Now That's What I Call Transfer Rumours! 7

[KaKa]

5 minutes ago, Vinny Green Balls said:

Do you really want to know how he’s come to any conclusion?

 

Fair point!

[Keegans Export]

32 minutes ago, The College Dropout said:

Do the remaining 4 games not count at the end of the season?

 

I'm sure Eddie Howe would prefer to have all of the key transfers done in time for the players to join pre-season tour, begin to get to grips with environment, tactics etc. 

 

From the information available... we are monitoring the market e.g. no formal bids have been made.

 

It is worrying and sub-optimal.

 

It looks like we will do business very late and look to see what's available rather than identifying particular players which iss not the best approach.

Well yeah but surely we're better aiming to get our primary targets, even if that means waiting, rather than either over-paying for them or just bringing in whoever we can now because ohmygodtheresonlyjustovertwoweeksleftandwedesperatelyneedsomebodyANYBODY

 

The rest of that post is just you getting worried by stuff you don't actually know - "From the information available..." and "It looks like we will..."

 

As I said, compare our transfer business to those around us (or those we expect to finish around us). Apart from West Ham who I think have recruited very well, I don't think we're being left behind by any of them. Do you?

[Kimbo]

I have concerns, and no I’m not panicking or bedwetting, and no I don’t think it’s like Mike Ashley all over again.

 

It won’t be the worst thing in the world if we fail to get a couple of attacking players, we can still finish 8th-10th, but I think there is an opportunity to finish top 6 this season and we will have missed it. The Maddison bid is still very strange to me, I don’t know if we’re playing a long game where we’ll bid again late in the window or in January. Surely they didn’t think they could get it done with the reported bids.

[The College Dropout]

25 minutes ago, KaKa said:

 

Can you please explain how you've come to this conclusion?

An attacker has been priority 1 all summer. It’s 12/8 they’ve been working on this for at least 3 months. Safe to say we haven’t landed our primary targets.  If you believe the reports FFP is front and centre of our thoughts, as is value for money, we have a limited amount we are willing to pay total and upfront. 
 

Similar to City’s backup left back search.  Whoever they sign isn’t first choice Cucurella was their man. That was their ideal candidate. They’ve got a limited budget and they’ll see what’s available for that price on the market that fits their team well enough. For a backup left back - that’s fine.  You take Haaland or Phillips - these were likely primary targets for crucial roles. Both are fair to great prices but in the past (Grealish, Walker etc.) they’ve proven they’ll do everything in their power to get their man. Rather than move down the list. 
 

 

 

Late in the window you either sign players teams are aREALLY want to sell or loan (Tielemans) or you pay over the odds for players teams really don’t want to seek (Fofana). Because there’s little time to get in a replacement  and teams have planned and prepared for the season with those players in mind. 
 

 

So take Ramos. Reports are Benfica are more than willing to sell him. He’s available. We won’t pay a premium to bring him in because we think he’s the perfect fit for the team.  Of course his profile will also need to fit well enough. 

[WarrenBartonCentrePartin]

[The College Dropout]

13 minutes ago, Keegans Export said:

Well yeah but surely we're better aiming to get our primary targets, even if that means waiting, rather than either over-paying for them or just bringing in whoever we can now because ohmygodtheresonlyjustovertwoweeksleftandwedesperatelyneedsomebodyANYBODY

 

The rest of that post is just you getting worried by stuff you don't actually know - "From the information available..." and "It looks like we will..."

 

As I said, compare our transfer business to those around us (or those we expect to finish around us). Apart from West Ham who I think have recruited very well, I don't think we're being left behind by any of them. Do you?

At the time people thought VVD and Allison were overpayments. But they got the men required to take them to the next level. So no, I don’t mind overpaying for the right players. Sometimes even that isn’t possible.  In any case, we won’t do that. 
 

 

Robert and Bellamy were both back up signings.  We missed out on Zenden and Jeffers.  Sometimes a team NEEDS signings.  They proved to be transformational signings for us. I’m not against getting significantly better players in than what we have even if they aren’t primary targets. I’m confident we’ll sign attacking players (even on loan) and won’t keep our paint dry anyway. 
 

 

There’s potentially a big opportunity cost to keeping the powder dry and I don’t think we’ll do that.  It could be the difference between 11th and 7/8th and European football. 

