Mike Ashley

[AyeDubbleYoo]

I don't know if 'you've not been supporting the club very long' is a valid reason for people to have low expectations. Surely if you've been following the club for longer you would tend to have lower expectations rather than higher?

 

How is being part of what we achieved in the 90s going to make you have lowered expectations now?

 

If you can remember those days - which I can, vividly - you just know we are a shadow of the club we were now, and we should be expecting far better, which we certainly would under a more ambitious and committed owner.

 

I mean, the 90s wasn't very long ago. What about all the stuff before then?

 

I know we've tasted relatively recent success, and that raises expectations of course. But the bigger picture is not so rosy.

 

The 90s - 20 years ago - was when the PL started and we were one of the top clubs in it for half that period.

The club lost its way under Shepherd but we still had CL football with SBR as manager and with a better Chairman we would not have been in this position now because we wouldn't be Mike Ashley's plaything.

The club's reputation has fallen to rock bottom under this regime and yet you still try to find excuses and defend it.

 

As usual, you are prepared to ignore the facts in order to justify your stance and the facts are that NUFC is a much better and bigger club than this regime are allowing it to be.

 

If you - and those who think like you do - can't or won't accept that, you shouldn't be following the club. Try Blyth Spartans or Gateshead if you want clubs with limited potential or low ambitions, even they probably wouldn't have Pardew as manager......

 

Absolute bollocks, you either haven't read or haven't understood what I've said.

 

I think the club is amazing and should aim as high as realistically possible, all I'm saying is that the 90s success was, if anything, slightly exceptional compared to the rest of our recent history.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

What's his asking price for us? £200m + the whole debt (£129m)?

 

No idea, don't even know if there is an asking price, or that he's trying to sell at all.

[Guest Roger Kint]

What's his asking price for us? £200m + the whole debt (£129m)?

 

No idea, don't even know if there is an asking price, or that he's trying to sell at all.

 

This really. Only thing to go by is that Independent? article saying he just wants his money back which at this moment stands at £243m i think. Still a good £80m too high for anyone i would guess. So basically probably not even for sale really.

[Pons Alias]

Just sell us and buy Rangers PLEASE!

 

Word is, that the potential buying of Rangers is unrelated to any sale of us.

[TheGuv]

He bought the club for £130 million (which he overpaid for) and inherited £80 million debt. The 5 seasons before he came we finished 3,5,14,7,13

 

In the last 5 seasons under Ashley we have finished 18,21,12,5,16.

 

If the club had £0 debt I would expect us to be valued at around £200-£220million

 

But we still probably have £60 million debt (I base this on nowt like, just a guess)

 

So surely the club should only be valued at around £130-£160million?

 

 

[Dave]

The 5 seasons before he came we finished 3,5,14,7,13

 

In the last 5 seasons under Ashley we have finished 18,21,12,5,16.

 

That's basically all that matters, and it's certainly no improvement.

[TheGuv]

The 5 seasons before he came we finished 3,5,14,7,13

 

In the last 5 seasons under Ashley we have finished 18,21,12,5,16.

 

That's basically all that matters, and it's certainly no improvement.

 

Yup. Using that logic the club shouldn't be valued any more than when he bought it

[AyeDubbleYoo]

Does league finish have that much impact on value? Honest question.

[TheGuv]

Does league finish have that much impact on value? Honest question.

 

It'll be subjective from club to club in fairness.

 

But surely a club that averages a finish of 8th is worth more than the same club 5 years later that averages a 14th place finish

[BottledDog]

Does league finish have that much impact on value? Honest question.

 

It'll be subjective from club to club in fairness.

 

But surely a club that averages a finish of 8th is worth more than the same club 5 years later that averages a 14th place finish

 

Why? If we have the stadium and infrastructure in place, and have a squad that apparently should be aiming for top 6-8 with a half decent manager, why would it matter to a new owner if we came 16th last year or what we averaged in the past?

[TheGuv]

Does league finish have that much impact on value? Honest question.

 

It'll be subjective from club to club in fairness.

 

But surely a club that averages a finish of 8th is worth more than the same club 5 years later that averages a 14th place finish

 

Why? If we have the stadium and infrastructure in place, and have a squad that apparently should be aiming for top 6-8 with a half decent manager, why would it matter to a new owner if we came 16th last year or what we averaged in the past?

 

Do we have the infrastrucutre?

