The right man is now available Freddy, what do you do?

[Thespence]

you simply can't back the appointment of Allardyce then knock the club if it doesn't work out. Anyone can use hindsight 

 

That is every messageboard user's right though? It is our first comandment or as the yanks say our first amendment.

[NE5]

He's been Allardyce's assistant/head coach for the past few years - think O'Neill and his troupe. I think Janitor's just assuming that they would be part of a team, a team that's obviously now broken up with Lee being appointed full time at Bolton.

 

Some info here: http://www.thefa.com/England/SeniorTeam/Coaches/Postings/2003/02/38387.htm

 

Aye cheers for clearing that up for me Dave, mate. Dead hard to understand like!

 

Parky/TT: As far as "having the set-up" goes, you cannot tell me that Big Sam can be nailed-on to be as successful in running Newcastle United as he has been down at Bolton. It's a completely different kettle of fish, with a different chairman and with a structure that will require and complete and utter overhaul - something that could take years to fully accomplish. My point about Lee (a f****** top-quality coach, by all accounts) and the rest of Allardyce's team at Bolton was that it might be very difficult for him to recreate the success here, ESPECIALLY in the short-term - and it's not like managers have a long shelf-life here these days if we're not firing on practically all cylinders whenever we play.

 

I would have thought that Lee was one of the most pivotal aspects of Sam's set-up (although I did mention the "rest of his team") in the same post. Wasn't he pivotal at Liverpool under Houllier as well? He has a massive reputation in the game, man. Sam's certainly not going to bring all of them to SJP, especially not quickly. Things could be a lot less clear-cut than people like you are predicting if he does ever come here. I've always been in favour of Allardyce coming here and I would still welcome it, but I'm weary of people expecting far too much of him if he does ever arrive and therefore giving him a snowball in hell's chance from the get-go by having massively inflated expectations of what he can do for us.

 

You cannot fully compensate for having a team that has worked together for years, if they get split up. That was my point and I fail to see how it was that hard to comprehend, really. What have you heard about Sammy Lee, Parky? Isn't he all he's cracked up to be?

 

Absolutely. Nailed on.

 

The point being, you look at the candidates at the time and who you think is qualified for you, which the club DID when appointing Dalglish, Gullit and Robson. Even the Scottish fuckpig had a case as the club needed some discipline - and indeed some people still support his actions in kicking out Bellamy and wouldn't have him back - and had won the League Cup and the FA Cup, whatever the circumstances. Roeder too had some merit in that he restored some stability and did well initially, possibly with Shearers motivational influence, maybe not.

 

At this moment in time, Allardyce seems to have a lot to offer the club. I'll pin my flag to the mast and say that apart from Arsene Wenger and Alex Ferguson, he is the next British based manager for me, so I'll be happy with him.

 

Not many managers are nailed on to be a success. In many ways, if Allardyce goes to us or Man City, then it is his big chance to join the winning managers and that is all.

 

 

 

Souness and Roeder are two of the worst managers the Premiership has ever seen, don't try and make out there was a case for appointing either of them.

 

unfortunately, they are not two of the worst managers the premiership has ever seen. And Roeder had some merit having did well as a caretaker. All clubs appoint managers on this basis sometimes, Liverpool have, Chelsea have, ManU have, and Arsenal too have appointed managers without winning track records, so stop making out they have not. The smoggies with the great Steve Gibson have appointed a manager with no experience. There is absolutely no difference between that appointment and us appointing Roeder either.

 

 

 

 

 

When have I said Man Utd, Liverpool, Chelsea or Arsenal haven't done this?

 

I haven't even mentioned them so stop making things up.

 

Both Souness and Roeder are easily two of the worst managers in the Premiership and both came with a history of failure, Gibson appointing Southgate is nothing like us appointing Roeder.

 

on what basis are they two of the worst appointments ?

 

There have been dozens, maybe even a hundred or two shite appointments.

 

 

[NE5]

you simply can't back the appointment of Allardyce then knock the club if it doesn't work out. Anyone can use hindsight 

 

That is every messageboard user's right though? It is our first comandment or as the yanks say our first amendment.

 

what are you on about ?

 

And whats it got to do with a message board ? Does it matter where it is said ?

 

 

[Thespence]

what are you on about ?

 

And whats it got to do with a message board ?

 

Does it matter where it is said ?

The internet is the most fickle place ever.

 

This place is one.

 

Yes!!!! Truths,facts & a users last post count for not valid on the internet its all about the current or next post.

