Guest Howaythetoon Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 If Allardyce is all that, why were West Ham the only club that wanted him? Why despite his boasting, are NUFC the only club of stature to have ever employed him? Why does he have a reputation of playing drab long ball football? Where's that video from the open day at SJP where the fool was mithering on and on, over the PA system. One of the most uninspiring things I've ever heard. God knows what he would be like in the dressing room. I'll flip the coin and ask if he was so shite, why does he keep getting jobs? He's not the best manager, quite average in fact, but I'll go back to the very thing that drives football - results. The man delivers. Some of the things he has achieved, have been really good, like that 6th placed finish at Bolton. Overall I believe Big Sam stayed at Bolton too long and just didn't adapt his tactics. His philopshies are actually quite good in terms of science, structure etc. He fucked up massively at Newcastle though and I bet it hurts him badly. I do believe though, there is one big final chance for him to do something really good in his career. Regarding reccords or carreers it is obvious that in those respects, Big Sam is the better manager so I do wonder why the and sneers from other users when I say such a thing. Even if Pardew were to lead us to 6th, it would not be as big an achievement as Big Sam taking Bolton to 6th. What Pardew has over Big Sam is adaptability which he has shown at Newcastle. You couldn't picture Allardyce having zero control on transfers for example, or little imput, which is probably one of the reasons he was sacked in the first place. Pardew sees a bigger picture to his credit. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
junkhead Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Bolton were 6th. That to be fair was an achievement. With us, he was a disaster and at Blackburn they were bloody dreadful. Says a lot that he's ended up rooting around the Championship because Allardyce was sussed out as a charlatan a long time ago. Howay, to finish 6th with Bolton was huge, an amazing achievement. He is a good manager. Someone who gets reults. They may not be pretty and to everyone's liking but the man delivers. Want guaranteed promotion? He's your man. Want guaranteed survival? He's you rman. Give him 5 years and he'll build your club up to be in a position to compete as he did at Bolton. Yes he was a massive failure here, hugely so and embarrassingly so at times, but the man can manage a football club, and players. Pardew is doing the same and to a very high degree today and long may it continue. But overall, Big Sam has shown he's the better manager and I think when West Ham go up, they'll stay up and become a comfortable mid-table side, the kind of side we will become under Pardew, despite our very good season thus far. I say that because I don't think he has the abilities or skills to achieve more. Similar logic would make Joe Kinnear better than both. The times they are a-changing, HTT. Otherwise I think some of your concerns are valid. Earlier in the season Pardew often spoke about adopting a more fluid approach. Tactically, it's obvious that we're often direct to the maximum. I simply feel our midfield is capable of more. Too often the CMs are sitting very deep, focused on the defensive part and it seems that playing two equally unorthodox and ineffective wingers at the same time doesn't concern Pardew. Results speak for themselves and long may they continue but I trust my eyes and imo, we're not playing good football. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Don't see the point in 'this manager did this and that at this club', Allardyce was fucking shocking for us, Pardew has been very good. That's all I am really fussed about if I'm honest. I would sort of understand if Allardyce had been some amazing success pre and post Newcastle but he hasn't really. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest VaVaVoom Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Allardyce is a better manager than Pardew whose football philsophies is actually quite similar to that of our former manager, stats based, percentages football, solid defence, direct football. We've put in many a poor performance under Pardew as we did under Allardyce. Pardew is just more slick and more likeable if you like as a personality. Big Sam was welcomed here with open arms by most on his appointment but as soon as we got a billionaire owner fans' attitudes started to change and he become quite the scapegoat. That said, some of the results and performances under him helped to underline fans' attitude towards him which didn't help his cause. I still believe, we'd have stayed up under him and would have went onto become a solid consistent top 8 side at least.... which fast forward to this very days is probably our true level under Pardew. Absolute bollocks Your agenda against Pardew is verging on embarrassing. All of the players like him, the owners like him and most of the fans like him. Wake up man the reason you are in the minority is that you are WRONG! Well said ma'man. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howaythetoon Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 By the way, I do not hate Pardew nor do I simply not rate him. Lastly, I do not consider him to be doing a shitty job either. He is doing a very good job. I believe though that the way the club is set up these days and the players that we have, that someone with better tactical nous and football knoweldge if you like, would do even better within this set-up and with our players, to the point where I question whether long-term we shouldn't be looking to upgrade on Pardew in the same way we all look at Simpson and think, aye, he's done well, but if we are to progress... I know it seems churlish to even think like that given where we are and where we have come from but I can't help thinking about the future or the long-term, espeically when I consider this to be the best side we've had since Sir Bobby and the best opportunity in many a year to really kick on. As such I genuinley believe, this is our maxim under Pardew, that he, although obviously quite instrumental himself, isn't the actual key factor in our upturn of form and results, but that key players, key moments and key recruitment is more so. And therefore, me personally, I'd eventually like to see this club look to improve on Pardew and bring in someone who fits our philopshy more or rather the players' philosophy. These players need a tactician, someone who knows how to develop a footballing philsophy. Who is that man? I do not know but if our scouting can identify the player equiverlent, than surely, we can identify the managerial equiverlent. Its strange because the J-League Wenger would have been perfect for us. We need to find that kind of man. He's out there, somewhere. If we don't, we'll waste this oppotunity. Pardew is too limited. We'll finishb top 7 max and possibly 6th but the season after and the season after that, when others around us will grow just as strong, when those we are displacing will recover? Back to mid-table for me. We are better than that, even under Ashley and co. Anyway I'm gonna lay off him if you like for now because it reads like I hate the guy and see no positive. Hopefully he can develop into our J-League Wenger if you like and take us further and further afield to success. I can't see it myself but you never know. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
