AlanSkÃrare Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 Some people should check the earlier parts of this thread. We were all convinced he was going to tear the whole world apart when we sold him. At his best he was unplayable. That potential is forgotten by so many. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interpolic Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 It's 12 months of good form (forget the Championship season if you like but do the same for the likes of Coloccini) and the Liverpool move hasn't worked out. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BottledDog Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 It's f***ing mental how Carroll's suddenly become the most useless laughing stock in the league to some people on here, hilariously short memories. Not really he's never been a good footballer, he was good at being on the end the type of attacks we built during that time span but he was never a good footballer. Also he's been awful for longer than he's been good. This is the type of thing I'm talking about. He was immense for us in 2010, you must have been in a coma during that period and compensated by having a flick through the book of football cliches. What Ian W's saying is fair enough but comments like yours are ridiculous. He's had a bad time at Liverpool but will be a good Premier League player. He was good for 6 months and he's been awful the rest of the time. I have to believe it was a flukey run of form as in nearly 2 years since he hasnt come close to replicating the form not even once. I realise he was really good in those 6 months when he had the entire team built for him, but before then and since then he hasnt shown anything to suggest it wasn't just a flukey run of form. 6 months? He got his first team debut at 17, was awarded the Jackie Milburn pot, after scoring against Juve a year later he was given a big up by Buffon, when we went down he became first choice and top scorer, he was given the number 9 shirt and every man and his dog expected big things for him. He lived up to the hype, looked absolutely unstoppable at times, and became the most expensive British footballer of all time. I'm still pretty sure he's got more about him than just getting the rub of the green for half a season. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiresias Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 He can definitely play footy, but we can't compete with the rich top clubs spunking money on what would amount to a vanity player in our current squad. I'd be alright with him coming for £10m but any more and it'll impact our spending elsewhere. If we are to keep competing for the champions league, unless Ashley is willing to invest way more than he has recently (and I don't blame him for not, I think football clubs spending ridiculous money damages the sport as a whole and incurs debts often and bringing in Cisse etc shows plenty of ambition), we have to make sure we get value for money and make sure every million we pay for a player is what Man City would have to pay £3m or so for to get similar quality. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole_Toonfan Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 He only did anything in the first team during those 6 months, i don't care for friendly's against Juventus or the Championship it means nothing. Also yep so unstoppable he was that he scored 10 goals in 18 games, definitely the goal return of an unstoppable beast. Carroll is a good target man for a mid table club but nothing more than that really. We have moved on and excelled he isn't good enough for a top 6 team. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoSelecta Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 Maybe a move to a percieved 'bigger club' for a British all time record, leaving all his friends and family and the pressures which come with all that was too much for a young lad of what, 21? We all saw last season with Ba what difference abit of confidence can make. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
colinmk Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 It's f***ing mental how Carroll's suddenly become the most useless laughing stock in the league to some people on here, hilariously short memories. Not really he's never been a good footballer, he was good at being on the end the type of attacks we built during that time span but he was never a good footballer. Also he's been awful for longer than he's been good. :lol: So basically you have just admitted he was good then. Not what i meant by being a " good footballer " being a good forward and a good footballer is two totally different things. For example Tim Cahill was a fantastic finisher but quite average in his general play so i wouldnt really call him a " great footballer" Andy Carroll's job is to finish mate, he isn't a Del Piero ffs. And for a big guy he actually has pretty decent feet btw. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole_Toonfan Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 It's f***ing mental how Carroll's suddenly become the most useless laughing stock in the league to some people on here, hilariously short memories. Not really he's never been a good footballer, he was good at being on the end the type of attacks we built during that time span but he was never a good footballer. Also he's been awful for longer than he's been good. :lol: So basically you have just admitted he was good then. Not what i meant by being a " good footballer " being a good forward and a good footballer is two totally different things. For example Tim Cahill was a fantastic finisher but quite average in his general play so i wouldnt really call him a " great footballer" Andy Carroll's job is to finish mate, he isn't a Del Piero ffs. And for a big guy he actually has pretty decent feet btw. Never denied all that tbf, just dont agree he has this immense potential like some people. Also he's not that great of a finisher even during his 6 months of really good form he missed a lot of chances, he's your typical target man he will get goals but never by the bucketload. More likely to get a decent amount and set up chances for others too. He's more likely to get 10 goals and 10 assists than 20 goals for example. