NUFC : Next Manager (Bruce is here forever)

[TRon]

I actually really enjoyed seeing how well organised we were.  It was quite cathartic knowing your manager knew what he was doing and wasnt relying on mavericks or 'big performances' week in week out.

 

I still dont understand why people ignore what he achieved in the second half of the season when he had Almiron at his disposal.

 

Tbf, I judged him on his time at Liverpool where his caution against weaker teams probably cost them the title. Always tagged him as more of a cup winner than a title type. That said, I have said in the other thread that given he is highly intelligent and a student of the game, he's probably moved on quite a lot since those days. He doesn't seem the type not to learn and adapt to the modern game and more effective styles of the day. Would love to see what he would produce now if he had a quality squad available to him.

[Thumbheed]

I actually really enjoyed seeing how well organised we were.  It was quite cathartic knowing your manager knew what he was doing and wasnt relying on mavericks or 'big performances' week in week out.

 

I still dont understand why people ignore what he achieved in the second half of the season when he had Almiron at his disposal.

 

Tbf, I judged him on his time at Liverpool where his caution against weaker teams probably cost them the title. Always tagged him as more of a cup winner than a title type. That said, I have said in the other thread that given he is highly intelligent and a student of the game, he's probably moved on quite a lot since those days. He doesn't seem the type not to learn and adapt to the modern game and more effective styles of the day. Would love to see what he would produce now if he had a quality squad available to him.

 

This is the thing that excites me most. Although it's a double edged sword in the sense that I actually don't actually think he bought well for the Championship season and he does have that precedent of buying hard to shift dross.

[Paully]

 

 

This is the thing that excites me most. Although it's a double edged sword in the sense that I actually don't actually think he bought well for the Championship season and he does have that precedent of buying hard to shift dross.

 

You don’t think Rafa bought well in the Championship?! WTF?!

[bowlingcrofty]

His signings basically got us promoted.

 

Only really Sels and Jesus Gamez who didn’t really work out.

[Guest reefatoon]

Lazaar too. Actually, was he championship?

[Chicane]

Hasn't Rafa himself said that as a manager you basically hope for a ~70% success rate with signings?

 

Ain't gonna pretend like I've actually crunched the numbers but off the top of my head I think he probably hit that mark here

[Ikon]

Spending more cash doesn't guarantee success but it surely makes it less of a lottery finding the right ones.

[Guest NobbyOhNobby]

Alex Ferguson was a shit manager because he signed William Prunier, Kleberson, Taibi, Djemba-Djemba, Manucho and Bebe

[Dr.Spaceman]

I'd imagine we'd have agents chucking themselves at us from all directions. It'll be a nightmare trying to sort transfers with them knowing how much we've got behind us. It'll be one fee for us and Man City and a fee for everyone else.

[Thumbheed]

 

 

This is the thing that excites me most. Although it's a double edged sword in the sense that I actually don't actually think he bought well for the Championship season and he does have that precedent of buying hard to shift dross.

 

You don’t think Rafa bought well in the Championship?! WTF?!

Maybe it's a relic of the Ashley philosophy, but even at the time I thought players like Gayle and Ritchie were championship standard players and it all felt a bit short term.

 

Ritchie

Yedlin

Gayle

Hanley

Murphy

Sels

Diame

Hayden

 

All very very good buys for a Championship team looking to get up, but I always felt we were a Prem club in the Championship and so maybe we could have bought with one eye on our return to the Prem in mind.

 

Ritchie dropping down a division when he was already established at a good prem club showed that we did still have that pull. In my opinion we could have bought more players who would have been good enough for both the Prem and the Championsip, but instead, we went almost exclusively for players who were only good enough for the Championship.

 

 

 

 

[SUPERTOON]

 

 

This is the thing that excites me most. Although it's a double edged sword in the sense that I actually don't actually think he bought well for the Championship season and he does have that precedent of buying hard to shift dross.

 

You don’t think Rafa bought well in the Championship?! WTF?!

