Jonas Gutierrez signed from Mallorca on 5 year deal

[Baggio]

How long do these procedures take?

 

I don't know Dave, my point is that if we have appealed to Uefa or Fifa for his registration then it's out of our hands.

[Cajun]

You know what these governing bodies can be like! Takes the FA months to sort out simple matters.

[Dave]

How long do these procedures take?

 

I don't know Dave, my point is that if we have appealed to Uefa or Fifa for his registration then it's out of our hands.

 

Fair enough. It's just frustrating as he already looks like a key player for us.

 

If they are illegally holding his registration could we sue them for damages if he misses games?

 

Good question.

[junkhead]

I think he can play for us, but if FIFA somehow rule out that Newcastle have acted unprofessionally, we'll be deducted points for every league or cup game he has played

[James]

no thats total bollocks, the mackem bitch is lying again

 

firstly, mallorca didn't even sign him, he was on a 3 year loan so he bought out his velez contract and you still need registration to play in friendly's, as a player belonging to another club can't play

 

don't worry

 

Not so, Mallorca owned 50% of the financial rights to the player.

[Kasper]

I think six weeks should be long enough to get things sorted out one way or the other.

 

Surely the club asked for it and if they were refused then they will have to go through official procedures to get it with Uefa/Fifa.

 

What else could they do?

 

Assault Mallorca's office

[Cajun]

If we were to play 4-4-2 anyone think Jonas could play a central role if needed? Not saying we definitely should chuck him in there but he looks big enough and strong enough not to be bossed about, does he have the other tools to fill in as a creative cm?

[Parky]

A despondent Kevin Keegan has revealed he has no idea if new signing Jonas Gutierrez will be available to play in Newcastle’s season opener against Manchester United.

 

Keegan appears to be in the dark over a lot of issues at St James’ Park right now, including the current situation regarding the £10 million purchase of Fabricio Coloccini.

 

One of Keegan’s closest friends Arthur Cox has also left the club due to a reported fall-out over the role of Dennis Wise, and the Newcastle boss was far from his positive self after their friendly win over Valencia.

 

The Magpies were hammered twice by the champions last season and Keegan knows he will need every one of his best players if they are to avoid a similar fate this time.

 

Gutierrez has been appearing in pre-season, but will not be able to make his competitive debut unless Mallorca release his registration forms.

 

And Keegan admitted he is in the dark on “Spiderman’s” availability for the trip to Old Trafford.

 

“I don’t know, I hope so,” he stated.

 

 

Setanta.

[Cajun]

Sure that was mentioned earlier, I like the way they can get all that from 6 words.

[Wullie]

Yawn.

[Fatwax]

In a recent interview on NUFCtv Gutierrez was asked if he was looking forward to playing against Tevez on Sunday.

 

Chillax.

[stozo]

I mentioned this a few weeks ago. He won't get his registration until FIFA/UEFA hold a hearing to decide how much compensation and who it is owed too (Mallorca or Velez). This is precisely the problem with using Article 17, especially if the club losing the player refuse to recognize Article 17, which is what Mallorca are doing.

 

Webster took months too sort out and without sounding like a doom merchant it wouldn't surprise if this wasn't sorted by the weekend or even later.

[Cajun]

I would imagine the Webster case would take longer than cases now to sort out as it was a landmark case and created a new clause, hence the "Webster" ruling

[LooneyToonArmy]

Here`s an article from the Guardian by an Argie with references to Gutierrez. It`s from last month but has some interesting things nevertheless and I don`t remember it being mentioned on the thread. Will paste article incase link expires anytime soon

 

http://blogs.guardian.co.uk/sport/2008/07/10/argentinas_exporters_sweat_on.html

 

--------------------------

 

Argentina's exporters sweat on the price of The Greyhound

 

Jonas Gutierrez's move to Newcastle has left his co-owners with grave concerns over the way players' values are established

 

Marcela Mora y Araujo

 

While researching an article about polo many years ago I asked a horse breeder how the value of a horse was established. "Very simple," he told me. "If you want to sell it's quite cheap and if you don't want to sell it's very expensive.'' He grinned and added with a sure sense of truth: "Pretty much like anything else.''

