Steven Taylor

[Guest bimpy474]

Basically you don't make jokes about colour, it really is that simple. And shows just how simple Saylor is to do it.

 

 

Monumentally thick thing to do.

 

It's not really that simple. You can make jokes about colour, for example banter between a group of friends of different races. Maybe that is what Taylor is doing here, unless you talk to them you can't really know. The monumentally thick thing was publishing that photo on Twitter, a global public forum.

 

That's how i meant it Ian, in the public eye type if thing. Even then it's iffy in private but i suppose that something different race friends determine between themselves, if it offends.

[The College Dropout]

I'll tell you now. There not a friend of my that could post that type of thing about me and not receive a swift blow to the jaw.

 

The lads not taking offence doesn't matter to me at all. They could be as dumb as Saylor for all I know.  Or they could be great mates and have offensive banter between themselves. 

 

[AyeDubbleYoo]

I'll tell you now. There not a friend of my that could post that type of thing about me and not receive a swift blow to the jaw.

 

The lads not taking offence doesn't matter to me at all. They could be as dumb as Saylor for all I know.  Or they could be great mates and have offensive banter between themselves. 

 

 

To be fair (although we don't know the specifics) it wouldn't be the first time someone of one race has had to play along and humour someone else's idiotic joke for social reasons. I've seen that happen many times.

 

That's the slight complexity in situations like this. Anita and co might feel they have to play along with Saylor's thick antics even though it actually makes them very uncomfortable. The ideal situation is that Taylor has a half a brain and doesn't put them in that position in the first place.

 

 

[Guest bimpy474]

I'll tell you now. There not a friend of my that could post that type of thing about me and not receive a swift blow to the jaw.

 

The lads not taking offence doesn't matter to me at all. They could be as dumb as Saylor for all I know.  Or they could be great mates and have offensive banter between themselves. 

 

 

Obviously that isn't the type of thing that's meant. Why does this have to turn into. If he did this, if he did that. FFS.

 

My friend used to use the Frank Bruno line to another friend of ours (a black man), we off on holiday to top up our tans. Our friend took no offence, as none was meant. That's the type of stuff that is ok between friends if they are comfortable with it.

 

Christ why is everything a worst case scenario all the fucking time.

[Toondave]

Racism is alive and kicking in many parts of the world and makes life a misery for many, but to label this as the same thing that sees people killed and beaten up elsewhere is almost as stupid as bringing up slavery and colonialism. we've moved on ffs. this isn't racism is just fuckwittery.

[Cajun]

I'll tell you now. There not a friend of my that could post that type of thing about me and not receive a swift blow to the jaw.

 

The lads not taking offence doesn't matter to me at all. They could be as dumb as Saylor for all I know.  Or they could be great mates and have offensive banter between themselves. 

 

 

To be fair (although we don't know the specifics) it wouldn't be the first time someone of one race has had to play along and humour someone else's idiotic joke for social reasons. I've seen that happen many times.

 

 

 

Here, Mike, x1000

[thomas]

Release a statement that he's sorry to have offended people and offer his week's wages to a charity for racism awareness or something, and be done with it. Personally I'm more disturbed by the fact that any hint at "racism" (by which I mean distinguishing between races of human beings, not hatred based on skin colour) still elicites this type of reaction from the general public than by his actual tweet. Whilst incredibly stupid (because of going against PC standards using a public medium) and criminally unfunny, I don't think there was any intent to offend. Much ado about nothing.

I don't get these constant criticisms of those taking offense tbh.

 

Are they supposed to apply some kind of social triage to these situations and only yell about the big ones that you tell them they can care about and ignore everything else? Does reading that sentence help highlight the ludicrous nature of your criticism?

 

That some ills are worse than others doesn't mean anyone has to keep quiet about the small ones and only shout about the large ones. Indeed it's the accumulation of these small social ills that can give rise to larger ones and they are every bit as much worth calling out when they happen.

