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Respectfully disagree. As a creator of chances you don’t just play passes where you think the finisher should be, you play them where the finisher will put it away. Our wingers apart from Murph have to adapt to what Nick needs to get the ball in the back of the net. 

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11 hours ago, Heron said:

That goal man. Devine. Delicious. Scrum-diddly-umptious. Yet...worth nothing. 🫣

 

 

 

That was the major disappointment of the day for me. Always annoying when great goals ultimately count for nothing.

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Imagine how many goals he would be scoring for us with top notch wingers around him, instead of mr. can't beat a man and mr. don't know what to do with the ball. Need to start Murphy going forward. Atleast he creates.

 

 

Edited by Erikse

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9 hours ago, Kanj said:

Respectfully disagree. As a creator of chances you don’t just play passes where you think the finisher should be, you play them where the finisher will put it away. Our wingers apart from Murph have to adapt to what Nick needs to get the ball in the back of the net. 

And Id say Nick needs to adapt to being more of a spearhead when we play a 3. Its a 2 way thing which will come. Sounds bizarre but from that point of view, champions league and having international players is  bit of a hindrance giving less training pitch time.

 

Dont underestimate the loss of Lewis Hall from am attacking point if view as well 

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We still don't give him the ball enough in build up play. When he finds space give him the ball. Especially when he has room in front of him to carry it, which we haven't seen enough of yet.

 

There was a sequence that led to Ayari's shot for Brighton that they almost scored from. Woltemade starts off with some nice link up to get us out from the back, and when the ball works it's way to Tonali, Woltemade wants it back where he can turn and carry it forward, and Tonali dwells on the ball and is trying to switch it wide to Trippier and loses it. Give him the ball back!

 

As much as I like Tonali and Bruno, I expect much more from them when it comes to these kinds of decisions, and just doing a better job of maintaining possession of the ball and control of the game. Better use of the ball is going to be down to them two.

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Just now, Shays Given Tim Flowers said:

It’s more to do with the positioning of the wingers, against forest (first half) and yesterday the wingers are miles away on the flank and Nick is isolated centrally. He much prefers the ball into feet than in the air. Thats hard to do given the starting position of the wingers. 

I wonder if that was the plan yesterday, keep the width and try to play Nick on for oncoming centre Mids ? If so it didn't work and Nick didn't get enough in that position.

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3 minutes ago, Shays Given Tim Flowers said:

It’s more to do with the positioning of the wingers, against forest (first half) and yesterday the wingers are miles away on the flank and Nick is isolated centrally. He much prefers the ball into feet than in the air. Thats hard to do given the starting position of the wingers. 

Yep.

 

That's been my biggest issue with how we've played so far. It honestly hasn't helped with Joelinton being a no show mind because it compounds the winger issue, I thought the build up phases looked better in the second half yesterday.

 

I'm sure it will come good because I've noticed incremental improvements but it just depends how many dropped points happens before that point.

 

 

Edited by Mole

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When the wingers got closer to him against forest in second half we were much improved. It feels like a hangover from plan a (isak, wissa). Woltemade is a weird player to play with, particularly if you’re used to Isak and have been coached extensively on a system that was never meant for a striker like Woltemade. When it settles down we will be a better side with more versatility in attack. 

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6 minutes ago, Shays Given Tim Flowers said:

It’s more to do with the positioning of the wingers, against forest (first half) and yesterday the wingers are miles away on the flank and Nick is isolated centrally. He much prefers the ball into feet than in the air. Thats hard to do given the starting position of the wingers. 

 

Hmmm. It's a tough one.

 

I think in build up having that room for him to move around in and receive the ball works, because he will drift towards both channels. Makes it less likely he'll get crowded out when he gets on the ball. The Union game was a good example.

 

I think the central midfield players need to do a better job of getting the ball into him earlier on and running off him when he's on the ball.

 

Do think the wingers will need to do a better job of picking their moments to come inwards too though, but moreso further up the pitch once we're in the final third.

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4 hours ago, LFEE said:

That was the major disappointment of the day for me. Always annoying when great goals ultimately count for nothing.

 

:lol: Feels like I can't even properly enjoy it man.

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2 hours ago, Erikse said:

Imagine how many goals he would be scoring for us with top notch wingers around him, instead of mr. can't beat a man and mr. don't know what to do with the ball. Need to start Murphy going forward. Atleast he creates.

 

 

 

 

Tbh, he's scoring way more already than he's entitled to. Basically scoring off a single chance which comes his way in 90 mins. 

 

I think he's doing his job as a forward, it's the wingers and midfielders who aren't supporting properly, and I don't think Murphy is the answer either, since his main role is providing crosses. It's Gordon and Elanga who should be feeding off his lay offs. 

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We have compounding problems. The wingers would be better with Tino and Hall behind them, Gordon in particular who also has Joelinton on his side. Elanga is still settling in. It would have been nice for him to slot straight in and produce, but that's not happened. Forest had least possession in the league, so its a big change for him.

 

Add in late acquisitions in the window, unfavourable fixtures so far, and a not-uncommon-for-us slow start and we are where we are. Better finishing, from Gordon, Murph, Joe, or Barnes and we'd have four-five more points and fewer folk talking about "not creating chances". Brighton threatened a lot, every time Minteh got the ball for example, but created few chances against us yesterday on their own park. Arsenal still rely on creating chances at corners.

 

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3 hours ago, Shays Given Tim Flowers said:

It’s more to do with the positioning of the wingers, against forest (first half) and yesterday the wingers are miles away on the flank and Nick is isolated centrally. He much prefers the ball into feet than in the air. Thats hard to do given the starting position of the wingers. 

We’ve always played like this mind under Howe. 

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