[LV]

35 minutes ago, The College Dropout said:

Burn is unlikely to be in our strongest XI within 10 months of signing.  His resale value is low. 
 

From what I understand FFP is the primary blocker for significant investment. Buying players for the short-term with low resale value isn’t the move unless they really push us up the league or have tremendous quality (Trippier). The £10-20m we spend chip away at our FFP budget. 
 

We had to do it in January for Wood (didn’t work so much) and Burn but we won’t do it going forward as a strategy. I think that was part of the thinking that delayed the Targett transfer. We probably want an upgrade relatively soon.  But at 26 and  consistent performances we could get our money back and some of our existing fullbacks could have decent sale value too. 
 

Not saying he’s a bad signing. He’s already achieved what he was brought in for. But going forward the strategy needs to change. 

This is absolutely fair. 

[Mattoon]

4 minutes ago, The College Dropout said:

At the time people thought VVD and Allison were overpayments. But they got the men required to take them to the next level. So no, I don’t mind overpaying for the right players. Sometimes even that isn’t possible.  In any case, we won’t do that. 
 

 

Robert and Bellamy were both back up signings.  We missed out on Zenden and Jeffers.  Sometimes a team NEEDS signings.  They proved to be transformational signings for us. I’m not against getting significantly better players in than what we have even if they aren’t primary targets. I’m confident we’ll sign attacking players (even on loan) and won’t keep our paint dry anyway. 
 

 

There’s potentially a big opportunity cost to keeping the powder dry and I don’t think we’ll do that.  It could be the difference between 11th and 7/8th and European football. 

 

Liverpool could afford to overpay for the right players they had just sold Coutinho for £121.5m different financial clout all together. I'm sure if we had money to burn we would push the boat out a bit further but we're working under difficult constraints.

 

Eddie will get what he needs, it might not be first choice but I don't think we'll "settle" either.

[KaKa]

8 minutes ago, The College Dropout said:

An attacker has been priority 1 all summer. It’s 12/8 they’ve been working on this for at least 3 months. Safe to say we haven’t landed our primary targets.  If you believe the reports FFP is front and centre of our thoughts, as is value for money, we have a limited amount we are willing to pay total and upfront. 
 

Similar to City’s backup left back search.  Whoever they sign isn’t first choice Cucurella was their man. That was their ideal candidate. They’ve got a limited budget and they’ll see what’s available for that price on the market that fits their team well enough. For a backup left back - that’s fine.  You take Haaland or Phillips - these were likely primary targets for crucial roles. Both are fair to great prices but in the past (Grealish, Walker etc.) they’ve proven they’ll do everything in their power to get their man. Rather than move down the list. 
 

 

 

Late in the window you either sign players teams are aREALLY want to sell or loan (Tielemans) or you pay over the odds for players teams really don’t want to seek (Fofana). Because there’s little time to get in a replacement  and teams have planned and prepared for the season with those players in mind. 
 

 

So take Ramos. Reports are Benfica are more than willing to sell him. He’s available. We won’t pay a premium to bring him in because we think he’s the perfect fit for the team.  Of course his profile will also need to fit well enough. 

 

I have no idea why you think every club has one primary target and outside of that they then wait to see what's available. That's not how transfers work. There are typically multiple options some of which are all around the same calibre, and some of which are a little bit under that and then some lower down.

 

Also, your late in the window assertions don't apply when there are three weeks remaining and not a couple of days.

 

I'm not sure what you were saying about Ramos and us not wanting to pay a premium. The Portuguese reporter that seemed most clued up said we'd be bidding right around the price Benfica were looking to sell, and so it would then depend on structure and add-ons, which is probably what is being discussed and agreed on at the minute.

[Happinesstan]

47 minutes ago, Optimistic Nut said:

 

Think it's a fair point tbf. Perfect for where we were 8 months ago and having a few in the side like him and Targett is ok, if you add too many more we'll be a mid-table side. I don't see many positions we need with that sort of profile now, next step is clear upgrades l.

It's the one position where we now have genuine competition for the place. And Keeper of course. The very fact that we're discussing when our £30 million pound signing will start is testament to this.

[LV]

24 minutes ago, Kimbo said:

I have concerns, and no I’m not panicking or bedwetting, and no I don’t think it’s like Mike Ashley all over again.

