Jonjo Shelvey (now playing for Çaykur Rizespor, on loan from Nottingham Forest)

[Guest firetotheworks]

With MSC26 on this one tbh. The bloke's obviously a bit of a doylem, but saying we should him and claiming he's not all that good? Christ almighty.

Well he isn't that good in the Premier League

Nor are any of our other players. That's the point. They're either unproven or not very good at this level. When that's the context Shelvey's obviously one of our better players, that's where we are right now.

 

[Beren]

With MSC26 on this one tbh. The bloke's obviously a bit of a doylem, but saying we should him and claiming he's not all that good? Christ almighty.

 

 

Tbf, it's not like it's off the back of one massive rick/error in judgement. People had reservations about him throughout last season too.

It's not? I'm pretty sure that's exactly what it is, like. Not without justification either, mind. As usual it's exaggerated bollocks from the same people. Claim that he's one of our best, or more important players and you see posts about how people supposedly think he's Cantona level important. It's no wonder Ashley gets away with the 'cant compete with Man City' bollocks when we've got people who use the same stupid arguments in our own support.

 

You don't have to think he's the bee's knees, just realise that within the scale of NUFC players, he's one of the better players, and that selling him won't bring in a better player either.

 

I don't know what the missing verb is in your original post (10:49:21), so I focused on the second bit and I think it's fair to criticise Shelvey for not being that good. If specific individuals were waxing lyrical about him last season and have turned on him after yesterday, fine, but a fair few people remained unconvinced of him last season (myself included).

 

He may be a step above Colback, and of course it's all relative but I have never felt confident about him being part of the team's spine. I won't personally give him a free pass because he's the lesser of two devils (neither being actual devils of course). I'd like to see them both replaced in CM. I wouldn't advocate selling him, but I'm not confident about the season with him as a starter. More pressing is getting a striker IMO, but we'll likely get neither.

[Mole_Toonfan]

I know we all want a striker and rightly so, but i don't think it's the most important thing anymore. What's the point in a striker when the team doesn't create chances?

[Hanshithispantz]

We've played one game against Tottenham man

[thenige]

He got away with a few things last season, too.

 

Yeah this. There were too many games where a real officious referee could have sent him off. Just a liability until he can learn that being a 'big man' doesn't equate to being an absolute bellend.

[The College Dropout]

With MSC26 on this one tbh. The bloke's obviously a bit of a doylem, but saying we should him and claiming he's not all that good? Christ almighty.

 

 

Tbf, it's not like it's off the back of one massive rick/error in judgement. People had reservations about him throughout last season too.

It's not? I'm pretty sure that's exactly what it is, like. Not without justification either, mind. As usual it's exaggerated bollocks from the same people. Claim that he's one of our best, or more important players and you see posts about how people supposedly think he's Cantona level important. It's no wonder Ashley gets away with the 'cant compete with Man City' bollocks when we've got people who use the same stupid arguments in our own support.

 

You don't have to think he's the bee's knees, just realise that within the scale of NUFC players, he's one of the better players, and that selling him won't bring in a better player either.

 

I don't know what the missing verb is in your original post (10:49:21), so I focused on the second bit and I think it's fair to criticise Shelvey for not being that good. If specific individuals were waxing lyrical about him last season and have turned on him after yesterday, fine, but a fair few people remained unconvinced of him last season (myself included).

 

He may be a step above Colback, and of course it's all relative but I have never felt confident about him being part of the team's spine. I won't personally give him a free pass because he's the lesser of two devils (neither being actual devils of course). I'd like to see them both replaced in CM. I wouldn't advocate selling him, but I'm not confident about the season with him as a starter. More pressing is getting a striker IMO, but we'll likely get neither.

This is where i'm at. He's not that good and he's a liability to boot.

[Magpie]

The over reaction on here at times is embarrassing mind. Yeah he's a liability and at times has shit for brains but to declare him shite and not good enough is laughable. Funny thing is the guy he did it to is just as much a liability in some people's eyes but because he's a better player he gets away with it. The truth is he is one of our better players and very much needed for this coming season.

[Deuce]

Apparently being seeing a pyschologist since the Forest game last season to tame the red mist.

 

Obviously working well for the idiot.

 

[Guest firetotheworks]

With MSC26 on this one tbh. The bloke's obviously a bit of a doylem, but saying we should him and claiming he's not all that good? Christ almighty.

 

 

Tbf, it's not like it's off the back of one massive rick/error in judgement. People had reservations about him throughout last season too.

It's not? I'm pretty sure that's exactly what it is, like. Not without justification either, mind. As usual it's exaggerated bollocks from the same people. Claim that he's one of our best, or more important players and you see posts about how people supposedly think he's Cantona level important. It's no wonder Ashley gets away with the 'cant compete with Man City' bollocks when we've got people who use the same stupid arguments in our own support.