 

And so it is with footballers. Through the hustle and bustle of the transfer window, headlines tend to be hogged by star players. More often than not, though, true drama and intrigue is to be found further away from the celebrity trail - among the squad players who are being offered, inquired about, bargained over and loaned all over the globe. Establishing their true value seems to be the challenge.

 

Take Jonas Gutierrez, who celebrated his 25th birthday last Saturday. A lanky midfielder nicknamed "The Greyhound" (El Galgo), he left his club in Argentina, Vélez Sársfield, in 2005 having made a substantial contribution to the club's domestic championship win that season. Jonas went to Real Mallorca in Spain under a contract which stipulated that he would be owned 50% by Vélez and 50% by Mallorca, and that after three years Mallorca would have an option to buy him outright. Failing that, he would return to Vélez - "unless there was a sale to a third club", as Vélez president Alvaro Balestrini told the Argentinian press a month ago.

 

Last week The Greyhound joined Newcastle United on a five-year contract for an undisclosed fee. Real Mallorca, though, are claiming breach of contract on Jonas' part and are demanding €15m (£12m) in compensation.

 

Vélez, for their part, are now facing the prospect of losing out on Jonas' "market value increase" and it is understood that their legal team has been in Mallorca planning a joint strategy to present to Fifa. Both clubs want a piece of the action, but the player has cited Article 17 of Fifa's statutes, which states that a player aged between 23 and 28 who has fulfilled three years of his contract can move to another club for "footballing reasons".

 

The relatively recent Andy Webster ruling provides the precedent which suggests the pay-out to Mallorca could be substantially less than the €15m requested. Hearts demanded what they saw as Webster's full market value when he moved to Wigan, but the Court of Arbitration for Sport ruled the club should be paid the equivalent of the player's salary for the remainder of his contract.

 

"The transfer market is in a state of transition at the moment, partly because of the Webster ruling,'' says Rory Miller, a football finance expert at the University of Liverpool. "It's very interesting from an academic point of view, because no one really knows what the value of a player in the transfer market is. Because of the Webster case it's very hard to determine the price of a player."

 

There are additional complications to the Jonas case, says Miller, stemming from the fact that Spanish clubs have recently invoked a buyout clause and that ownership of the player is split between Mallorca and Vélez. According to a source close to Jonas, who wishes to remain unnamed, the agreement between Vélez and Mallorca is a private matter between both clubs. The relevant point here is who holds the player's federative rights (the right to register the player as theirs with football's governing bodies) which in Jonas's case is Mallorca. But back in Argentina, where clubs rely on international sales to an enormous degree, the difference between 50% of €15m and a fraction of Jonas' remaining salary could hurt. A lot.

 

"Jonas' case is not the only one," says La Nacion editor Daniel Arcucci. "It's like an epidemic here at the moment; [sebastián] Nayar's move from Boca to Recreativo in Spain is a case in point, to name but one example." Argentina's football economy is extremely dependent on the sale of players, and it is increasingly common to find that players are not owned entirely by one club. Subsequent sales are therefore regarded as much-needed income, as players gain value while they progress from club to club. Since 2003 Argentina has exported 145 forwards to foreign pitches and each of these sales represents a lifeline for the selling clubs.

 

Last Saturday, Hernán Crespo also celebrated his birthday. Unlike Jonas, Crespo indisputably became a free agent when his contract with Chelsea came to an end. A tabloid estimated that Crespo cost Chelsea £1.3m per goal - a novel way of determining market value perhaps. Although on first glance this would appear quite expensive, the real test would be to assess the goals themselves. A championship-winning goal might well be worth twice that much. Other data to be factored in should include how much clubs are paying for other strikers' goals, something this blogger has taken upon himself to work out.

 

Jonas, nine years to the day Crespo's junior, is not a forward whose value can be determined through a simple division over goals scored. He is not an iconic international, although he did start for Argentina in their recent World Cup qualifier against Brazil. Joining the Premier League is a long-held ambition: in 2003 he spent a week in Liverpool on an unofficial trial, and was left wide-eyed after sharing a dressing room with Michael Owen. Last January there were also rumours linking him to Portsmouth, but again nothing came of them.