[NE5]

what are you on about ?

 

And whats it got to do with a message board ?

 

Does it matter where it is said ?

The internet is the most fickle place ever.

 

This place is one.

 

Yes!!!! Truths,facts & a users last post count for not valid on the internet its all about the current or next post.

 

can I have one of whatever you've just had 

[Thespence]

can I have one of whatever you've just had 

 

It is reading you stuff in the Mag before I went to kip man 

 

YOU WERE ON THE BIG SAM BANDWAGON BEFORE MOST

 

Just checked NUFC.com & has words from Bill Bradshaw from DE, Fred Shepherd & Alan Oliver both went to his wedding last year. Start whacking the money on SAM now!!!!

[Baggio]

He's been Allardyce's assistant/head coach for the past few years - think O'Neill and his troupe. I think Janitor's just assuming that they would be part of a team, a team that's obviously now broken up with Lee being appointed full time at Bolton.

 

Some info here: http://www.thefa.com/England/SeniorTeam/Coaches/Postings/2003/02/38387.htm

 

Aye cheers for clearing that up for me Dave, mate. Dead hard to understand like!

 

Parky/TT: As far as "having the set-up" goes, you cannot tell me that Big Sam can be nailed-on to be as successful in running Newcastle United as he has been down at Bolton. It's a completely different kettle of fish, with a different chairman and with a structure that will require and complete and utter overhaul - something that could take years to fully accomplish. My point about Lee (a f****** top-quality coach, by all accounts) and the rest of Allardyce's team at Bolton was that it might be very difficult for him to recreate the success here, ESPECIALLY in the short-term - and it's not like managers have a long shelf-life here these days if we're not firing on practically all cylinders whenever we play.

 

I would have thought that Lee was one of the most pivotal aspects of Sam's set-up (although I did mention the "rest of his team") in the same post. Wasn't he pivotal at Liverpool under Houllier as well? He has a massive reputation in the game, man. Sam's certainly not going to bring all of them to SJP, especially not quickly. Things could be a lot less clear-cut than people like you are predicting if he does ever come here. I've always been in favour of Allardyce coming here and I would still welcome it, but I'm weary of people expecting far too much of him if he does ever arrive and therefore giving him a snowball in hell's chance from the get-go by having massively inflated expectations of what he can do for us.

 

You cannot fully compensate for having a team that has worked together for years, if they get split up. That was my point and I fail to see how it was that hard to comprehend, really. What have you heard about Sammy Lee, Parky? Isn't he all he's cracked up to be?

 

Absolutely. Nailed on.

 

The point being, you look at the candidates at the time and who you think is qualified for you, which the club DID when appointing Dalglish, Gullit and Robson. Even the Scottish fuckpig had a case as the club needed some discipline - and indeed some people still support his actions in kicking out Bellamy and wouldn't have him back - and had won the League Cup and the FA Cup, whatever the circumstances. Roeder too had some merit in that he restored some stability and did well initially, possibly with Shearers motivational influence, maybe not.

 

At this moment in time, Allardyce seems to have a lot to offer the club. I'll pin my flag to the mast and say that apart from Arsene Wenger and Alex Ferguson, he is the next British based manager for me, so I'll be happy with him.

 

Not many managers are nailed on to be a success. In many ways, if Allardyce goes to us or Man City, then it is his big chance to join the winning managers and that is all.

 

 

 

Souness and Roeder are two of the worst managers the Premiership has ever seen, don't try and make out there was a case for appointing either of them.

 

unfortunately, they are not two of the worst managers the premiership has ever seen. And Roeder had some merit having did well as a caretaker. All clubs appoint managers on this basis sometimes, Liverpool have, Chelsea have, ManU have, and Arsenal too have appointed managers without winning track records, so stop making out they have not. The smoggies with the great Steve Gibson have appointed a manager with no experience. There is absolutely no difference between that appointment and us appointing Roeder either.

 

 

 

 

 

When have I said Man Utd, Liverpool, Chelsea or Arsenal haven't done this?

 

I haven't even mentioned them so stop making things up.

 

Both Souness and Roeder are easily two of the worst managers in the Premiership and both came with a history of failure, Gibson appointing Southgate is nothing like us appointing Roeder.

 

on what basis are they two of the worst appointments ?

 

There have been dozens, maybe even a hundred or two s**** appointments.

 

 

 

Roeder

 

Gillingham - Finished second bottom.