[B-more Mag]

So he posted that in response to jokes that he's bad at French. And his response is to make a jibe about them being black. I'm sure he's really just a dimwit, but nonetheless it plays off the notion that there's something undesirable about being black. Otherwise it's just a nonsensical observation about colors in response to a jibe.

 

[KaKa]

So he posted that in response to jokes that he's bad at French. And his response is to make a jibe about them being black. I'm sure he's really just a dimwit, but nonetheless it plays off the notion that there's something undesirable about being black. Otherwise it's just a nonsensical observation about colors in response to a jibe.

 

 

The context of him saying that to them definitely makes it a lot worse. Something definitely off about his line of thinking.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

Release a statement that he's sorry to have offended people and offer his week's wages to a charity for racism awareness or something, and be done with it. Personally I'm more disturbed by the fact that any hint at "racism" (by which I mean distinguishing between races of human beings, not hatred based on skin colour) still elicites this type of reaction from the general public than by his actual tweet. Whilst incredibly stupid (because of going against PC standards using a public medium) and criminally unfunny, I don't think there was any intent to offend. Much ado about nothing.

I don't get these constant criticisms of those taking offense tbh.

 

Are they supposed to apply some kind of social triage to these situations and only yell about the big ones that you tell them they can care about and ignore everything else? Does reading that sentence help highlight the ludicrous nature of your criticism?

 

That some ills are worse than others doesn't mean anyone has to keep quiet about the small ones and only shout about the large ones. Indeed it's the accumulation of these small social ills that can give rise to larger ones and they are every bit as much worth calling out when they happen.

 

[Unbelievable]

Release a statement that he's sorry to have offended people and offer his week's wages to a charity for racism awareness or something, and be done with it. Personally I'm more disturbed by the fact that any hint at "racism" (by which I mean distinguishing between races of human beings, not hatred based on skin colour) still elicites this type of reaction from the general public than by his actual tweet. Whilst incredibly stupid (because of going against PC standards using a public medium) and criminally unfunny, I don't think there was any intent to offend. Much ado about nothing.

I don't get these constant criticisms of those taking offense tbh.

 

Are they supposed to apply some kind of social triage to these situations and only yell about the big ones that you tell them they can care about and ignore everything else? Does reading that sentence help highlight the ludicrous nature of your criticism?

 

That some ills are worse than others doesn't mean anyone has to keep quiet about the small ones and only shout about the large ones. Indeed it's the accumulation of these small social ills that can give rise to larger ones and they are every bit as much worth calling out when they happen.

 

Couldn't disagree more. There is a massive difference between racism (i.e. acknowledging there are differences between several races of human beings) and racial supremacy, institutionalised racism or even discrimination based on race. To play the racism card each and every time there is an air of potential racism about something without looking at the context to my mind diminishes rather than strenghtens the justified battle against the latter (true and infinitely more damaging) types of racism.

[David Icke - Son of God]

Offensiveness is a subjective thing and therefore it is ridiculous to try and quantify how offensive something can legitimately be. I didn't find it offensive (I thought the picture with the blacked out face was borderline IMO) but others might and I can certainly understand why. Would I wag my finger and tell them they're daft to be offended? Not in this instance.

 

The worst thing about this entire incident is that it has allowed insufferable cunts to bang on about "PC gone mad", because pointing out that publicly chastising people for the colour of their skin is a bit fucking dim is the height of political correctness. For that alone I hope he gets a big bloody fine and/or a ban.

[thomas]

Release a statement that he's sorry to have offended people and offer his week's wages to a charity for racism awareness or something, and be done with it. Personally I'm more disturbed by the fact that any hint at "racism" (by which I mean distinguishing between races of human beings, not hatred based on skin colour) still elicites this type of reaction from the general public than by his actual tweet. Whilst incredibly stupid (because of going against PC standards using a public medium) and criminally unfunny, I don't think there was any intent to offend. Much ado about nothing.

I don't get these constant criticisms of those taking offense tbh.