 

Now he is set to join Newcastle in time for a pre-season friendly tournament set to take place from August 1-3 in ... Mallorca. Two German clubs, plus Newcastle and Real Mallorca will compete for the delight of tourists on the Mediterranean island, most of whom are either German or English. Among them, no doubt, will be Freddy Shepherd as he prepares his takeover bid for Real Mallorca. "All of these added dramas have come as a complete surprise to us," says Manu Martin, handling the PR for the event. "But it's all good publicity," he adds, reminding me that tickets are already being lapped up by tour operators.

 

The Greyhound may well find his first appearance for his new club taking place at his old home. While his true market value is grappled over by lawyers and agents, Jonas can only dream of a time when he, like Crespo, can reap the fruits of his labour and truly own his destiny. Perhaps by retreating to Patagonia and investing in a horse breeding business?

 

 

 

[Belfast Boy]

Some very interesting stuff in there, I just wish it was clear whether he can play this weekend or not.

[Skirge]

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/more-sport/2008/08/14/keegan-s-gut-ted-by-row-115875-20696777/

KEEGAN'S GUT-TED BY ROW

 

By Simon Bird 14/08/2008

 

EXCLUSIVE

 

Kevin Keegan's plans for the new season are in disarray - because new signing Jonas Gutierrez is not yet registered to play against Manchester United.

 

The Argentine star was hailed as Keegan's big capture after joining three weeks ago, but the Spanish FA has refused to release his international clearance in a row over the way the winger quit Real Mallorca.

 

Gutierrez bought himself out of the last two years of his club contract, but the Spaniards wants 15 million euros in compensation and have kept his registration.

 

Fifa bosses are set to rule on the case but, with time running out, Keegan is unlikely to be able to choose his first-choice team for Sunday's opener.

 

And adding to the confusion, United have yet to confirm whether Fabrizio Coloccini has completed his move from Deportivo La Coruna.

[thomas]

[geordie jamie]

Could be as simple as the press dont know anymore then we do and are just trying to make a story and ew do have his registration.

 

clutching at straws i know.

[Skirge]

Could be as simple as the press dont know anymore then we do and are just trying to make a story and ew do have his registration.

 

clutching at straws i know.

 

I think it makes perfect sense, they did not want him to leave, he bought himself out so now they are being cunts over it, this is the kind of issue where FIFA should be helping the player. Instead they would rather say stupid things about stuff like the Ronaldo saga, when this is a situation where they could really help out.

[Kasper]

Could be as simple as the press dont know anymore then we do and are just trying to make a story and ew do have his registration.

 

clutching at straws i know.

 

I think it makes perfect sense, they did not want him to leave, he bought himself out so now they are being cunts over it, this is the kind of issue where FIFA should be helping the player. Instead they would rather say stupid things about stuff like the Ronaldo saga, when this is a situation where they could really help out.

 

That's exactly how the papers have worked it out. They don't have any more proof than we so its all bull shit.

[UV]

Could be as simple as the press dont know anymore then we do and are just trying to make a story and ew do have his registration.

 

clutching at straws i know.

 

I think it makes perfect sense, they did not want him to leave, he bought himself out so now they are being c***s over it, this is the kind of issue where FIFA should be helping the player. Instead they would rather say stupid things about stuff like the Ronaldo saga, when this is a situation where they could really help out.

 

FIFA don't like the ruling - and I don't blame them tbh - so they're not going to make it easy if they can help it. However there's nothing they can do to stop it.

 

IMO we need to threaten to sue FIFA for damages for every day he is restricted from working due to the holdup, as technically any restriction of player movement is illegal under European law I believe. The FIFA regulations are just a compromise they managed to reach with the European Commission. If they are not going to stick to that ruling, or are going to be awkward about it, then the EC could abolish the whole player contract situation as we know it, and I doubt FIFA want to open up that can of worms.

 

[Guest neesy111]

most papers say it's due international clearance, which should be sorted in time

[Kasper]

most papers say it's due international clearance, which should be sorted in time

 

most (all?!?) papers know as much as we do.

[Skirge]

I think the fact  players can but themselves out of their contracts is a disgrace, the whole thing stinks but the fact remains they can and whilst that rule exists then FIFA should make sure things get done in a decent manner and not allow any of the clubs to hold things up with petty actions.