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jayson Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 He was on track for 20+ in his first season in the prem Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole_Toonfan Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 He was on track for 20+ in his first season in the prem So was Ba but that didn't happen, because you are on track don't mean it will happen. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jayson Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 Whats the basis that its unlikely theyd keep the earlier form up bar injuries/their position being changed as with those two? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Crooks Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 Noone can justify to me why Carroll would cost £5-10 million more than someone like Cisse or Cabaye. Just goes to show how blase and ill-informed those with the buying capacity are when it comes to the global game and how it's played. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Venkman Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 I think the pendulum has swung too far the other way as far as perceptions of Carroll go. He was never worth 35 but a bad season under the tutellidge of a certified loon (in which he steadily improved and ended up showing well at a major international tournament) doesnt mean he is worthless. 15m is a decent deal and if we keep ba and cisse too I'd welcome him back. Sense amongst the madness. Imo he's simply not worth 15m quid. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest antz1uk Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 I think the pendulum has swung too far the other way as far as perceptions of Carroll go. He was never worth 35 but a bad season under the tutellidge of a certified loon (in which he steadily improved and ended up showing well at a major international tournament) doesnt mean he is worthless. 15m is a decent deal and if we keep ba and cisse too I'd welcome him back. Sense amongst the madness. Imo he's simply not worth the hassle, can get much better for less Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teasy Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 Sky Sports News reckon West Ham are offering Liverpool £2m as a loan fee and £16m to take him permanently if they stay up Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teasy Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 I think the pendulum has swung too far the other way as far as perceptions of Carroll go. He was never worth 35 but a bad season under the tutellidge of a certified loon (in which he steadily improved and ended up showing well at a major international tournament) doesnt mean he is worthless. 15m is a decent deal and if we keep ba and cisse too I'd welcome him back. Its not just a case of his worth in general though, its also what he's worth to us. As a first choice striker that fits the way you want your side to play I'd agree he's worth somewhere near £15m (that's what I thought he was worth when Liverpool bought him). But IMO he shouldn't be a starter for us and doesn't suit the way we should be looking to setup our side. So with that in mind he's not worth near £15m to us (even £10m would feel wrong to me unless it has no effect at all on other transfers). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 £17m bid from West Ham on BBC. http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18995674 Guess it's not that much new news. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varadi Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 At least if West Ham get a bid accepted we'll know what sort of numbers we're potentially dealing with. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeletor Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 I wouldn't mind him back but personally I don't value him at any more than £8m which is about half of what Liverpool would realistically accept so I'd rather we pursued other targets. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkie Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 No one should be bidding for Carroll until the last day of the transfer window. Its either: do that (and pay something close to his value), pay over the odds now, or just miss out altogether on a player that isn't worth the hassle anyway. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
toontownman Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 Don't mind paying up to 13m for him. I'm with Skeletor, I don't value him more than 8m but given the situation and the current market on British players I don't think 13m is unreasonable. He will get back to his best here and is only 23. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dyeyzzon Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 Always felt that Liverpool would let him go for at least somewhere near half the 35m. West Ham could be a decent and balanced side if they spend that elsewhere though, imo. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 Yorkie, why have you changed your tune so hugely? You were crying with the rest of us when he left. Has your opinion on him changed that much in 12 months purely because Ba and Cisse have been brilliant and Carroll has been poor? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkie Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 Realistically, any fee is a punt considering his God-awful form, never mind £17m of your promotion transfer kitty. Anyone who is interested in him is paying on the basis of five months NUFC-form and a few England caps. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkie Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 Yorkie, why have you changed your tune so hugely? You were crying with the rest of us when he left. Has your opinion on him changed that much in 12 months purely because Ba and Cisse have been brilliant and Carroll has been poor? There's nothing extravagant in the reasoning. My opinion of the man changed almost immediately. I think hes a cunt for surrendering the number 9 and chasing the money, and I dont think hes a great player. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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