Maybe it's a relic of the Ashley philosophy, but even at the time I thought players like Gayle and Ritchie were championship standard players and it all felt a bit short term.

 

Ritchie

Yedlin

Gayle

Hanley

Murphy

Sels

Diame

Hayden

 

All very very good buys for a Championship team looking to get up, but I always felt we were a Prem club in the Championship and so maybe we could have bought with one eye on our return to the Prem in mind.

 

Ritchie dropping down a division when he was already established at a good prem club showed that we did still have that pull. In my opinion we could have bought more players who would have been good enough for both the Prem and the Championsip, but instead, we went almost exclusively for players who were only good enough for the Championship.

 

 

 

 

 

Pretty sure he had deals lined up and pretty much done for Townsend and loftus cheek on loan in the January only for Ashley to pull the plug.

 

That was kind of the turning point in him being unhappy

[Guest Butcher]

Ritchie, Yedlin, Gayle, Diame and Hayden are/were all good enough for the PL.

[Conjo]

 

 

This is the thing that excites me most. Although it's a double edged sword in the sense that I actually don't actually think he bought well for the Championship season and he does have that precedent of buying hard to shift dross.

 

You don’t think Rafa bought well in the Championship?! WTF?!

Maybe it's a relic of the Ashley philosophy, but even at the time I thought players like Gayle and Ritchie were championship standard players and it all felt a bit short term.

 

Ritchie

Yedlin

Gayle

Hanley

Murphy

Sels

Diame

Hayden

 

All very very good buys for a Championship team looking to get up, but I always felt we were a Prem club in the Championship and so maybe we could have bought with one eye on our return to the Prem in mind.

 

Ritchie dropping down a division when he was already established at a good prem club showed that we did still have that pull. In my opinion we could have bought more players who would have been good enough for both the Prem and the Championsip, but instead, we went almost exclusively for players who were only good enough for the Championship.

 

 

 

 

 

Ritchie, Yedlin, Diame and Hayden all played a big part in retaining our PL status in the first season.

[Thumbheed]

 

 

This is the thing that excites me most. Although it's a double edged sword in the sense that I actually don't actually think he bought well for the Championship season and he does have that precedent of buying hard to shift dross.

 

You don’t think Rafa bought well in the Championship?! WTF?!

Maybe it's a relic of the Ashley philosophy, but even at the time I thought players like Gayle and Ritchie were championship standard players and it all felt a bit short term.

 

Ritchie

Yedlin

Gayle

Hanley

Murphy

Sels

Diame

Hayden

 

All very very good buys for a Championship team looking to get up, but I always felt we were a Prem club in the Championship and so maybe we could have bought with one eye on our return to the Prem in mind.

 

Ritchie dropping down a division when he was already established at a good prem club showed that we did still have that pull. In my opinion we could have bought more players who would have been good enough for both the Prem and the Championsip, but instead, we went almost exclusively for players who were only good enough for the Championship.

 

 

 

 

 

Pretty sure he had deals lined up and pretty much done for Townsend and loftus cheek on loan in the January only for Ashley to pull the plug.

 

That was kind of the turning point in him being unhappy

I don't doubt thay for a second, but it felt like he had free reign in the summer and bought what he bought.

 

All I'm saying is that at the time, I didnt think they were great buys. I cant remember the quality of players in the championship back then, but even now you can see so many players who are clearly good enough to establish themselves as very good prem players, I always felt we should have been hoovering up all that talent. Instead we went for good Championship players who would have ended up as average prem players. Obviously players like Hayden and Diame ended up having spells of being very very good in the Prem, bit can't really say the same for others.

[Dokko]

I'd imagine we'd have agents chucking themselves at us from all directions. It'll be a nightmare trying to sort transfers with them knowing how much we've got behind us. It'll be one fee for us and Man City and a fee for everyone else.

 

Can work for us as well. More options as we can meet the fees being asked by clubs and players will be more likely to want to join. So if one agent/club/player takes the piss we just move on to another top target.

 

Think after all the cv19 football finances will be reigned back in a bit. Maybe even wages capped and agents regulated.