 

I can see this dragging on for months and months, all the s*** about them wanting compensation that is, I think we will get the paperwork sorted soon enough but the claim for compo will all end up in the Court of Arbitration for Sport.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

 

http://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/sport/3593310.Keegan_faces_anxious_wait/

Keegan faces anxious wait

 

9:18am Thursday 14th August 2008

 

comment Comments (0)  Have your say »

Photograph of the Author By Paul Fraser »

 

 

KEVIN KEEGAN faces a nervous wait to disciover whether Newcastle United’s attacking options will be further dented by the non-availability of summer signing Jonas Gutierrez this weekend.

 

The Newcastle manager learned yesterday that disgraced footballer Joey Barton has admitted a Football Association charge of violent conduct for his assault on former Manchester City team-mate Ousmane Dabo.

 

While Keegan was weighing up a potential lengthy ban for Barton – the £5.8m signing has requested a personal hearing – Gutierrez’s transfer from Real Mallorca also continues to cause problems for the club.

 

The move has been held up by a dispute over the remaining wages he claims to be owed by the La Liga outfit, with FIFA now involved.

 

The FA have so far been unable to give the 24-year-old international clearance, while their counterparts in Spain have not sent the required certificate to London.

 

The matter has now been put in the hands of the world game’s governing body, and Newcastle are waiting to hear the outcome.

 

It has been suggested that the transfer could still be given the goahead before the weekend, a l t h o u g h there are no c e r t a i n t i e s and the South A m e r i c a n ’ s move cannot be finalised until the documents are through.

 

Such a situation has presented itself after Gutierrez lodged a complaint to FIFA after claiming he was owed wages from May and June from Mallorca.

 

And the furore is further fuelled by the Balearic club’s demand of £8m in compensation, with his former employers alleging Gutierrez broke from the remaining two years on his contract illegally.

 

The doubts about the winger’s availability for Newcastle’s opening Premier League match at Manchester United on Sunday is far from ideal, particularly as Keegan could be without five of his six strikers at Old Trafford.

 

Around 12,000 fans were inside St James’ Park yesterday to witness the Newcastle squad train before the start of the new season and Alan Smith was the only forward who took part in the full session.

 

And while Michael Owen jogged his way around the Tyneside turf, the absence of both Obafemi Martins and Shola Ameobi acted an as an indication that both may not figure in Manchester.

 

And while Michael Owen jogged his way around the Tyneside turf, both Obafemi Martins and Shola Ameobi were absent.

 

Martins suffered a knee injury in Saturday’s win over Valencia and the fear is that the Nigerian will not figure in the opening match.

 

The non-appearance of Ameobi was down to the growing possibility of a move to Ipswich Town. Town have revived their interest and the 26-year-old was believed to be in East Anglia last night for a medical.

 

If Ameobi departs and Martins was deemed unfit to play on Sunday, there would be a temptation to risk captain Michael Owen’s injured calf.

 

Despite both Mark Viduka and Andy Carroll being sidelined for several weeks, that is highly unlikely.

 

Keegan – hoping to learn that £9.5m defender Fabricio Colocini has been registered as a Newcastle player in the next 24 hours – would have to build his team around lone striker Smith, with Damien Duff and James Milner in contention to figure as forwards.

 

Milner’s future also remains in doubt, with Keegan’s hopes of retaining the player in the hands of owner Mike Ashley.

 

Aston Villa remain interested in signing Milner and Ashley could be willing to sell in an attempt to strengthen Newcastle’s arm on other transfer fronts before the window closes on August 31.

 

It has emerged that Newcastle have been in contact with Juventus in the hope of signing Portuguese midfielder Tiago on loan.

 

The former Chelsea man is not willing to make a permanent move back to the Premier League and Newcastle have proposed an initial season- long loan deal. If it suits both parties, the 27-year-old would complete a full-time switch next summer.

 

Tiago’s arrival would help bolster Keegan’s midfield options if the FA dished out a lengthy suspension to Barton.

 

It is expected Barton’s FA hearing will be next month and a 15-match ban is possible.

[BONTEMPI]

Fucking hell we don't half cause problems for ourselves

 

We should have had a squad assembled by the end of July and prepared instead of fucking around like we are.

 

Ok it's Mallorca holding it up but how long has this club had to sort allot of the shit out? 4 players in which are an unknown quantity as yet and 2 down on the start of last season with the possibility of another 3 going, Ok it's by far from panic stations yet but with the speed of these transfers we'll be lucky to get 1 more in before the end.

 

It's rainy and i'm grumpy!