 

Watford - missed out on the play offs in his second season, sacked in his 3rd season before the club eventually got relegated.

 

West Ham - Finished 7th as caretaker before blowing all the money the club got for Lampard on Repka, James and Hutchinson, relegated in his second season, the West Ham fans regard him as their worst ever manager.

 

Souness

 

Rangers - successful, not exactly hard with a dominant club in a weak league.

 

Liverpool - Disaster, to quote Robbie Fowler's book "He turned the red machine into the red turnip" quit after losing to Bristol City in the FA cup

 

Galatasaray - Won the Turkish cup

 

Southampton - Done nothing of note and left after a year after falling out with the chairman.

 

Torino - Replaced after 4 months.

 

Benfica - Sacked after winning nothing in 2 years, famously released a youngster called Deco (yes, that Deco) so he could accommodate Michael Thomas in the squad.

 

Blackburn - Earned them promotion and won them the league cup, on the brink of being sacked there after taking them close to the relegation zone.

 

 

Now how many managers can you name me with such a history of failure as these pair of twats? 

 

For a club who's chairman previously boasted about being the 8th biggest club in the World, and who some fans regard as being the 5th best club over the last decade, these two appointments are simply not good enough.

 

[Parky]

He's been Allardyce's assistant/head coach for the past few years - think O'Neill and his troupe. I think Janitor's just assuming that they would be part of a team, a team that's obviously now broken up with Lee being appointed full time at Bolton.

 

Some info here: http://www.thefa.com/England/SeniorTeam/Coaches/Postings/2003/02/38387.htm

 

Aye cheers for clearing that up for me Dave, mate. Dead hard to understand like!

 

Parky/TT: As far as "having the set-up" goes, you cannot tell me that Big Sam can be nailed-on to be as successful in running Newcastle United as he has been down at Bolton. It's a completely different kettle of fish, with a different chairman and with a structure that will require and complete and utter overhaul - something that could take years to fully accomplish. My point about Lee (a f****** top-quality coach, by all accounts) and the rest of Allardyce's team at Bolton was that it might be very difficult for him to recreate the success here, ESPECIALLY in the short-term - and it's not like managers have a long shelf-life here these days if we're not firing on practically all cylinders whenever we play.

 

I would have thought that Lee was one of the most pivotal aspects of Sam's set-up (although I did mention the "rest of his team") in the same post. Wasn't he pivotal at Liverpool under Houllier as well? He has a massive reputation in the game, man. Sam's certainly not going to bring all of them to SJP, especially not quickly. Things could be a lot less clear-cut than people like you are predicting if he does ever come here. I've always been in favour of Allardyce coming here and I would still welcome it, but I'm weary of people expecting far too much of him if he does ever arrive and therefore giving him a snowball in hell's chance from the get-go by having massively inflated expectations of what he can do for us.

 

You cannot fully compensate for having a team that has worked together for years, if they get split up. That was my point and I fail to see how it was that hard to comprehend, really. What have you heard about Sammy Lee, Parky? Isn't he all he's cracked up to be?

 

Absolutely. Nailed on.

 

The point being, you look at the candidates at the time and who you think is qualified for you, which the club DID when appointing Dalglish, Gullit and Robson. Even the Scottish fuckpig had a case as the club needed some discipline - and indeed some people still support his actions in kicking out Bellamy and wouldn't have him back - and had won the League Cup and the FA Cup, whatever the circumstances. Roeder too had some merit in that he restored some stability and did well initially, possibly with Shearers motivational influence, maybe not.

 

At this moment in time, Allardyce seems to have a lot to offer the club. I'll pin my flag to the mast and say that apart from Arsene Wenger and Alex Ferguson, he is the next British based manager for me, so I'll be happy with him.

 

Not many managers are nailed on to be a success. In many ways, if Allardyce goes to us or Man City, then it is his big chance to join the winning managers and that is all.

 

 

 

Souness and Roeder are two of the worst managers the Premiership has ever seen, don't try and make out there was a case for appointing either of them.

 

unfortunately, they are not two of the worst managers the premiership has ever seen. And Roeder had some merit having did well as a caretaker. All clubs appoint managers on this basis sometimes, Liverpool have, Chelsea have, ManU have, and Arsenal too have appointed managers without winning track records, so stop making out they have not. The smoggies with the great Steve Gibson have appointed a manager with no experience. There is absolutely no difference between that appointment and us appointing Roeder either.

