Shearergol Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 Really, though? Again? Alright, yes, I will still judge Alan Pardew as Newcastle United manager based on his time as the manager of Newcastle United. You wouldn't be happy if we got Mourinho or Guardiola then? They'd have to prove themselves here before you accept them? http://blogs.vso.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/Moving-the-goalposts-300x2402.jpg What? To be fair, it's quite obvious what he's asking. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thomas Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 but he's got it all wrong Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Flash Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 If Wenger was to be interested I'd want him to have a trial period first. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest icemanblue Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 Really, though? Again? Alright, yes, I will still judge Alan Pardew as Newcastle United manager based on his time as the manager of Newcastle United. You wouldn't be happy if we got Mourinho or Guardiola then? They'd have to prove themselves here before you accept them? http://blogs.vso.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/Moving-the-goalposts-300x2402.jpg What? To be fair, it's quite obvious what he's asking. You're right, of course. Quite how he's got to that question from my post, I'm not sure. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shearergol Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 Really, though? Again? Alright, yes, I will still judge Alan Pardew as Newcastle United manager based on his time as the manager of Newcastle United. You wouldn't be happy if we got Mourinho or Guardiola then? They'd have to prove themselves here before you accept them? http://blogs.vso.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/Moving-the-goalposts-300x2402.jpg What? To be fair, it's quite obvious what he's asking. You're right, of course. Quite how he's got to that question from my post, I'm not sure. You're basically saying that the previous failings of a manager have no impact on how successful they'll be in the future? But I suppose you're in the belief that one day he might just work out how to be a good manager, despite proving time and time again that he hasn't got a clue. If Mourinho came in I'd be pretty confident that even with a couple of bad years with us, he's be able to turn it around, based on his previous success as a manager. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRC Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 Really, though? Again? Alright, yes, I will still judge Alan Pardew as Newcastle United manager based on his time as the manager of Newcastle United. Which has been pretty dreadful for 14 months. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest icemanblue Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 Really, though? Again? Alright, yes, I will still judge Alan Pardew as Newcastle United manager based on his time as the manager of Newcastle United. You wouldn't be happy if we got Mourinho or Guardiola then? They'd have to prove themselves here before you accept them? http://blogs.vso.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/Moving-the-goalposts-300x2402.jpg What? To be fair, it's quite obvious what he's asking. You're right, of course. Quite how he's got to that question from my post, I'm not sure. You're basically saying that the previous failings of a manager have no impact on how successful they'll be in the future? But I suppose you're in the belief that one day he might just work out how to be a good manager, despite proving time and time again that he hasn't got a clue. If Mourinho came in I'd be pretty confident that even with a couple of bad years with us, he's be able to turn it around, based on his previous success as a manager. No, I'm not. I'm saying I'll judge him on his time here by his results during his time here. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Haris Vuckic Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 Really, though? Again? Alright, yes, I will still judge Alan Pardew as Newcastle United manager based on his time as the manager of Newcastle United. You wouldn't be happy if we got Mourinho or Guardiola then? They'd have to prove themselves here before you accept them? http://blogs.vso.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/Moving-the-goalposts-300x2402.jpg What? To be fair, it's quite obvious what he's asking. You're right, of course. Quite how he's got to that question from my post, I'm not sure. You're basically saying that the previous failings of a manager have no impact on how successful they'll be in the future? But I suppose you're in the belief that one day he might just work out how to be a good manager, despite proving time and time again that he hasn't got a clue. If Mourinho came in I'd be pretty confident that even with a couple of bad years with us, he's be able to turn it around, based on his previous success as a manager. http://www.nufcblog.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/Mike-Ashley.jpg Anyone got Alan Curbishley's number!? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BottledDog Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 Really, though? Again? Alright, yes, I will still judge Alan Pardew as Newcastle United manager based on his time as the manager of Newcastle United. You wouldn't be happy if we got Mourinho or Guardiola then? They'd have to prove themselves here before you accept them? http://blogs.vso.