 

Are they supposed to apply some kind of social triage to these situations and only yell about the big ones that you tell them they can care about and ignore everything else? Does reading that sentence help highlight the ludicrous nature of your criticism?

 

That some ills are worse than others doesn't mean anyone has to keep quiet about the small ones and only shout about the large ones. Indeed it's the accumulation of these small social ills that can give rise to larger ones and they are every bit as much worth calling out when they happen.

Couldn't disagree more. There is a massive difference between racism (i.e. acknowledging there are differences between several races of human beings) and racial supremacy, institutionalised racism or even discrimination based on race. To play the racism card each and every time there is an air of potential racism about something without looking at the context to my mind diminishes rather than strenghtens the justified battle against the latter (true and infinitely more damaging) types of racism.

So it sounds like there's a definitions problem as basically no one is defining racism as you are, and when it comes to the "racism card" that's actually a term meant for one of two things -

1. to transform a non racial issue into a racial issue in order to shift the conversation or gain advantage (not happening here as the issue is clearly race)

2. to accuse other people of doing the first in order to dismiss and belittle their claims (this is what you're doing) as spurious.

 

By all means don't be offended if you're not offended but just don't think you have carte blanche to tell other people they shouldn't be, or that if they are, it's only because they're "playing a racism card".

[Unbelievable]

Offensiveness is a subjective thing and therefore it is ridiculous to try and quantify how offensive something can legitimately be. I didn't find it offensive (I thought the picture with the blacked out face was borderline IMO) but others might and I can certainly understand why. Would I wag my finger and tell them they're daft to be offended? Not in this instance.

 

The worst thing about this entire incident is that it has allowed insufferable c***s to bang on about "PC gone mad", because pointing out that publicly chastising people for the colour of their skin is a bit f***ing dim is the height of political correctness. For that alone I hope he gets a big bloody fine and/or a ban.

 

What?

[David Icke - Son of God]

Offensiveness is a subjective thing and therefore it is ridiculous to try and quantify how offensive something can legitimately be. I didn't find it offensive (I thought the picture with the blacked out face was borderline IMO) but others might and I can certainly understand why. Would I wag my finger and tell them they're daft to be offended? Not in this instance.

 

The worst thing about this entire incident is that it has allowed insufferable c***s to bang on about "PC gone mad", because pointing out that publicly chastising people for the colour of their skin is a bit f***ing dim is the height of political correctness. For that alone I hope he gets a big bloody fine and/or a ban.

 

What?

 

You know what I mean. I'm battling with a fucking vicious cold here, I'm not at my most eloquent.

[Raconteur]

Couldn't disagree more. There is a massive difference between racism (i.e. acknowledging there are differences between several races of human beings) and racial supremacy, institutionalised racism or even discrimination based on race. To play the racism card each and every time there is an air of potential racism about something without looking at the context to my mind diminishes rather than strenghtens the justified battle against the latter (true and infinitely more damaging) types of racism.

I think the bolded bit is the crucial difference. You think there is a "massive" difference between racial differentiation and racial hatred, whereas I (and many, many others) consider there to be a very small difference between the two. Sure, posting a "blackface" pic is different from wearing a KKK hood, but they're in the same general ballpark. How about not paying any attention to racial difference at all, and then there won't be any "grief"...?

[Unbelievable]

Release a statement that he's sorry to have offended people and offer his week's wages to a charity for racism awareness or something, and be done with it. Personally I'm more disturbed by the fact that any hint at "racism" (by which I mean distinguishing between races of human beings, not hatred based on skin colour) still elicites this type of reaction from the general public than by his actual tweet. Whilst incredibly stupid (because of going against PC standards using a public medium) and criminally unfunny, I don't think there was any intent to offend. Much ado about nothing.

I don't get these constant criticisms of those taking offense tbh.

 

Are they supposed to apply some kind of social triage to these situations and only yell about the big ones that you tell them they can care about and ignore everything else? Does reading that sentence help highlight the ludicrous nature of your criticism?