 

 

 

 

 

When have I said Man Utd, Liverpool, Chelsea or Arsenal haven't done this?

 

I haven't even mentioned them so stop making things up.

 

Both Souness and Roeder are easily two of the worst managers in the Premiership and both came with a history of failure, Gibson appointing Southgate is nothing like us appointing Roeder.

 

on what basis are they two of the worst appointments ?

 

There have been dozens, maybe even a hundred or two s**** appointments.

 

 

 

Roeder

 

Gillingham - Finished second bottom.

 

Watford - missed out on the play offs in his second season, sacked in his 3rd season before the club eventually got relegated.

 

West Ham - Finished 7th as caretaker before blowing all the money the club got for Lampard on Repka, James and Hutchinson, relegated in his second season, the West Ham fans regard him as their worst ever manager.

 

Souness

 

Rangers - successful, not exactly hard with a dominant club in a weak league.

 

Liverpool - Disaster, to quote Robbie Fowler's book "He turned the red machine into the red turnip" quit after losing to Bristol City in the FA cup

 

Galatasaray - Won the Turkish cup

 

Southampton - Done nothing of note and left after a year after falling out with the chairman.

 

Torino - Replaced after 4 months.

 

Benfica - Sacked after winning nothing in 2 years, famously released a youngster called Deco (yes, that Deco) so he could accommodate Michael Thomas in the squad.

 

Blackburn - Earned them promotion and won them the league cup, on the brink of being sacked there after taking them close to the relegation zone.

 

 

Now how many managers can you name me with such a history of failure as these pair of twats? 

 

For a club who's chairman previously boasted about being the 8th biggest club in the World, and who some fans regard as being the 5th best club over the last decade, these two appointments are simply not good enough.

 

 

 

 

Not all bad then.

[Cronky]

There's a danger of missing the wood for the trees. He's been in the job for 10 years and he hasn't delivered. In fact, the situation seems to be deteriorating and it looks like he's about to fire his third manager in four years. In the last three years, we've flirted with the relegation zone, and one year we're going to get unlucky.

 

We can argue all day whether he should have appointed or sacked the various managers he's dealt with, but the fact is it's happened on his watch. In any other line of business, a Chief Exec with that record would have to walk, and no-one would be listening to him claiming it's bad luck, or the fault of other people.

 

For what it's worth, I think he has made a few costly mistakes, but the point still stands. Stand aside, Freddie, you've had your chance.

[Thespence]

Fred should be Chairman & thats it. All well run clubs use there Chief exec for the day to day work: ManUre - Gill, Chelsea - Kenyon, Liverpool - Parry & Arsenal did use Dein. The American Bruce Buck who is the Chelsea chairman speaks to the press less than Roman.

[madras]

for all i agree with allardyce (although van gaal would probably be my top choice of those who i class as possibles)coming in to replace roeder,i'd hope the work was to behind roeders back and sorted before he goes,we do have a habit of getting rid of managers with no idea what to do next, and this never looks good to any prospective incomers.

 

one thing,if it's true that allardyce turned us down previously,has anything changed at SJP to now make him want to come ?

 

then......is bolton's style of play his preferred style,or is it just what he thinks is the style best suited to the best personnel he can get at that club ?

[Parky]

for all i agree with allardyce (although van gaal would probably be my top choice of those who i class as possibles)coming in to replace roeder,i'd hope the work was to behind roeders back and sorted before he goes,we do have a habit of getting rid of managers with no idea what to do next, and this never looks good to any prospective incomers.

 

one thing,if it's true that allardyce turned us down previously,has anything changed at SJP to now make him want to come ?

 

then......is bolton's style of play his preferred style,or is it just what he thinks is the style best suited to the best personnel he can get at that club ?

 

No Shearer.

[Thespence]

if it's true that allardyce turned us down previously

 

Bobby Robson turned us down once but he came once he was unemployed. It is

[NE5]

can I have one of whatever you've just had 

 

It is reading you stuff in the Mag before I went to kip man 

 

YOU WERE ON THE BIG SAM BANDWAGON BEFORE MOST

 

Just checked NUFC.com & has words from Bill Bradshaw from DE, Fred Shepherd & Alan Oliver both went to his wedding last year. Start whacking the money on SAM now!!!!

 

maybe i will  ....... 

[Mick]

 

on what basis are they two of the worst appointments ?

 

There have been dozens, maybe even a hundred or two s**** appointments.

 

 

 

OK, name them.

