Wullie Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 All comes down to this with tollemache at the end of the day: ... I think the club's financial recovery is the number 1 important thing by a long way. I attach more weight to that than anything else We all support a football team, he's here to support a balance sheet. You can't have a cogent footballing argument with someone like that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
colinmk Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 And our finances are nothing to shout about either so what exactly is Tollemaches point, I don't get it? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 He paid off the debt to begin with because he had the cash. Just re: this point, he paid it off because he was forced to under the terms of the SJP mortgage agreement having not bothered doing due diligence (and as you say, is now cleaning it back out of the club coffers). Only a fucking cretin could argue that his incompetence is somehow evidence of his benevolence. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 And our finances are nothing to shout about either so what exactly is Tollemaches point, I don't get it? We're not Pompey. That's it. That's enough for people like him. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interpolic Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 He paid off the debt to begin with because he had the cash. Just re: this point, he paid it off because he was forced to under the terms of the SJP mortgage agreement having not bothered doing due diligence. Only a fucking cretin could argue that his incompetence is somehow evidence of his benevolence. Well aye, fair enough. Even worse then. But we posted a profit last year, let's all toss ourselves off into oblivion. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interpolic Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 And our finances are nothing to shout about either so what exactly is Tollemaches point, I don't get it? He wants us to be Everton despite them being thoroughly skint and us having achieved far more in the Premier League than Everton ever will. Sorry Neil. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vinny Green Balls Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 This vitriol toward Ashley and his regime hasn't come out of a vacuum. Rewind back to the 2008 fiasco, then relegation. Then things seemed stabilized, and he jettisons Hughton and brings in utter cuntish mediocrity as his replacement. Then this. The conversations are the same, and they will continue to be. There's a pretty fucking clear cycle here. No matter what good he ever does, it has been undermined by these utterly bizarre decisions. Evidence suggests that it will continue, and we will never find real stability under the Ashley regime. He needs to go. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vinny Green Balls Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 and I for one will not accept the 'better the devil you know' line of reasoning. That is fucking cowardice. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unbelievable Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 What has Ashley done well apart from employing a good scout and backing his judgement, and how do you explain him seemingly not seeing that as the main strength and thoroughly jeopardising it with an absolutely barking mad decision? It's not just about what he's done well - explore every possible revenue stream (albeit to a fault), employing a good scout and backing his judgment and refusing to bow to pressure to overspend, pay off the club debt (that's not a skill or anything, but not every chairman would've done it), it's the things he hasn't done badly like mortgage our future. He's prioritised making us into a viable business over just about everything else, which at this point in our history is good. How do I explain him not seeing Carr as the main strength etc etc etc....? I don't. As I've said a few times, I think it's a totally daft decision and the first move of Ashley's that I can't in any way defend. I agree, Carr is the crown jewel. I'm all about bank balance + transfer policy = you will do good, and Carr is key to that. I think it's barking mad to p*ss off Carr and I think it's completely insane to employ Kinnear. You seem to think I'm determined to defend Ashley no matter what, but it should be obvious that I'm not. Well it is just about what he's done well, since that's the question I asked. I'd argue that the only major thing he's done well is recognising he had a good scout and basing our transfer policy around that. That goes hand in hand with the financial stuff since we largely only spend what we bring in (at best) on good-value players from the Continent. There is no excuse for the steps backwards we've made in terms of other sources of revenue, such as commercial, matchday, etc. Regarding your first paragraph, it could well be argued that's all for his own benefit. He paid off the debt to begin with because he had the cash. He's started taking the money back, £11m last year. That will continue happening I'd imagine. I don't see what the obsession is with the financial stuff when it's seen us going backwards in many respects. There can be a happy medium you know, and I don't understand a football fan who wanks over spreadsheets or the idea that we could be as big as Everton. Regarding your last point, I do think you'll defend him (almost) no matter what, it doesn't matter if you're coming back on here with a more softly-softly, moderate tone, you're actually pretty much a militant Ashley supporter from everything I've read from you. I know not one person who's anywhere near as big a fan of his as you are. Top and bottom of it is that we haven't progressed as a football club and the last 5 years have been littered with humilation as an NUFC fan. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovejoy Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 Brought in to end a huge feud between Carr and pardew according to Simon bird in tomorrow's mirror. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fuzzy Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 i dunno if it been pointed out, or i just think everyone is taken the p*ss out of newcastle. watching watchdog (tonights, recorded at 35 mins) matt starts a clips saying the following names.. david atinbruff (david atinbourough) , Gary LINEika .... got to be a dig? We actually are a laughing stock watch?v=LReS9bc_hrw 34 mins on that Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bimpy474 Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 Brought in to end a huge feud between Carr and pardew according to Simon bird in tomorrow's mirror. Well i would suppose Carr wouldn't be too happy with Pardew's use of the players he scouted. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vinny Green Balls Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 Brought in to end a huge feud between Carr and pardew according to Simon bird in tomorrow's mirror. Isn't this the worst guy in football to bring in to end a feud? It's like bringing in Mengele to sort out an argument on ethics between two doctors. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belfast Mags Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 Brought in to end a huge feud between Carr and pardew according to Simon bird in tomorrow's mirror. Isn't this the worst guy in football to bring in to end a feud? It's like bringing in Mengele to sort out an argument on ethics between two doctors. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sempuki Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 JFK to solve a feud? Really? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bimpy474 Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 Well it would just have been easy to get rid of Pardew. Don't do easy do we ?. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ikri Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 Brought in to end a huge feud between Carr and pardew according to Simon bird in tomorrow's mirror. He's going to back Pardew isn't he? He's going to look at all those weird foreign names that Carr keeps coming up with compared to Pardew's list of English cloggers and end up fucking Carr off. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
huss9 Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 Newcastle want Joe Kinnear to end "horrible" power struggle between Alan Pardew and scout Graham Carr 20 Jun 2013 22:30 Ashley hopes controversial, combative new director of football can make peace as manager and chief talent-spotter feud over signings Referee! Can Kinnear stop Pardew and Carr "stabbing each other in the back"? Referee! Can Kinnear stop Pardew and Carr "stabbing each other in the back"? Getty Joe Kinnear has been brought to Newcastle United to bang heads together and end a feud between manager Alan Pardew and his chief scout, Graham Carr. Pardew and Carr have been at odds for months, and there have been disagreements over the Magpies' past and future signings. Now Kinnear, a man ironically renowned for his confrontational style and ability to divide opinion, has been parachuted into the internal battle as all-powerful referee and peace-maker. The Geordies' owner, sportswear tycoon Mike Ashley, wanted to introduce a trusted outside figure in a bid to snuff out the damaging power struggle. Pardew has complained that some of the players landed by Carr have not been good enough - a view the latter hotly disputes. For example, midfielder Vurnon Anita was signed for £5.6million from Ajax last summer, but has not been trusted with a long run in the side. Newcastle United Tangled web: Pardew is involved in "frightening" battle of wills Newcastle Utd via Getty There has also been doubt about the best position for France international Moussa Sissoko. He has been played as an attacking midfielder or on the right wing, but could be more influential as a holding midfielder. Carr has championed the policy of buying up young, foreign talent, but Pardew now wants to balance that with a couple of experienced new stars. Success stories from Carr's approach include bargain signings Hatem Ben Arfa and Yohan Cabaye, who were bought for a combined £11m. But with 10 players in his squad for whom French is the first language, Pardew has argued he wants more English speakers with top flight experience to balance the dressing room dynamic and end communication issues. The stand-off between manager and chief scout led to a breakdown in relations towards the end of last season, with the pair said by an insider who had observed the dynamics to be “stabbing each other in the back.” Hit: Carr unearthed Ben Arfa... Ian Horrocks The rift put Ashley in a difficult position as both Pardew and Carr are in the first 12 months of eight-year contracts. Ashley’s disgust at the way Newcastle plunged from fifth-place finishers in 2012 to relegation contenders resulted in his decision to bring in trusted drinking-buddy Kinnear as his eyes and ears at the training ground. The 66-year-old is tasked with reporting directly to Ashley and providing his own take on events. A Toon insider explained: “Carr and Pardew are at daggers drawn. Carr says that the players he has brought in are good enough, Pardew says they are not. “Kinnear has been brought in as a trouble-shooter, as Ashley does not know what to do - he doesn’t know who is right or who is wrong. “Kinnear has been brought in to do Ashley’s dirty work. Miss: ...but Anita has been less successful Michael Regan “There is a stand-off between Carr and Pardew. There was hardly any communication between them towards the end of last season and there is little now. “Both are on massive contracts. Carr is stabbing Pardew in the back, and vice versa. “It is a horrible situation. The internal wranglings and politics at the club is frightening. I’ve never seen or known a situation as intense or as bad as this.” Newcastle’s next signing will be yet another Frenchman - 17-year-old Metz striker Olivier Kemen. Check out all the latest News, Sport & Celeb gossip at Mirror.co.uk http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/newcastle-joe-kinnear-hired-end-1972369#ixzz2WnNAXgjQ Follow us: @DailyMirror on Twitter | DailyMirror on Facebook Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bimpy474 Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 Brought in to end a huge feud between Carr and pardew according to Simon bird in tomorrow's mirror. He's going to back Pardew isn't he? He's going to look at all those weird foreign names that Carr keeps coming up with compared to Pardew's list of English cloggers and end up fucking Carr off. His manager ego might kick in, and he may well go the other way and think Pardew useless. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
High Five o Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 JFK to solve a feud? Really? Better bring the popcorn, it will not end well Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unbelievable Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 IF that turns out to be true, should just have given Pardew the sack. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bimpy474 Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 So Pardew is blaming Carr for the players not being good enough for his tactics, and despite him playing Sissoko out of position, that's also Carr fault. Righto. Pardew doesn't do taking the blame does he. JFK in to calm it all down Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilson Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 Shifting Pardew would have sorted it. The players are good enough, Pardew just hasn't a fucking clue what to do with them and plays them out of position. Fuck off Alan. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bimpy474 Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 IF that turns out to be true, should just have given Pardew the sack. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbo Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 Carr's probably doing his nut at recommending players like Anita - only to see the ball being launched over his head in the brief outings he gets Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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