 

It won’t be the worst thing in the world if we fail to get a couple of attacking players, we can still finish 8th-10th, but I think there is an opportunity to finish top 6 this season and we will have missed it. The Maddison bid is still very strange to me, I don’t know if we’re playing a long game where we’ll bid again late in the window or in January. Surely they didn’t think they could get it done with the reported bids.

Maybe they thought they may as well try and fail than not try at all. 

[The College Dropout]

59 minutes ago, Optimistic Nut said:

 

Think it's a fair point tbf. Perfect for where we were 8 months ago and having a few in the side like him and Targett is ok, if you add too many more we'll be a mid-table side. I don't see many positions we need with that sort of profile now, next step is clear upgrades l.

You got it and articulated the reasoning in less words.

[KaKa]

1 hour ago, Optimistic Nut said:

 

Think it's a fair point tbf. Perfect for where we were 8 months ago and having a few in the side like him and Targett is ok, if you add too many more we'll be a mid-table side. I don't see many positions we need with that sort of profile now, next step is clear upgrades l.

 

The question is why anyone would think we'd just be bringing in players of that profile and not upgrades?

 

I've honestly lost count of how many times Howe has said he is looking for quality and not quantity, and targeting players that will improve the team for those positions in forward areas.

 

January was a completely different set of circumstances where it is particularly difficult to get in top payers mid way through the season and so we went with some tried and tested Prem players to keep us up, two of whom played at a level higher than expected and have now cemented themselves as key players.

 

Clearly if it's taking this long it is because they think it will be beneficial for some of the targets they have in mind. Some really good teams are going to have players that want to move on or that the clubs are ready to let move on. The club will have better information than all of us via player's agents.

 

I'm pretty certain they are not just out here with their hands on their heads waiting to see what falls out of the sky. No chance.

 

 

Edited August 12, 2022 by KaKa

[The College Dropout]

4 minutes ago, KaKa said:

 

I have no idea why you think every club has one primary target and outside of that they then wait to see what's available. That's not how transfers work. There are typically multiple options some of which are all around the same calibre, and some of which are a little bit under that and then some lower down.

 

Also, your late in the window assertions don't apply when there are three weeks remaining and not a couple of days.

 

I'm not sure what you were saying about Ramos and us not wanting to pay a premium. The Portuguese reporter that seemed most clued up said we'd be bidding right around the price Benfica were looking to sell, and so it would then depend on structure and add-ons, which is probably what is being discussed and agreed on at the minute.

A club might have 1-3 primary targets for a position. Once you go further - it is no longer primary.

 

Hugo was plan A. Evidently we didn't have much of a plan B because we still don't have an attacker in - a month after that deal fell through. I think our other primary targets were that Winger from the German division (too expensive), Isak (too expensive), Harrison (bid rumoured - too expensive). We moved on to the likes of Maddison, who at this point was clearly not a primary target (bid - too expensive).  Again suggesting we had not done that much research into what they might cost (Harrison and JM at least).

 

Of course it applies. Every relevant league in Europe will have started by the weekend. It is late in the window. You either sign players who clubs were hoping to sell anyway or pay a premium.

[toon25]

53 minutes ago, TRon said:

 

 

We finished 11th last season, pretty sure a lot of that was down to Dan Burn and his rock solid defending. I would have though the higher placed finish would have paid for his transfer fee in itself, never mind his contribution towards us avoiding relegation.

 

Couldn't agree more, Tron.

 

Burn has been nothing short of brilliant - on the pitch and off it. 

 

He's an integral part of the squad and of our building process. 

[Hanshithispantz]

2 minutes ago, The College Dropout said:

A club might have 1-3 primary targets for a position. Once you go further - it is no longer primary.

 

Hugo was plan A. Evidently we didn't have much of a plan B because we still don't have an attacker in - a month after that deal fell through. I think our other primary targets were that Winger from the German division (too expensive), Isak (too expensive), Harrison (bid rumoured - too expensive). We moved on to the likes of Maddison, who at this point was clearly not a primary target (bid - too expensive).  Again suggesting we had not done that much research into what they might cost (Harrison and JM at least).

 

Of course it applies. Every relevant league in Europe will have started by the weekend. It is late in the window. You either sign players who clubs were hoping to sell anyway or pay a premium.

Or we do and we're just not going to rush it through, exactly what happened with both Ekitike and Botman (both carried over from January).