 

You don't have to think he's the bee's knees, just realise that within the scale of NUFC players, he's one of the better players, and that selling him won't bring in a better player either.

 

I don't know what the missing verb is in your original post (10:49:21), so I focused on the second bit and I think it's fair to criticise Shelvey for not being that good. If specific individuals were waxing lyrical about him last season and have turned on him after yesterday, fine, but a fair few people remained unconvinced of him last season (myself included).

 

He may be a step above Colback, and of course it's all relative but I have never felt confident about him being part of the team's spine. I won't personally give him a free pass because he's the lesser of two devils (neither being actual devils of course). I'd like to see them both replaced in CM. I wouldn't advocate selling him, but I'm not confident about the season with him as a starter. More pressing is getting a striker IMO, but we'll likely get neither.

Sorry, it was sell.

 

Criticism is obviously absolutely fine. FWIW my praise for him last season was almost always with the caveat 'at this level' and I think others were the same. My issue is with changing arguments to make them easy to ridicule, and the supposed lack of awareness of our situation. Thanks to Ashley our spending power is pitiful and yet people are saying we should sell him because him being a knacker on the first game of the season is their final straw.

 

Fair enough if that's the case for anyone, so long as they realise he'd either not be replaced or replaced with someone who isn't as good.

[Darth Crooks]

Apparently being seeing a pyschologist since the Forest game last season to tame the red mist.

 

Obviously working well for the idiot.

 

 

[Darth Crooks]

Regardless of what I said, he's plenty good enough to be in our band of merry men.

[The College Dropout]

No one is going to buy him and pay him what we are.

[The College Dropout]

The over reaction on here at times is embarrassing mind. Yeah he's a liability and at times has s*** for brains but to declare him s**** and not good enough is laughable. Funny thing is the guy he did it to is just as much a liability in some people's eyes but because he's a better player he gets away with it. The truth is he is one of our better players and very much needed for this coming season.

 

He's not the Dele Alli of our team though.

[Cronky]

For me, and I suspect for a few others, this has the feeling of a final straw. He's very prone to these niggly incidents, and to do it when you're the captain, in our first game of the season back in the Premiership, says something about the bloke's mentality. He acts like a park footballer, and you wonder about the overall effect on the team of having a player who you can't rely on.

 

It didn't seem to affect our morale when he went off, and after Merino came on, we actually looked quite positive.

 

Yes, it's probably unrealistic to think of moving him on, because no-one's going to want him right now, but we need to drop the idea that he's an essential player. I'd be quite happy to start planning for a future without him.

[Mole_Toonfan]

We've played one game against Tottenham man

 

While i agree, let's not kid ourselves. Our lack of chance creation has been a problem for years

[Guest firetotheworks]

Yeah, Magpie! Even though you didn't say that Shelvey's the Alli of our team at all, and in fact already said that Alli's a better player, I'd just like to make the completely worthless point that Shelvey's not the Dele Alli of our team.

 

[Marmoset]

Probably too many other positions need strong investment now but yeah, I'd be hoping next year we are looking at a hefty upgrade on him. I like the way he plays but there are far too many 'ifs' with him, and I doubt his mentality is going to change anytime soon.

 

It's not just the cards, sometimes you can just see his head go and it negatively affects his performances too often.

[TRon]

The guy isn't good enough to get away with that kind of crap.

 

He is once, or maybe twice, problem is he keeps making the same mistakes. Personally I've had enough of him, hopefully Merino will grab his chance and we won't miss the baldy twat. He's hardly the all action midfielder that makes much of a difference at this level anyway. His Hollywood passes only make any real difference in the odd game, the rest of the time he might as well not be there.

[sbnufc]

http://www.itv.com/news/2017-08-14/newcastles-shelvey-seeing-psychologist-in-bid-to-curb-anger-issues/

 

Newcastle's Shelvey seeing psychologist in bid to curb anger issues

 

Jonjo Shelvey has admitted he is seeing a psychologist in a bid to curb the anger which is threatening to blight his career.

 

The 25-year-old Newcastle midfielder, who served a five-match ban last season for allegedly racially abusing Wolves counterpart Romain Saiss, was sent off on his return to the Premier League on Sunday after stamping on Tottenham's Dele Alli.

 

Shelvey, who was also dismissed at Nottingham Forest last season for kicking out at Henri Lansbury only to have the red card rescinded later, apologised to his team-mates after the game as television pundits and fans queued up to condemn his behaviour.

 

Speaking in an interview conducted on Friday, but not published until Monday, he told the Daily Mail: "Look, sometimes I just need to rein it in on the football pitch. I need to just shut up and stuff. I need to not get involved and walk away.

