Hatem Ben Arfa

[Mick]

 

 

Second time I've read this on here. I don't think he'd get near Robson's side. Robert was a far better player and Solano was better suited to getting the best out of Shearer and Bellamy.

 

As if those players would have been as good under this clown as they were under him.

[colinmk]

Imagine if this lad had of played for us under Robson man.

 

 

Second time I've read this on here. I don't think he'd get near Robson's side. Robert was a far better player and Solano was better suited to getting the best out of Shearer and Bellamy.

 

I think Sir Bobby would have dropped Solano for Ben Arfa myself, he would have recognised his outrageous ability and match winning capabilities and found a place for him, without a doubt. Solano was great and provided good balance but Bobby was always looking to find someone for that right side ahead of him. You have to remember also, that Sir Bobby was constantly looking to evolve how we played. He would have eventually looked to replace Robert because he was looking to replace Shearer with someone more mobile and more able to play without wingers etc.

 

That's the key bit for me. He would have recognised his talent and got him in there somewhere. Certainly confident he would have been a success in that side.

[Ronaldo]

Hatem is miles better than Robert in the middle third of the pitch - in no way, shape or form was Robert anywhere near as good at beating players and opening things up. Robert's shooting was better and crossing considerably better, but he played in a significantly better team too and therefore had greater freedom to get on the end of chances.

 

You say that but Robert would beat players effortlessly with his pace. Just a far better footballer where it mattered, ie putting the ball in exactly the right place, be it in the net or between the keeper and defenders.

[mozy]

I think part of the reason people don't move/make runs when Hatem is on the ball is party because they know he isn't gunna pass. That's also down to shitty management of course.

[Mick]

I think part of the reason people don't move/make runs when Hatem is on the ball is party because they know he isn't gunna pass. That's also down to shitty management of course.

 

He passed the ball quite a bit against Norwich.

[Guest alijmitchell]

I think part of the reason people don't move/make runs when Hatem is on the ball is party because they know he isn't gunna pass. That's also down to shitty management of course.

 

He passed the ball quite a bit against Norwich.

 

Yep, I thought he did well against Norwich.

[triggs]

I think part of the reason people don't move/make runs when Hatem is on the ball is party because they know he isn't gunna pass. That's also down to shitty management of course.

 

He passed the ball quite a bit against Norwich.

Yes and some outstanding passes that split the defence open especially in the first half

[silph]

He needs to make use of his ability to get past players to get into useful space to execute a deadly pass or shot. The latter is severely lacking in his game recently.

 

Once he gets more games and his confidence up, I believe he will work wonders.

[Guest alijmitchell]

Hatem is miles better than Robert in the middle third of the pitch - in no way, shape or form was Robert anywhere near as good at beating players and opening things up. Robert's shooting was better and crossing considerably better, but he played in a significantly better team too and therefore had greater freedom to get on the end of chances.

 

You say that but Robert would beat players effortlessly with his pace. Just a far better footballer where it mattered, ie putting the ball in exactly the right place, be it in the net or between the keeper and defenders.

 

Agree, Robert is/was head and shoulders above Ben Arfa.

[The Prophet]

Hatem is miles better than Robert in the middle third of the pitch - in no way, shape or form was Robert anywhere near as good at beating players and opening things up. Robert's shooting was better and crossing considerably better, but he played in a significantly better team too and therefore had greater freedom to get on the end of chances.

 

You say that but Robert would beat players effortlessly with his pace. Just a far better footballer where it mattered, ie putting the ball in exactly the right place, be it in the net or between the keeper and defenders.

 

Agree, Robert is/was head and shoulders above Ben Arfa.

 

Different players for me, Robert is far more a traditional winger, Ben Arfa a playmaker.

[Guest Howaythetoon]

What a load of guff.

 

Speak your mind

 

Whatever, Sir Bobby would have found a place for Ben Arfa in our side, and Solano would have made way. I mean this was a player Bobby actually sold and did try and replace or improve on once or twice...

[Guest Howaythetoon]

Hatem is miles better than Robert in the middle third of the pitch - in no way, shape or form was Robert anywhere near as good at beating players and opening things up. Robert's shooting was better and crossing considerably better, but he played in a significantly better team too and therefore had greater freedom to get on the end of chances.

 

You say that but Robert would beat players effortlessly with his pace. Just a far better footballer where it mattered, ie putting the ball in exactly the right place, be it in the net or between the keeper and defenders.