[NE5]

He's been Allardyce's assistant/head coach for the past few years - think O'Neill and his troupe. I think Janitor's just assuming that they would be part of a team, a team that's obviously now broken up with Lee being appointed full time at Bolton.

 

Some info here: http://www.thefa.com/England/SeniorTeam/Coaches/Postings/2003/02/38387.htm

 

Aye cheers for clearing that up for me Dave, mate. Dead hard to understand like!

 

Parky/TT: As far as "having the set-up" goes, you cannot tell me that Big Sam can be nailed-on to be as successful in running Newcastle United as he has been down at Bolton. It's a completely different kettle of fish, with a different chairman and with a structure that will require and complete and utter overhaul - something that could take years to fully accomplish. My point about Lee (a f****** top-quality coach, by all accounts) and the rest of Allardyce's team at Bolton was that it might be very difficult for him to recreate the success here, ESPECIALLY in the short-term - and it's not like managers have a long shelf-life here these days if we're not firing on practically all cylinders whenever we play.

 

I would have thought that Lee was one of the most pivotal aspects of Sam's set-up (although I did mention the "rest of his team") in the same post. Wasn't he pivotal at Liverpool under Houllier as well? He has a massive reputation in the game, man. Sam's certainly not going to bring all of them to SJP, especially not quickly. Things could be a lot less clear-cut than people like you are predicting if he does ever come here. I've always been in favour of Allardyce coming here and I would still welcome it, but I'm weary of people expecting far too much of him if he does ever arrive and therefore giving him a snowball in hell's chance from the get-go by having massively inflated expectations of what he can do for us.

 

You cannot fully compensate for having a team that has worked together for years, if they get split up. That was my point and I fail to see how it was that hard to comprehend, really. What have you heard about Sammy Lee, Parky? Isn't he all he's cracked up to be?

 

Absolutely. Nailed on.

 

The point being, you look at the candidates at the time and who you think is qualified for you, which the club DID when appointing Dalglish, Gullit and Robson. Even the Scottish fuckpig had a case as the club needed some discipline - and indeed some people still support his actions in kicking out Bellamy and wouldn't have him back - and had won the League Cup and the FA Cup, whatever the circumstances. Roeder too had some merit in that he restored some stability and did well initially, possibly with Shearers motivational influence, maybe not.

 

At this moment in time, Allardyce seems to have a lot to offer the club. I'll pin my flag to the mast and say that apart from Arsene Wenger and Alex Ferguson, he is the next British based manager for me, so I'll be happy with him.

 

Not many managers are nailed on to be a success. In many ways, if Allardyce goes to us or Man City, then it is his big chance to join the winning managers and that is all.

 

 

 

Souness and Roeder are two of the worst managers the Premiership has ever seen, don't try and make out there was a case for appointing either of them.

 

unfortunately, they are not two of the worst managers the premiership has ever seen. And Roeder had some merit having did well as a caretaker. All clubs appoint managers on this basis sometimes, Liverpool have, Chelsea have, ManU have, and Arsenal too have appointed managers without winning track records, so stop making out they have not. The smoggies with the great Steve Gibson have appointed a manager with no experience. There is absolutely no difference between that appointment and us appointing Roeder either.

 

 

 

 

 

When have I said Man Utd, Liverpool, Chelsea or Arsenal haven't done this?

 

I haven't even mentioned them so stop making things up.

 

Both Souness and Roeder are easily two of the worst managers in the Premiership and both came with a history of failure, Gibson appointing Southgate is nothing like us appointing Roeder.

 

on what basis are they two of the worst appointments ?

 

There have been dozens, maybe even a hundred or two s**** appointments.

 

 

 

Roeder

 

Gillingham - Finished second bottom.

 

Watford - missed out on the play offs in his second season, sacked in his 3rd season before the club eventually got relegated.

 

West Ham - Finished 7th as caretaker before blowing all the money the club got for Lampard on Repka, James and Hutchinson, relegated in his second season, the West Ham fans regard him as their worst ever manager.

 

Souness

 

Rangers - successful, not exactly hard with a dominant club in a weak league.

 

Liverpool - Disaster, to quote Robbie Fowler's book "He turned the red machine into the red turnip" quit after losing to Bristol City in the FA cup

 

Galatasaray - Won the Turkish cup

 

Southampton - Done nothing of note and left after a year after falling out with the chairman.

 

Torino - Replaced after 4 months.

 

Benfica - Sacked after winning nothing in 2 years, famously released a youngster called Deco (yes, that Deco) so he could accommodate Michael Thomas in the squad.