 

Our training ground is 5 years older and the indoor facility is very aged (I know as I've coached in it far too many times whilst I was at NUFC) We've got less academy graduates in the 1st team. We have a smaller squad. Like someone said we take in less money commercially than Sunderland et al. It all adds up imo and if you're not showing it on the pitch as well why should a prospective owner then look to fork out the same price or even more money than his predecessor?

 

 

[AyeDubbleYoo]

Any buyer who has to worry about the price and getting a return probably won't be interested TBH. Best bet is someone who doesn't care how much it costs.

[biggs]

Any buyer who has to worry about the price and getting a return probably won't be interested TBH. Best bet is someone who doesn't care how much it costs.

Sheik rattle and roll  ,got to be someone in the Arab world to give Sheikh Mansour  a run for there money

[Toonpack]

Any buyer who has to worry about the price and getting a return probably won't be interested TBH. Best bet is someone who doesn't care how much it costs.

 

That's the only bet, to bridge the chasm with any rapidity IMO

[Guest bimpy474]

Never wish ill of anyone but this bloke......wanting someone to drop dead is not a nice thought to have.

[biggs]

Never wish ill of anyone but this bloke......wanting someone to drop dead is not a nice thought to have.

Bit of a fat Kernt mind so the old coronary might be on the horizon 

[AyeDubbleYoo]

He's slimmed down a bit recently, might be lasting damage mind.

[B-more Mag]

Is it too much to ask for an owner who gives at least one single, solitary fuck? I never imagined things would turn out this way when the news first broke that he was buying the club.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

Is it too much to ask for an owner who gives at least one single, solitary fuck? I never imagined things would turn out this way when the news first broke that he was buying the club.

 

I seem to remember everyone was pretty ecstatic about having a billionaire English owner. Couldn't have seen what was coming obviously.

[oldtype]

Is it too much to ask for an owner who gives at least one single, solitary fuck? I never imagined things would turn out this way when the news first broke that he was buying the club.

 

I seem to remember everyone was pretty ecstatic about having a billionaire English owner. Couldn't have seen what was coming obviously.

 

He very much gave a fuck for a good while. Then stopped giving a fuck when the KK fiasco happened.

 

Looked like he was giving a fuck again for a bit but clearly he has once again run out of fucks to give.

[Guest Phil K]

Never wish ill of anyone but this bloke......wanting someone to drop dead is not a nice thought to have.

 

I used to get annoyed at the callous wishing of dire things happening to Ashley

Until he sacked Hughton, and brought in Pardew. Still didn't wish nasty things to happen to him though

That changed when he brought Kinnear in.

[UV]

Look at Spurs, all the years we were having our “golden period” they were a lot like us now (if you listened to their fans back then) bumbling along showing “lack of ambition” but with a healthy bottom line, they’ve ascended as we’ve descended but it’s taken years and years of them making profits and player trading.

 

You're talking about 2 different periods of Spurs' history as if they were one.

 

91-01 they were majority owned and run by a top English businessman who made his fortune selling cheap tat to the mass market. He supposedly saved them from their financial troubles (I have no idea if this is actually true or a myth spread by himself) and ran them as a proper business. In Sugar's 10 year run they finished 15, 8, 15, 7, 8, 10, 14, 11, 10, 12 - the very definition of mediocrity (the 10 years prior to Sugar they finished 4, 4, 8, 3, 10, 3, 13, 6, 3, 11). If forums existed then they'd probably have had Sugar apologists telling everyone they should be grateful he saved them, they were doomed before he arrived, how he had sorted out the finances and was running the club on a sound financial footing, etc, but they were going absolutely nowhere on or off the pitch, and we easily out performed them financially.

 

It's only since ENIC & Levy took over that the club actually started to be run with the ambition we once had, which sees them where they are now. Yes they have sold their best players on occasion when they have wanted out - NO club is immune to that - but when they do, they spend all the money they get and more on top to try and keep pushing forward. This obvious ambition is what brings in the supporters, the corporate money and the sponsorship, plus it tends to have a happy side-effect of better football, higher league finishes and the extra cash which that brings in.

 

Now they are on the up and making money they are not looking to pay off the debt, instead they are looking to invest in the infrastructure of the club and build a new £250m stadium to bring in even more revenue. I'm convinced Sugar would never have spent £250m on a new stadium, just as Ashley would never have spent £42m to extend St James - in 6 years, a bore hole, underground heating for the training pitches, and lots and lots of advertising hoardings is the sum of Ashley's investment in the infrastructure of NUFC.