[Yorkie]

I think the £~22m we spent on Gayle and Ritchie is literally some of the best best money we've ever spent. Can't underestimate how vital it was to get promoted and then stay up, and those two had an enormous part in that.

 

He made four outright bad signings imo. Sels, Lazaar, Murphy and Muto.

[Thumbheed]

 

 

This is the thing that excites me most. Although it's a double edged sword in the sense that I actually don't actually think he bought well for the Championship season and he does have that precedent of buying hard to shift dross.

 

You don’t think Rafa bought well in the Championship?! WTF?!

Maybe it's a relic of the Ashley philosophy, but even at the time I thought players like Gayle and Ritchie were championship standard players and it all felt a bit short term.

 

Ritchie

Yedlin

Gayle

Hanley

Murphy

Sels

Diame

Hayden

 

All very very good buys for a Championship team looking to get up, but I always felt we were a Prem club in the Championship and so maybe we could have bought with one eye on our return to the Prem in mind.

 

Ritchie dropping down a division when he was already established at a good prem club showed that we did still have that pull. In my opinion we could have bought more players who would have been good enough for both the Prem and the Championsip, but instead, we went almost exclusively for players who were only good enough for the Championship.

 

 

 

 

 

Ritchie, Yedlin, Diame and Hayden all played a big part in retaining our PL status in the first season.

 

And yet we're struggling to shift them all because no other team in the Prem wants them. At some point you have to take a step back and ask yourself why?

 

Like I say, Rafa is my only choice as manager of the club and I would be genuinely gutted if it was literally anyone else, but the point I was responding to was about him getting free reign to sign who he'd like and the only time I remember him having that at Newcastle was summer 2016 and I didnt think he signed that well.

 

I'm well aware that when he had free reign at Napoli, he signed some unreal players so it's a side note rather than a major sleight on his transfer ability.

[Thumbheed]

I think the £~22m we spent on Gayle and Ritchie is literally some of the best best money we've ever spent. Can't underestimate how vital it was to get promoted and then stay up, and those two had an enormous part in that.

 

He made four outright bad signings imo. Sels, Lazaar, Murphy and Muto.

 

I kind of disagree. Like it was said earlier, we had deals lined up for Townsend and Loftus Cheek. There is a world of difference between Gayle/Ritchie and Townsend/Loftus Cheek.

 

They were the type of players I felt we should have gone for. Given the choice now, who would you have taken? If players of the calibre of Townsend and Loftus Cheek were willing to come to is in the January window, wouldnt it have been likely that a similar calibre of player would have come in the preceding summer?

[Dokko]

I think the £~22m we spent on Gayle and Ritchie is literally some of the best best money we've ever spent. Can't underestimate how vital it was to get promoted and then stay up, and those two had an enormous part in that.

 

He made four outright bad signings imo. Sels, Lazaar, Murphy and Muto.

 

Sels is doing alright in France isn't he? Also we got our money back (5.5) with loan (1.8) and transfer (3.5) fee. Don't think we needed a GK at the time mind. Lazaar was only 2.3m, i reckon we'd have seen half that back with loan fees as well.

 

Muto & Murphy though, at the time where we really needed players to challenge were a huge waste of resources and hindered us.

 

I'd add Joselu to the shit list. Atsu was close to being mentioned but tbh in his loan spell here he was good and i would have signed him in case he stepped up.

[joeyt]

We aren't struggling to shift them though are we?

 

The club just gave Ritchie a 3 year extension, there were plenty of clubs interested in Hayden and Diame's gone

[Thumbheed]

I think the £~22m we spent on Gayle and Ritchie is literally some of the best best money we've ever spent. Can't underestimate how vital it was to get promoted and then stay up, and those two had an enormous part in that.

 

He made four outright bad signings imo. Sels, Lazaar, Murphy and Muto.

 

Sels is doing alright in France isn't he? Also we got our money back (5.5) with loan (1.8) and transfer (3.5) fee. Don't think we needed a GK at the time mind. Lazaar was only 2.3m, i reckon we'd have seen half that back with loan fees as well.