 

Blackburn - Earned them promotion and won them the league cup, on the brink of being sacked there after taking them close to the relegation zone.

 

 

Now how many managers can you name me with such a history of failure as these pair of twats? 

 

For a club who's chairman previously boasted about being the 8th biggest club in the World, and who some fans regard as being the 5th best club over the last decade, these two appointments are simply not good enough.

 

 

i'm aware of their records. You wasted your time typing all of that.

 

Roeder was on a bit of a loser at Watford, they were already going downwards, and he didn't get much support, some Watford fans reckon he was unlucky. I don't really care what West ham fans think, they are all tossers anyway.

 

Having appointed managers with track winning records who didn't deliver, what makes you think that managers with not so good records woudl repeat their previous experiences too ? ....... just a point you should think about. All I said is that Roeder had merit, he might have succeeded. Different cirumstances, different clubs, you can't tell. Its obvious now that he isn't going to do it, but he could have been the right man in the right job at the right time.

 

My earlier point about other clubs doing these things stands. They do. I know you didn't say it but you and others imply such things. I'm just putting the record straight on this one. Which I see you don't dispute. Unless you are going to suggest that everybody else always makes the right appointment, at the right time and/or because all these other clubs bar us have DOF's and CEO's or whatever.

 

 

 

 

[KaKa]

for all i agree with allardyce (although van gaal would probably be my top choice of those who i class as possibles)coming in to replace roeder,i'd hope the work was to behind roeders back and sorted before he goes,we do have a habit of getting rid of managers with no idea what to do next, and this never looks good to any prospective incomers.

 

one thing,if it's true that allardyce turned us down previously,has anything changed at SJP to now make him want to come ?

 

then......is bolton's style of play his preferred style,or is it just what he thinks is the style best suited to the best personnel he can get at that club ?

 

No Shearer.

 

So true ...

[NE5]

 

on what basis are they two of the worst appointments ?

 

There have been dozens, maybe even a hundred or two s**** appointments.

 

 

 

OK, name them.

 

Well, all the dozens of clubs that have finished below us over the last decade, on a season by season basis, as we have performed so badly because we've been run so poorly by such a shit board who are no better than the ones who sold our best players, spent years in the 2nd division, and considered 15th in the old first division to be success, and finished in the top 5 once in 40 years.

 

Too many to mention.

 

 

[Guest BooBoo]

[Baggio]

He's been Allardyce's assistant/head coach for the past few years - think O'Neill and his troupe. I think Janitor's just assuming that they would be part of a team, a team that's obviously now broken up with Lee being appointed full time at Bolton.

 

Some info here: http://www.thefa.com/England/SeniorTeam/Coaches/Postings/2003/02/38387.htm

 

Aye cheers for clearing that up for me Dave, mate. Dead hard to understand like!

 

Parky/TT: As far as "having the set-up" goes, you cannot tell me that Big Sam can be nailed-on to be as successful in running Newcastle United as he has been down at Bolton. It's a completely different kettle of fish, with a different chairman and with a structure that will require and complete and utter overhaul - something that could take years to fully accomplish. My point about Lee (a f****** top-quality coach, by all accounts) and the rest of Allardyce's team at Bolton was that it might be very difficult for him to recreate the success here, ESPECIALLY in the short-term - and it's not like managers have a long shelf-life here these days if we're not firing on practically all cylinders whenever we play.

 

I would have thought that Lee was one of the most pivotal aspects of Sam's set-up (although I did mention the "rest of his team") in the same post. Wasn't he pivotal at Liverpool under Houllier as well? He has a massive reputation in the game, man. Sam's certainly not going to bring all of them to SJP, especially not quickly. Things could be a lot less clear-cut than people like you are predicting if he does ever come here. I've always been in favour of Allardyce coming here and I would still welcome it, but I'm weary of people expecting far too much of him if he does ever arrive and therefore giving him a snowball in hell's chance from the get-go by having massively inflated expectations of what he can do for us.

 

You cannot fully compensate for having a team that has worked together for years, if they get split up. That was my point and I fail to see how it was that hard to comprehend, really. What have you heard about Sammy Lee, Parky? Isn't he all he's cracked up to be?

 

Absolutely. Nailed on.