 

Under Ashley we're absolutely nothing like the Levy-run Spurs and never will be until he's gone or has a genuine change of purpose towards the club (but that's just a fantasy IMO). Any short term success like the 5th place season will always be a blip and we will never look to build on it, rather it will be a reason to sit back and run with what we have for another year without having to spend money on improving the squad. Any windfall player sale will not be used to boost the season's transfer kitty, but will be used to fund it entirely for the next few years. The commercial and matchday income we had which set us apart from the second tier of well supported clubs (Everton, Villa, West Ham, Sunderland, etc) was down £23.5m per year from when he bought the club in the last set of accounts. The longer he's here, the closer we get financially to theses clubs, and any advantage we built up under the previous owners will soon disappear. Eventually if they're run half decently they too will start to pull away from us.

 

A quarter of the club's yearly revenue gone and nearly double the debt despite a £35m windfall from a player he inherited, and people say the club is better off financially than when he bought it.

[bowlingcrofty]

Never wish ill of anyone but this bloke......wanting someone to drop dead is not a nice thought to have.

 

I used to get annoyed at the callous wishing of dire things happening to Ashley

Until he sacked Hughton, and brought in Pardew. Still didn't wish nasty things to happen to him though

That changed when he brought Kinnear in.

 

If I saw him having a hearty in the street, I'd honestly just walk straight past.

[Deputy Dawg UK]

Look at Spurs, all the years we were having our “golden period” they were a lot like us now (if you listened to their fans back then) bumbling along showing “lack of ambition” but with a healthy bottom line, they’ve ascended as we’ve descended but it’s taken years and years of them making profits and player trading.

 

You're talking about 2 different periods of Spurs' history as if they were one.

 

91-01 they were majority owned and run by a top English businessman who made his fortune selling cheap tat to the mass market. He supposedly saved them from their financial troubles (I have no idea if this is actually true or a myth spread by himself) and ran them as a proper business. In Sugar's 10 year run they finished 15, 8, 15, 7, 8, 10, 14, 11, 10, 12 - the very definition of mediocrity (the 10 years prior to Sugar they finished 4, 4, 8, 3, 10, 3, 13, 6, 3, 11). If forums existed then they'd probably have had Sugar apologists telling everyone they should be grateful he saved them, they were doomed before he arrived, how he had sorted out the finances and was running the club on a sound financial footing, etc, but they were going absolutely nowhere on or off the pitch, and we easily out performed them financially.

 

It's only since ENIC & Levy took over that the club actually started to be run with the ambition we once had, which sees them where they are now. Yes they have sold their best players on occasion when they have wanted out - NO club is immune to that - but when they do, they spend all the money they get and more on top to try and keep pushing forward. This obvious ambition is what brings in the supporters, the corporate money and the sponsorship, plus it tends to have a happy side-effect of better football, higher league finishes and the extra cash which that brings in.

 

Now they are on the up and making money they are not looking to pay off the debt, instead they are looking to invest in the infrastructure of the club and build a new £250m stadium to bring in even more revenue. I'm convinced Sugar would never have spent £250m on a new stadium, just as Ashley would never have spent £42m to extend St James - in 6 years, a bore hole, underground heating for the training pitches, and lots and lots of advertising hoardings is the sum of Ashley's investment in the infrastructure of NUFC.

 

Under Ashley we're absolutely nothing like the Levy-run Spurs and never will be until he's gone or has a genuine change of purpose towards the club (but that's just a fantasy IMO). Any short term success like the 5th place season will always be a blip and we will never look to build on it, rather it will be a reason to sit back and run with what we have for another year without having to spend money on improving the squad. Any windfall player sale will not be used to boost the season's transfer kitty, but will be used to fund it entirely for the next few years. The commercial and matchday income we had which set us apart from the second tier of well supported clubs (Everton, Villa, West Ham, Sunderland, etc) was down £23.5m per year from when he bought the club in the last set of accounts. The longer he's here, the closer we get financially to theses clubs, and any advantage we built up under the previous owners will soon disappear. Eventually if they're run half decently they too will start to pull away from us.

 

A quarter of the club's yearly revenue gone and nearly double the debt despite a £35m windfall from a player he inherited, and people say the club is better off financially than when he bought it.

Spurs have an English owner too !!!

[biggs]

Serious question here but the Fair play etc how does it work with clubs spunking up millions all over the place , is it based on income from attendances,merchandise,sponsorship and Sky money and other revenues ?

just read the http://www.financialfairplay.co.uk/financial-fair-play-explained.php and tbh its a mine field

Loads of loopholes to get around it by the look of things.