us - Chalk and cheese

6. 1% = No say or control over anything - its the ultimate feel good but pointless gesture

7. Why would any club give someone / an entity owning a mere 1% of shares a seat on the board or any say in how the club is run . That IS fantasy

8. You might as well cut out the middleman and give it to charity - except do it now instead of years in the future - they need your £ now and they need it much more than NUST do"

 

I count one question, which was answered. Unless you don't know how to use a question mark.

[InspectorCoarse]

2 minutes ago, alijmitchell said:

I look forward to hearing about your research finding about all the interesting and valuable community-led initiatives that have changed people's lives btw @InspectorCoarse. You can tell us all about the examples you've found out about. 

I was asking you about that - since it was you that made the claim . You still havent come up with any examples which leads me to believe that you just like making empty statements but cry foul when asked about them . Its people like you ( and NUST itself ) that are the trolls

[InspectorCoarse]

2 minutes ago, alijmitchell said:

 

"Ok here goes :

2. Any examples you can point to ?

5. Hearts are tiny compared to us - Chalk and cheese

6. 1% = No say or control over anything - its the ultimate feel good but pointless gesture

7. Why would any club give someone / an entity owning a mere 1% of shares a seat on the board or any say in how the club is run . That IS fantasy

8. You might as well cut out the middleman and give it to charity - except do it now instead of years in the future - they need your £ now and they need it much more than NUST do"

 

I count one question, which was answered. Unless you don't know how to use a question mark.

Lol making a point can also be seen as a segue into a debate 

[Lazarus]

As Ive said before in this thread - fan ownership is a wonderful idea. But its an idea for the future, for when the PL start caring about the fans or when Ashley fucks off. Not now.

 

There are MUCH bigger problems than this at the club currently. Any supporters group should be focused on these issues for the time being.

 

I know the trust has raised an enormous amount of money and if any charity sees a penny of it they should be applauded, of course they should. But extrapolating the sum raised in the time taken to raise it, then centuries must pass before theres enough to get a seat at the table.

 

Even if I win the maximum jackpot on the Euromillions I would still need double or triple to make the club viable - the days of John Hall or Jack Walker pumping 30m or 40m into a club to compete for the title have long since disappeared.

 

Any fan ownership of a club would, in my opinion, have to be gifted not bought. The sums involved are simply too astronomical.

 

In the wider context, there should also be fan representation at the FA and at the PL, but i think we all know this will never happen.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Doctor Zaius]

Wasn't particularly impressed with their comments pre-match from what I've seen.

 

Harping on about Bruce, the football, the lack of wins. There's a bigger issue here than Steve fucking Bruce and that's Mike Ashley, his inability to sell and the takeover.

 

Had the opportunity to actually say something, actually address the situation and came out with a load of drivel. 

 

The rest of the country will be sat their thinking, 'well who else other than Bruce are they going to get?' and they're bang on, but that's really not the point is it.

 

Fucking wet like.

[Chicane]

Why does it always have to be one or the other? 

 

Ashley is the biggest problem, yes. But that doesn't mean the manager isn't also a problem and shouldn't be talked about.

 

 

[Doctor Zaius]

Aside from Rafa, the manager is always going to be shit though. That's because of Ashley.

 

Who is managing this shit show is almost by the by until he goes. 

 

The first thing Carragher said was words to the effect 'Why Bruce and not Ashley?' 

[Doctor Zaius]

I'd also add that there's never been consistent pressure on Ashley. There's been fuck all movement wholesale aside from a song now and then.

 

Remember the SackPardew campaigns and now this whinging about Bruce. There's consistent collective ire directed at the manager often, never enough at Ashley.

[Numbers]

I can't take these guys seriously any more, the majority of them are stumping up at the match and feeding the beast.

 

At least thats my perception.

[et tu brute]

2 minutes ago, Numbers said:

I can't take these guys seriously any more, the majority of them are stumping up at the match and feeding the beast.

 

At least thats my perception.

 

They had their chance to show a backbone when questioning Masters. Instead they put on the lube and bent over backwards. 

[AyeDubbleYoo]

Has something happened with the trust like?