 

That some ills are worse than others doesn't mean anyone has to keep quiet about the small ones and only shout about the large ones. Indeed it's the accumulation of these small social ills that can give rise to larger ones and they are every bit as much worth calling out when they happen.

Couldn't disagree more. There is a massive difference between racism (i.e. acknowledging there are differences between several races of human beings) and racial supremacy, institutionalised racism or even discrimination based on race. To play the racism card each and every time there is an air of potential racism about something without looking at the context to my mind diminishes rather than strenghtens the justified battle against the latter (true and infinitely more damaging) types of racism.

So it sounds like there's a definitions problem as basically no one is defining racism as you are, and when it comes to the "racism card" that's actually a term meant for one of two things -

1. to transform a non racial issue into a racial issue in order to shift the conversation or gain advantage (not happening here as the issue is clearly race)

2. to accuse other people of doing the first in order to dismiss and belittle their claims (this is what you're doing) as spurious.

 

By all means don't be offended if you're not offended but just don't think you have carte blanche to tell other people they shouldn't be, or that if they are, it's only because they're "playing a racism card".

 

Well, let's see. The Oxford English Dictionary defines racism as

the belief that all members of each race possess characteristics, abilities, or qualities specific to that race, especially so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races

 

There is no doubt that what Taylor did qualifies as the first part of that definition (infer that members of the same race possess a characteristic specific to their race, i.e. in this case something as innocent as people of the congoid race smile more often than people of other races), but it is very, very questionable that it qualifies as the second (he does not suggest that the congoid race is inferior because of this identified characteristic). Hence why the distinction is actually crucially important; every human being is probably "racist" on a daily basis going by the first part of the definition, but to actually qualify as racism it needs to fit a belief system where one race is inferior/superior. This is what I referred to as racial supremacy, institutionalised racism or even discrimination based on race, the form of racism that needs to be battled as fiercely as any civilised society can and the form you refer to (and that is most commonly referred to when people claim something is racist even if it isn't). To suggest one form is the same as the other, or one leads directly to the other, is quite frankly preposterous, as is the notion that there are no racial differences (be it cultural or genetic), as much as today's political correctness brigade wants to swap all that under the carpet, as if races do not even exist.

 

May just be me, but to me denying the existence of racial differences in the face of mountains of evidence, and preventing them from being debated are more damaging concepts themselves than somebody pointing out a racial difference to his mates in good spirits.. It's as if we're trying to combat discrimination based on race by brainwashing people that there are no racial differences or that they are not allowed to discuss them, whilst the natural inclination should be to teach people to judge other people on their individual merit and performance, not something as shallow as their race (the same goes for age, sex, etc).

[Unbelievable]

Offensiveness is a subjective thing and therefore it is ridiculous to try and quantify how offensive something can legitimately be. I didn't find it offensive (I thought the picture with the blacked out face was borderline IMO) but others might and I can certainly understand why. Would I wag my finger and tell them they're daft to be offended? Not in this instance.

 

The worst thing about this entire incident is that it has allowed insufferable c***s to bang on about "PC gone mad", because pointing out that publicly chastising people for the colour of their skin is a bit f***ing dim is the height of political correctness. For that alone I hope he gets a big bloody fine and/or a ban.

 

What?

 

You know what I mean. I'm battling with a f***ing vicious cold here, I'm not at my most eloquent.

 

I don't. Seriously, how can what Taylor did (as dumb as it is) be construed in any way, shape or form as "chastising people for the colour of their skin"?

[Mike]

There needs to be a word that lies between ignorant and racist. There's no word. The Germans probably have one.

[cp40]

There needs to be a word that lies between ignorant and racist. There's no word. The Germans probably have one.

 

 

Daft?

[B-more Mag]

Christ, man. He responded to jokes about not speaking French well by resorting to a joke based on blackness. He wouldn't respond to white players saying he doesn't defend well by joking about their whiteness.

[Cajun]

Ignoracist.

 

Racorant.

 

[cp40]

InTaylorant.

[Cajun]

InTaylorant.

 

[Unbelievable]

InTaylorant.