 

"I started to see a psychologist last year to work on the mental side of things. It was after the Forest game. I was sent off. I had kicked out at this lad and it was just childish.

 

"When people wind me up, I should just laugh. I do need to get that out of me. Sometimes you can't help it.

 

"I started to work with this fella and after that, there wasn't really an incident when I did that. I started to learn to keep my head down and just get on with the game. But it's an ongoing process and I am still working with him.

 

"Sometimes I can lose my head and it can't keep happening."

 

However, Shelvey did just that four minutes into the second half of Sunday's game and referee Andre Marriner sent him off, in the process ending any chance of a positive result for the promoted side.

 

Goals from Alli and Ben Davies eventually secured victory for Spurs to leave manager Rafael Benitez bemoaning his captain's indiscipline.

 

Keeper Rob Elliot revealed Shelvey, who now faces a three-match ban, cut a disconsolate figure in the dressing room afterwards, but admitted he needed to channel his passion if he is to make the most of his career.

 

Elliot told NUFC TV: "He was down, he was dejected. He knows he's messed up and he held his hands up.

 

"It doesn't make it right, but that's Jonjo. He's come a long way since he's been here - the training regime he does on and off the pitch, he's working, he's working on things and he's a great lad.

 

"He cares, he's passionate and sometimes that boils over, and he's got to learn to deal with that because he could honestly play for any team he wants to and we are very fortunate we have got him here.

 

"But also on the same side, we have got to make sure we help him to be the best player he can be and take us up the league and to do that, we need him on the pitch.

 

"Hopefully this is a good learning curve for him, we can get him back out there and he can push on and help us get up the league."

 

Tottenham striker Harry Kane might have suffered a similar fate, in Elliot's opinion, for a challenge on Florian Lejeune which left the defender on crutches but cost him only a yellow card.

 

The Republic of Ireland international said: "In today's game, I don't understand why that's not a red card. Poor Flo, I don't know how bad it is, but he's in a bad way.

 

"No excuses for Jonjo, he knows he's got to hold his hands up and he will, but I was a bit disappointed with the tackle on Flo. I didn't think it was a very good tackle, if I'm honest."

 

 

Should get his money back

[Kanj]

Really for me is how he absolutely let himself, team, manager, and all of us down in our return to the PL at home on the big stage. Just shockingly stupid after being in great shape and having a fantastic preseason. Still seething at this as I'm convinced we'd have battled for at least a point.

[Consortium of one]

Really for me is how he absolutely let himself, team, manager, and all of us down in our return to the PL at home on the big stage. Just shockingly stupid after being in great shape and having a fantastic preseason. Still seething at this as I'm convinced we'd have battled for at least a point.

 

Exactly, he really let the team down.  I think he's important to the way we play and he should go straight into the side when he gets back but he shouldn't wear the armband until he proves he has worked past these issues.  Dele was cuntish and either he was going to get a red or someone else was and Shelvey capitulated and let Dele off the hook.

[The College Dropout]

We've played one game against Tottenham man

 

While i agree, let's not kid ourselves. Our lack of chance creation has been a problem for years

Creativity is a upper midtable problem. Our defending is what relegated us last time.

[Mole_Toonfan]

We've played one game against Tottenham man

 

While i agree, let's not kid ourselves. Our lack of chance creation has been a problem for years

Creativity is a upper midtable problem. Our defending is what relegated us last time.

 

I don't think that's going to be a problem this time, as long as we don't get more injuries than we already have.

[TRon]

Really for me is how he absolutely let himself, team, manager, and all of us down in our return to the PL at home on the big stage. Just shockingly stupid after being in great shape and having a fantastic preseason. Still seething at this as I'm convinced we'd have battled for at least a point.

 

Exactly, he really let the team down.  I think he's important to the way we play and he should go straight into the side when he gets back but he shouldn't wear the armband until he proves he has worked past these issues.  Dele was cuntish and either he was going to get a red or someone else was and Shelvey capitulated and let Dele off the hook.

 

I don't really see what Alli did that was so bad, he tapped the ball away to stop Shelvey picking it up quickly. If that's Shelvey's response after having psychological treatment you have to wonder when it's ever going to change.

[Stottie]

Apparently being seeing a pyschologist since the Forest game last season to tame the red mist.

 

Obviously working well for the idiot.

 

I suspect the "red mist" is an incurable problem for some players, some of the legends. How many times was Zidane sent off? See also Roy Keane, Gerrard, etc.

 

The problem with Shelvey is that he is unproven as a "the red mist is worth it" player in the Premiership. He was easily better than so many Championship midfielders that his disciplinary problems weren't a problem in that league. He was offering enough in the games he did play. He's now playing at a much higher standard though, and either has to perform at a level that still makes him worth it or cut it out so it is not an issue.