 

The point being, you look at the candidates at the time and who you think is qualified for you, which the club DID when appointing Dalglish, Gullit and Robson. Even the Scottish fuckpig had a case as the club needed some discipline - and indeed some people still support his actions in kicking out Bellamy and wouldn't have him back - and had won the League Cup and the FA Cup, whatever the circumstances. Roeder too had some merit in that he restored some stability and did well initially, possibly with Shearers motivational influence, maybe not.

 

At this moment in time, Allardyce seems to have a lot to offer the club. I'll pin my flag to the mast and say that apart from Arsene Wenger and Alex Ferguson, he is the next British based manager for me, so I'll be happy with him.

 

Not many managers are nailed on to be a success. In many ways, if Allardyce goes to us or Man City, then it is his big chance to join the winning managers and that is all.

 

 

 

Souness and Roeder are two of the worst managers the Premiership has ever seen, don't try and make out there was a case for appointing either of them.

 

unfortunately, they are not two of the worst managers the premiership has ever seen. And Roeder had some merit having did well as a caretaker. All clubs appoint managers on this basis sometimes, Liverpool have, Chelsea have, ManU have, and Arsenal too have appointed managers without winning track records, so stop making out they have not. The smoggies with the great Steve Gibson have appointed a manager with no experience. There is absolutely no difference between that appointment and us appointing Roeder either.

 

 

 

 

 

When have I said Man Utd, Liverpool, Chelsea or Arsenal haven't done this?

 

I haven't even mentioned them so stop making things up.

 

Both Souness and Roeder are easily two of the worst managers in the Premiership and both came with a history of failure, Gibson appointing Southgate is nothing like us appointing Roeder.

 

on what basis are they two of the worst appointments ?

 

There have been dozens, maybe even a hundred or two s**** appointments.

 

 

 

Roeder

 

Gillingham - Finished second bottom.

 

Watford - missed out on the play offs in his second season, sacked in his 3rd season before the club eventually got relegated.

 

West Ham - Finished 7th as caretaker before blowing all the money the club got for Lampard on Repka, James and Hutchinson, relegated in his second season, the West Ham fans regard him as their worst ever manager.

 

Souness

 

Rangers - successful, not exactly hard with a dominant club in a weak league.

 

Liverpool - Disaster, to quote Robbie Fowler's book "He turned the red machine into the red turnip" quit after losing to Bristol City in the FA cup

 

Galatasaray - Won the Turkish cup

 

Southampton - Done nothing of note and left after a year after falling out with the chairman.

 

Torino - Replaced after 4 months.

 

Benfica - Sacked after winning nothing in 2 years, famously released a youngster called Deco (yes, that Deco) so he could accommodate Michael Thomas in the squad.

 

Blackburn - Earned them promotion and won them the league cup, on the brink of being sacked there after taking them close to the relegation zone.

 

 

Now how many managers can you name me with such a history of failure as these pair of twats? 

 

For a club who's chairman previously boasted about being the 8th biggest club in the World, and who some fans regard as being the 5th best club over the last decade, these two appointments are simply not good enough.

 

 

i'm aware of their records. You wasted your time typing all of that.

 

Roeder was on a bit of a loser at Watford, they were already going downwards, and he didn't get much support, some Watford fans reckon he was unlucky. I don't really care what West ham fans think, they are all tossers anyway.

 

Having appointed managers with track winning records who didn't deliver, what makes you think that managers with not so good records woudl repeat their previous experiences too ? ....... just a point you should think about. All I said is that Roeder had merit, he might have succeeded. Different cirumstances, different clubs, you can't tell. Its obvious now that he isn't going to do it, but he could have been the right man in the right job at the right time.

 

My earlier point about other clubs doing these things stands. They do. I know you didn't say it but you and others imply such things. I'm just putting the record straight on this one. Which I see you don't dispute. Unless you are going to suggest that everybody else always makes the right appointment, at the right time and/or because all these other clubs bar us have DOF's and CEO's or whatever.

 

 

So because we've appointed successful managers in the past and it hasn't worked out, Shepherd thought it was a good idea to appoint managers with a history of failure in the hope that they would be successful, fucking fantastic idea. Employing successful managers doesn't guarantee success, however employing managers of the calibre of Souness and Roeder pretty much guarantee's you failure.

 

As for other clubs employing similar shite managers in the past, you're right, but it doesn't make it acceptable here does it? If anything Shepherd should have looked at how other clubs have tried and failed by employing managers this way and stayed well clear.

[Baggio]

 

on what basis are they two of the worst appointments ?

 

There have been dozens, maybe even a hundred or two s**** appointments.