OzzieMandias Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Just because he was a poor NUFC manager does not make him a shit manager. It makes him a poor NUFC manager, though. Piss-poor, actually. Pardew, on the other hand, is clearly a pretty good NUFC manager. He's got to grips with the situation at the club and, working within tighter limits than most of the clubs around us in the table, has been wringing out results, assembling the beginnings of a pretty tasty squad, and even had us playing some half-decent football at times. The Stoke game has recently been mentioned once or twice on this thread as an example of us playing "hoofball". Me, I thought it was an object lesson in how to beat that lot at their own game, in their own gaff. I really enjoyed it. Anyway, Allardyce. Poor NUFC manager. Proven to be such. Fuck knows why we're comparing him to Pardew, who has exceeded absolutely everyone's expectations. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BooBoo Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 I'm just not sure why you seem adamant that we will slip back down while others surpass us? Which teams? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nufc4eva Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 I would like to stick with the same manager for longer than 2 years n see what happens rather than think about upgrading. What we need above all else is stability for next few years no matter if we finish 5th or 10th Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Si Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 I would like to stick with the same manager for longer than 2 years n see what happens rather than think about upgrading. What we need above all else is stability for next few years no matter if we finish 5th or 10th This, a thousand times this. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
OzzieMandias Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 I would like to stick with the same manager for longer than 2 years n see what happens rather than think about upgrading. What we need above all else is stability for next few years no matter if we finish 5th or 10th Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ponsaelius Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Jesus. I get that you don't rate Pardew but the players bought, results and performances under Allardyce were dreadful. He bought Beye, Enrique, Rosenthal, Faye, Smith, Geremi and Viduka. Anyone else? Only the first two were successes. The wretched home game v Liverpool (whilst we lost 3-0, it was for me far more incompetent than the 1-5 defeat the next season) under Fat Sam was the most clueless NUFC performance I've seen in my 25 years watching the club. Then there was the Portsmouth shambles not to mention gifting the worst PL side of all time, 4 points. A Derby side who were getting cuffed of everyone. We lost 0-1 and Sam reckoned if we'd taken a 0-0 draw it would have been a great result. Better than Pardew. Utter drivel. Big Sam's career pisses all over Pardew's to be honest. Of course he is a better manager. Lets not forget it was only a few years back Bolton were where we are now, mighty fucking Bolton, finishing 6th. That's when the league was far stronger too. Just because he was a poor NUFC manager does not make him a shit manager. The league was not stronger like, City and Spurs (not to mention ourselves) were cack back then. Everton got top 4 that season with an awful squad. Edit: Even Boro finished 7th just behind Bolton FFS Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sifu Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Allardyce a better manager than Pardew? Bloody hell, I've heard it all now :lol: Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Venkman Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Don't see the point in 'this manager did this and that at this club', Allardyce was fucking shocking for us, Pardew has been very good. That's all I am really fussed about if I'm honest. I would sort of understand if Allardyce had been some amazing success pre and post Newcastle but he hasn't really. i agree with nick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newcastle Fan Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Allardyce a better manager than Pardew? Bloody hell, I've heard it all now :lol: I quite Like HTT's posts even when i don't agree with them but i now think he lost it.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sifu Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Who could forget this training session from Allardyce-era: Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BooBoo Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 That's the clip I was on about. Can literally only stand about ten seconds of that awful drone. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
EthiGeordie Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 HTT you are killing your reputation there for all his reputation Fat Sam's team was unfit when KK took over KK said he had to do some conditioning in his first month. I know you like Fat Sam a lot even when he is here but quite simply he is not a Newcastle Manager from the bigning. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NEEJ Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 HTT you are killing your reputation there for all his reputation Fat Sam's team was unfit when KK took over KK said he had to do some conditioning in his first month. I know you like Fat Sam a lot even when he is here but quite simply he is not a Newcastle Manager from the bigning. Couldn't have put it better myself Ethi. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BlacknWhiteArmy Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Have absolutely no clue what he is on about in that training clip. Someone care to expand on his 'tactics'? Although I would imagine it involving a long ball up to Viduka... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wormy Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 HTT you are killing your reputation there for all his reputation Fat Sam's team was unfit when KK took over KK said he had to do some conditioning in his first month. I know you like Fat Sam a lot even when he is here but quite simply he is not a Newcastle Manager from the bigning. Couldn't have put it better myself Ethi. You know shit's gone wrong in a thread when that's said. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanshithispantz Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 HTT you are killing your reputation there for all his reputation Fat Sam's team was unfit when KK took over KK said he had to do some conditioning in his first month. I know you like Fat Sam a lot even when he is here but quite simply he is not a Newcastle Manager from the bigning. Couldn't have put it better myself Ethi. You know shit's gone wrong in a thread when that's said. aye Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dokko Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 HTT you are killing your reputation there for all his reputation Fat Sam's team was unfit when KK took over KK said he had to do some conditioning in his first month. I know you like Fat Sam a lot even when he is here but quite simply he is not a Newcastle Manager from the bigning. Couldn't have put it better myself Ethi. You know shit's gone wrong in a thread when that's said. aye Fuk me this petrol is strong. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest elbee909 Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Playing for a draw against Derby, wasn't it. Dreadful. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NEEJ Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Playing for a draw against Derby, wasn't it. Dreadful. At home. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BooBoo Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Playing for a draw against Derby, wasn't it. Dreadful. For me, while that was awful, what summed up Allardyce was the tactical set up v Liverpool. After twenty minutes it was clear the players had absolutely no idea what they were supposed to be doing. Was horrible to watch. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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