 

Better crosser, better at shooting, but a better footballer? Robert rarely beat a man. Although he was a good athlete in that he was quite tall, lithe and quick if not exactly rapid.

 

Different players full stop mind.

[Flip]

I loved Robert and Solano.

 

 

all I wanted to say

 

[Guest Howaythetoon]

I loved Robert and Solano.

 

 

all I wanted to say

 

 

Two of our best ever players in modern times. Totally different players as well. Personally, Solano is more my type but Robert on his day was immense, his crossing, set-pieces and shooting often made all the difference.

[huss9]

What a load of guff.

 

Speak your mind

 

Whatever, Sir Bobby would have found a place for Ben Arfa in our side, and Solano would have made way. I mean this was a player Bobby actually sold and did try and replace or improve on once or twice...

 

or maybe in place of dyer

[ujpest doza]

What a load of guff.

 

Speak your mind

 

Whatever, Sir Bobby would have found a place for Ben Arfa in our side, and Solano would have made way. I mean this was a player Bobby actually sold and did try and replace or improve on once or twice...

He wouldn't mind.

HBA isn't as good as Robert, Solano, Bellamy or Dyer.

 

[Kanj]

HBA may be the more talented but no way has he ever been more effective or produced like Robert and Solano. That may be a product of injury and Pardew though.

[Alberto2005]

Could be the fact that Robert and Solano were playing in a team challenging for the top 4. A team which Andy Griffin and Andy O'Brien looked competent.

[alexf]

If he had never broken his leg he may have gone on to be better maybe but it doesn't matter anyway, our team is shit compared to that side and Ben Arfa is the least of our problems. The fact he seems to be getting more stick than others today annoys me though.

[Kanj]

I really don't know why today is a day to compare them.

 

HBA had a tough match and his shit manager didn't set him up to play to his strengths.

 

The fuck does Robert or Solano have to do about today?

[TRon]

HBA's rubbish, Marveaux's rubbish, Tiote's rubbish. Sissoko? He's rubbish. Don't get me started on Cisse and Santon. All our players are rubbish, truly letting down our talented Poyet-cock-sucking manager. I feel sad for him.

[Ketsbaia]

He was the only player not to get a 1/10 from me today, although he wasnt much better. He looked bright a few times but there was never an option in the box.

[tmonkey]

IMO with Robert when he got something right you'd remember it - great left foot - but over 90 minutes he'd be highly frustrating, hitting the first man with his crosses the majority of the time (conveniently forgotten it seems), shooting wildly and selfishly from anywhere, rarely ever producing a good pass for teammates (virtually all assists were crosses/corners). The point here being that imo Robert was carried by an excellent footballing side (under a legendary manager) and therefore had the luxury and freedom of being the guy who'd pop up 25-40 yards only having to produce a good cross or shot to go home having had a good game. With Ben Arfa, it's entirely different - he's under immense pressure to be the guy who picks the ball up from within his own half and then make something happen by beating 2/3/4 players, i.e. carrying the entire team. To put it another way, Robert's job was icing the cake, Hatem's is to make the cake all on his own (something few players on this planet can consistently do).

 

Another point to think about with Robert. When Sir Bobby's team was flying high at its very best and looking like a surprise title challenge might be on the cards, Bellamy got injured and our team/that title challenge crumbled (even Sir Alex admitted he thought we'd win the title if Bellamy hadn't got injured). How did Robert fare when Bellamy was out of the team in that specific period? From what I recall his game immediately suffered because the team as a whole were less effective, and he certainly didn't step up to the plate and carry the game for us. So clearly he was heavily reliant on the team as a whole being fully functional. Furthermore, his peak lasted about a season and a half, and as soon as the team started to wane in Sir Bobby's final full season, and with Souness not preferring him, Robert's game went completely down the hill. To put it simply, Robert became s*** as soon as Sir Bobby's team descended to the standard that our current team is at.