 

 

 

OK, name them.

 

Well, all the dozens of clubs that have finished below us over the last decade, on a season by season basis, as we have performed so badly because we've been run so poorly by such a s*** board who are no better than the ones who sold our best players, spent years in the 2nd division, and considered 15th in the old first division to be success, and finished in the top 5 once in 40 years.

 

Too many to mention.

 

 

 

:lol:

[madras]

 

on what basis are they two of the worst appointments ?

 

There have been dozens, maybe even a hundred or two s**** appointments.

 

 

 

OK, name them.

 

Well, all the dozens of clubs that have finished below us over the last decade, on a season by season basis, as we have performed so badly because we've been run so poorly by such a s*** board who are no better than the ones who sold our best players, spent years in the 2nd division, and considered 15th in the old first division to be success, and finished in the top 5 once in 40 years.

 

Too many to mention.

 

 

howard wilkinson and mick mcarthy pummel their way to the front of my mind.

[Baggio]

 

on what basis are they two of the worst appointments ?

 

There have been dozens, maybe even a hundred or two s**** appointments.

 

 

 

OK, name them.

 

Well, all the dozens of clubs that have finished below us over the last decade, on a season by season basis, as we have performed so badly because we've been run so poorly by such a s*** board who are no better than the ones who sold our best players, spent years in the 2nd division, and considered 15th in the old first division to be success, and finished in the top 5 once in 40 years.

 

Too many to mention.

 

 

howard wilkinson and mick mcarthy pummel their way to the front of my mind.

 

The same Howard Wilkinson who won the league with Leeds? Aye, Roeder has a much better history in management than him.

[Mick]

 

i'm aware of their records. You wasted your time typing all of that.

 

Roeder was on a bit of a loser at Watford, they were already going downwards, and he didn't get much support, some Watford fans reckon he was unlucky. I don't really care what West ham fans think, they are all tossers anyway.

 

Having appointed managers with track winning records who didn't deliver, what makes you think that managers with not so good records woudl repeat their previous experiences too ? ....... just a point you should think about. All I said is that Roeder had merit, he might have succeeded. Different cirumstances, different clubs, you can't tell. Its obvious now that he isn't going to do it, but he could have been the right man in the right job at the right time.

My earlier point about other clubs doing these things stands. They do. I know you didn't say it but you and others imply such things. I'm just putting the record straight on this one. Which I see you don't dispute. Unless you are going to suggest that everybody else always makes the right appointment, at the right time and/or because all these other clubs bar us have DOF's and CEO's or whatever.

 

 

 

 

 

How far will you go to defend Shepherd?

 

He appointed managers who had won things and it didn't work so he thought he'd appoint shite as that might work.

 

 

bluelaugh.gif bluelaugh.gif

 

That really is one of the best laughs I've had in ages, thanks.

 

[Guest Knightrider]

I personally think appointing any manager based on their CV is a recipe for disaster, especially at Newcastle where if you pardon my pun, it isn't so black and white. I look at skill sets first and if they are decent in the following areas they are more likely to succeed over someone who isn't but by hook or crook have somehow managed to win a few things like Souness.

 

Man management skills

Motivational skills

Hunger to succeed and a desire to learn/adapt

High standards - very important

Degree of understanding about the game and people

 

Got those? You'll develop a knack for the other things like tactics, winning trophies, if you work hard enough and get a bit luck on your side.

 

When looking for a new man I think all clubs need to assess what the club needs and then cross check these needs against a manager's skill set -and not CV.

 

KK had no CV at all to speak of as a manager but he had what we were looking for, no - needed: Passion, bond with fans, high standards, desire, hunger, commitment, motivational and man management skills.

 

The result was = success

 

The majority of the rest he picked up along the way, being intelligent and hard working with a desire to improve, learn and adapt, that was always gonna be the case.

 

Dalglish was always gonna fail, because he was the antithesis of KK and would have had to been in the job for 5 years just to change the culture of the club, but given the success we had under KK, a few poor seasons was not and nor should it have, been acceptable and it wasn't, which is why he got the boot. However the homework was poor and had we done a bit more, we#d never have appointed him, same with Gullit.

 

BTW both Dalglish and Gullit were not 1st choices so in many ways, their appointments were an admittence of failure - failure to get the right man in in the first place. Sometimes fate can work out better for you in such cases but this is very rare.

 

Anyway, as far as I'm concerned, Big Sam ticks most boxes so is therefore the right man.