 

Muto & Murphy though, at the time where we really needed players to challenge were a huge waste of resources and hindered us.

 

I'd add Joselu to the s*** list. Atsu was close to being mentioned but tbh in his loan spell here he was good and i would have signed him in case he stepped up.

 

To be fair to Rafa, I think his hands were tied by that point so I dont actually blame him at all for some of the s*** we bought when we got up. If anything it was a testament to his ability as a coach/manager to achieve what he did with some of that dross.

[Dokko]

I think the £~22m we spent on Gayle and Ritchie is literally some of the best best money we've ever spent. Can't underestimate how vital it was to get promoted and then stay up, and those two had an enormous part in that.

 

He made four outright bad signings imo. Sels, Lazaar, Murphy and Muto.

 

I kind of disagree. Like it was said earlier, we had deals lined up for Townsend and Loftus Cheek. There is a world of difference between Gayle/Ritchie and Townsend/Loftus Cheek.

 

They were the type of players I felt we should have gone for. Given the choice now, who would you have taken? If players of the calibre of Townsend and Loftus Cheek were willing to come to is in the January window, wouldnt it have been likely that a similar calibre of player would have come in the preceding summer?

 

Ashley pulled the plug on those deals and when we did go back for Townsend Fat head was being a cunt and wouldn't do a deal at the same price.

 

Rafa was getting in his 5th-10th choices due to budgets and slow movement from the club. We'll be hitting the top end of the list this time round. It will be totally different.

[Thumbheed]

We aren't struggling to shift them though are we?

 

The club just gave Ritchie a 3 tweet year extension, there were plenty of clubs interested in Hayden and Diame's gone

 

Who's happy that we have Ritchie for another 3 years? That's got Bruce written all over it, Diame literally left on a free, he could have been signed for a nominal fee by anyone who really wanted him, and Hayden has literally been begging to leave and still can't orchestrate a move.

[joeyt]

We aren't struggling to shift them though are we?

 

The club just gave Ritchie a 3 tweet year extension, there were plenty of clubs interested in Hayden and Diame's gone

 

Who's happy that we have Ritchie for another 3 years? That's got Bruce written all over it, Diame literally left on a free, he could have been signed for a nominal fee by anyone who really wanted him, and Hayden has literally been begging to leave and still can't orchestrate a move.

 

That's not Rafa's fault though is it? Rafa bought Diame and Ritchie to get us out of the Championship and solidify our place in the Prem, which they did. Rafa would have moved Ritchie on last summer or this summer

 

Loads of clubs would have bought Hayden but we didn't sell him and his personal problems seem to have eased

[Thumbheed]

I think the £~22m we spent on Gayle and Ritchie is literally some of the best best money we've ever spent. Can't underestimate how vital it was to get promoted and then stay up, and those two had an enormous part in that.

 

He made four outright bad signings imo. Sels, Lazaar, Murphy and Muto.

 

I kind of disagree. Like it was said earlier, we had deals lined up for Townsend and Loftus Cheek. There is a world of difference between Gayle/Ritchie and Townsend/Loftus Cheek.

 

They were the type of players I felt we should have gone for. Given the choice now, who would you have taken? If players of the calibre of Townsend and Loftus Cheek were willing to come to is in the January window, wouldnt it have been likely that a similar calibre of player would have come in the preceding summer?

 

Ashley pulled the plug on those deals and when we did go back for Townsend Fat head was being a c*** and wouldn't do a deal at the same price.

 

Rafa was getting in his 5th-10th choices due to budgets and slow movement from the club. We'll be hitting the top end of the list this time round. It will be totally different.

 

Again, it's not about the actual deals per se and why we didnt sign them, it's the fact that that calibre of player was willing to come to us and yet in the summer preceding that we signed players of a lower calibre. If you know you can sign higher calibre players, theres no real excuse not to. Those players would have not only lifted us out the championship but would have also been excellent in the premiership too. Ritchie and Gayle were excellent championship players but average prem players. Hodgson and Howe clearly thought the same as well...