 

Compare all of this to Hatem. Leg snapped in two so out for a year, frequently dropped and scapegoated, further injuries, has had to play in a team playing far worse hoofball than we did even under Souness, forced by his manager to track back to pretty extreme levels (something Robert never had to do, meaning less energy wasted and more opportunities to be closer to opposition goal). And then on top of all of this, having hit some fantastic form for very brief periods, he's now become a marked man because everyone knows how good he is, usually having 2 players closing him down as soon as he's on the ball (something teams never did to Robert - wonder why?). Yet he still excites most people in the ground, is often our best player when he's on the pitch, and still manages to beat multiple players and create chances or produce good balls from nothing situations. Even today, despite the attention he had and playing in an unfamiliar position, and having a poor game by his standards, he still had a few decent moments and good passes into the penalty box (the trouble being they were all to Shola Ameobi). Hatem has essentially had everything going against him, yet he's still plugging away and trying to carry the team - unlike Robert who became s*** as soon as the going got tough.

 

Whilst I wish Hatem could cross or take a free kick like Robert, and both are/were inherently inconsistent due to being unpredictable, I still think Hatem is the comfortably superior footballer, and that whilst he may not be as good as we think/hope, we're still criminally wasting his talents by having a manager who has no idea or ability to use him effectively. And fwiw I think Sir Bobby would have used him to devastating effect because his dribbling would have been by far the best in the team. Imagine the space it would have left Dyer and Bellamy if teams decided to double/triple up on Hatem.

[Darth Crooks]

Do you think the likes of Robert would even get a sniff in a Pardew side? What would he do when its no one beyond the halfway line time?

[Guest Howaythetoon]

IMO with Robert when he got something right you'd remember it - great left foot - but over 90 minutes he'd be highly frustrating, hitting the first man with his crosses the majority of the time (conveniently forgotten it seems), shooting wildly and selfishly from anywhere, rarely ever producing a good pass for teammates (virtually all assists were crosses/corners). The point here being that imo Robert was carried by an excellent footballing side (under a legendary manager) and therefore had the luxury and freedom of being the guy who'd pop up 25-40 yards only having to produce a good cross or shot to go home having had a good game. With Ben Arfa, it's entirely different - he's under immense pressure to be the guy who picks the ball up from within his own half and then make something happen by beating 2/3/4 players, i.e. carrying the entire team. To put it another way, Robert's job was icing the cake, Hatem's is to make the cake all on his own (something few players on this planet can consistently do).

 

Another point to think about with Robert. When Sir Bobby's team was flying high at its very best and looking like a surprise title challenge might be on the cards, Bellamy got injured and our team/that title challenge crumbled (even Sir Alex admitted he thought we'd win the title if Bellamy hadn't got injured). How did Robert fare when Bellamy was out of the team in that specific period? From what I recall his game immediately suffered because the team as a whole were less effective, and he certainly didn't step up to the plate and carry the game for us. So clearly he was heavily reliant on the team as a whole being fully functional. Furthermore, his peak lasted about a season and a half, and as soon as the team started to wane in Sir Bobby's final full season, and with Souness not preferring him, Robert's game went completely down the hill. To put it simply, Robert became s*** as soon as Sir Bobby's team descended to the standard that our current team is at.

 

Compare all of this to Hatem. Leg snapped in two so out for a year, frequently dropped and scapegoated, further injuries, has had to play in a team playing far worse hoofball than we did even under Souness, forced by his manager to track back to pretty extreme levels (something Robert never had to do, meaning less energy wasted and more opportunities to be closer to opposition goal). And then on top of all of this, having hit some fantastic form for very brief periods, he's now become a marked man because everyone knows how good he is, usually having 2 players closing him down as soon as he's on the ball (something teams never did to Robert - wonder why?). Yet he still excites most people in the ground, is often our best player when he's on the pitch, and still manages to beat multiple players and create chances or produce good balls from nothing situations. Even today, despite the attention he had and playing in an unfamiliar position, and having a poor game by his standards, he still had a few decent moments and good passes into the penalty box (the trouble being they were all to Shola Ameobi). Hatem has essentially had everything going against him, yet he's still plugging away and trying to carry the team - unlike Robert who became s*** as soon as the going got tough.

 

Whilst I wish Hatem could cross or take a free kick like Robert, and both are/were inherently inconsistent due to being unpredictable, I still think Hatem is the comfortably superior footballer, and that whilst he may not be as good as we think/hope, we're still criminally wasting his talents by having a manager who has no idea or ability to use him effectively. And fwiw I think Sir Bobby would have used him to devastating effect because his dribbling would have been by far the best in the team. Imagine the space it would have left Dyer and Bellamy if teams decided to double/triple up on Hatem.

 

Spot on.