 

 

Edited August 12, 2022 by Hanshithispantz

[B-more Mag]

1 hour ago, KaKa said:

One name I really hope we are keeping an eye on for that wide forward role is Jonathan David.

 

Our good fried Paulo Fonseca (!) made a great start in Ligue 1 with Lille last weekend, and is using Jonathan David on the right hand side as a wide forward, and he had a double last week and an assist. He looked good there.

I’d love him here. 

[The College Dropout]

9 minutes ago, KaKa said:

 

The question is why anyone would think we'd just be bringing in players of that profile and not upgrades?

 

I've honestly lost count of how many times Howe has said he is looking for quality and not quantity, and targeting players that will improve the team for those positions in forward areas.

 

January was a completely different set of circumstances where it is particularly difficult to get in top payers mid way through the season and so we went with some tried and tested Prem players to keep us up, two of whom played at a level higher than expected and have now cemented themselves as key players.

 

Clearly if it's taking this long it is because they think it will be beneficial for some of the targets they have in mind. Some really good teams are going to have players that want to move on or that the clubs are ready to let move on. The club will have better information than all of us via player's agents.

 

I'm pretty certain they are not just out here with their hands on their heads waiting to see what falls out of the sky. No chance.

 

 

 

This convo all came from me and LV talking about short-term signings (eg Dan Burn, Chris Wood) approach we had in January. We both agreed we wouldn't do that again this summer but I thought we would be willing to do it on loan rather than a permanent signing.

 

People got butthurt that I used Burn as an example. Strategically, Burn and Wood  (ability wise I think Targett was also in ths bracket) are the same type of signing - one worked, one hasn't. 

[The College Dropout]

4 minutes ago, Hanshithispantz said:

Or we do and we're just not going to rush it through, exactly what happened with both Ekitike and Botman (both carried over from January).

 

 

 

Plan B for Botman was Dan Burn. THINK HANS THINK. 

 

Signing a second attacker in January wasn't a priority. Otherwise we would've signed someone - even if it was on loan. So we waited. It's a priority now though. And we'll sign someone, even on loan.

[Hanshithispantz]

You consistently apply a pointlessly negative spin to everything man. Even when you talk about Joelinton it has to be that "he's not good enough on the ball to take us forward and will need to be replaced" 

 

In anycase we seem to be trying to bring in world class players for a decent fee (under 40m it seems). We've done that with Bruno and you hope the same with Botman. Ekitike was obviously expected to be one of the biggest French talents in a few years (and PSG seem to agree), that fell through but would have been a similar price. Diaby and Lodi we both seemed to be priced out of. If we continue our progression over the next couple of windows we'll have a very good side.

[Shearergol]

You never know, perhaps the club had Burn in mind as a squad player after we signed Botman? Little bit unfair to lump him in the same sentence as Wood, who was a clear panic buy.

[OverThere]

Striker on loan is likely at this point and that means close to the deadline 

[Hanshithispantz]

2 minutes ago, The College Dropout said:

Plan B for Botman was Dan Burn. THINK HANS THINK. 

 

Signing a second attacker in January wasn't a priority. Otherwise we would've signed someone - even if it was on loan. So we waited. It's a priority now though. And we'll sign someone, even on loan.

You honestly believe Dan Burn was Botman's replacement? 

 

Dan Burn and Targett were signed because our defence was absolutely atrocious - we needed players in. Botman was signed because we've clearly identified him as a massive talent for a great price.

 

 

Edited August 12, 2022 by Hanshithispantz

[KaKa]

8 minutes ago, B-more Mag said:

I’d love him here. 

 

I think he's brilliant. 

 

In Belgium he sometimes played behind a front two as an attacking midfielder, for the national team he has played from wide positions while Larin is the lead striker, and at Lille he has previously played in a front two partnership, and now looks like he will play from the right this season.

 

All different roles and yet the goals continue to flow. Just hope once he does move it will be to a decent situation. Seen him linked with Man Utd, which could be terrible with the state they're in.

[KaKa]

4 minutes ago, The College Dropout said:

Plan B for Botman was Dan Burn. THINK HANS THINK. 

 

Signing a second attacker in January wasn't a priority. Otherwise we would've signed someone - even if it was on loan. So we waited. It's a priority now though. And we'll sign someone, even on loan.

 

No he was not.

 

He was a temporary fix that would then ultimately replace Clarke once Botman was brought in.