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/Moving-the-goalposts-300x2402.jpg What? To be fair, it's quite obvious what he's asking. You're right, of course. Quite how he's got to that question from my post, I'm not sure. You're basically saying that the previous failings of a manager have no impact on how successful they'll be in the future? But I suppose you're in the belief that one day he might just work out how to be a good manager, despite proving time and time again that he hasn't got a clue. If Mourinho came in I'd be pretty confident that even with a couple of bad years with us, he's be able to turn it around, based on his previous success as a manager. Christ, are you really wanting to start this debate off again? Pardews previous jobs did not prove that time and time again that he hadn't got a clue. His record showed no small amount of success and a fair bit of promise punctured by a couple of collapses, one of which I'd only half lay at his door. He was certainly not a manager you could or should have written of entirely before his appointment here. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 Christ, are you really wanting to start this debate off again? Pardews previous jobs did not prove that time and time again that he hadn't got a clue. His record showed no small amount of success and a fair bit of promise punctured by a couple of collapses, one of which I'd only half lay at his door. He was certainly not a manager you could or should have written of entirely before his appointment here. Actually, he was. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benwell Lad Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 Christ, are you really wanting to start this debate off again? Pardews previous jobs did not prove that time and time again that he hadn't got a clue. His record showed no small amount of success and a fair bit of promise punctured by a couple of collapses, one of which I'd only half lay at his door. He was certainly not a manager you could or should have written of entirely before his appointment here. Actually, he was. Been trying to give this thread as wide a berth as possible, but in fairness Mick, Pardew had and still does have, a pretty good reputation within the game. That's what really counts when you're managing professional footballers. The opinions of fans on or off the internet is very much secondary to that. I have no doubt that Pardew will sooner or later be pushed out of NUFC, but he won't be out of work for long. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 Been trying to give this thread as wide a berth as possible, but in fairness Mick, Pardew had and still does have, a pretty good reputation within the game. That's what really counts when you're managing professional footballers. The opinions of fans on or off the internet is very much secondary to that. I have no doubt that Pardew will sooner or later be pushed out of NUFC, but he won't be out of work for long. Managers reputations are build around media spin as much as anything and I agree with what you're saying about his reputation, at least being higher than it should be. As for the amount of time he'll be out of a job, so what? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 Christ, are you really wanting to start this debate off again? Pardews previous jobs did not prove that time and time again that he hadn't got a clue. His record showed no small amount of success and a fair bit of promise punctured by a couple of collapses, one of which I'd only half lay at his door. He was certainly not a manager you could or should have written of entirely before his appointment here. Actually, he was. Been trying to give this thread as wide a berth as possible, but in fairness Mick, Pardew had and still does have, a pretty good reputation within the game. That's what really counts when you're managing professional footballers. The opinions of fans on or off the internet is very much secondary to that. I have no doubt that Pardew will sooner or later be pushed out of NUFC, but he won't be out of work for long. Why would he be pushed out of NUFC, his remit is hardly demanding? Keep us up with a squad that is probably among the 8 most expensive in terms of value in the premier. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lotus Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 Christ, are you really wanting to start this debate off again? Pardews previous jobs did not prove that time and time again that he hadn't got a clue. His record showed no small amount of success and a fair bit of promise punctured by a couple of collapses, one of which I'd only half lay at his door. He was certainly not a manager you could or should have written of entirely before his appointment here. Actually, he was. Been trying to give this thread as wide a berth as possible, but in fairness Mick, Pardew had and still does have, a pretty good reputation within the game. That's what really counts when you're managing professional footballers. The opinions of fans on or off the internet is very much secondary to that. I have no doubt that Pardew will sooner or later be pushed out of NUFC, but he won't be out of work for long. Just out of curiousity, what job do you hold 'within the game' to know the true thoughts of other professionals on him? Just asking... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Haris Vuckic Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 Christ, are you really wanting to start this debate off again? Pardews previous jobs did not prove that time and time again that he hadn't got a clue. His record showed no small amount of success and a fair bit of promise punctured by a couple of collapses, one of which I'd only half lay at his door. He was certainly not a manager you could or should have written of entirely before his appointment here. Actually, he was. Been trying to give this thread as wide a berth as possible, but in fairness Mick, Pardew had and still does have, a pretty good reputation within the game. That's what really counts when you're managing professional footballers. The opinions of fans on or off the internet is very much secondary to that. I have no doubt that Pardew will sooner or later be pushed out of NUFC, but he won't be out of work for long. Why would he be pushed out of NUFC, his remit is hardly demanding? Keep us up with a squad that is probably among the 8 most expensive in terms of value in the premier. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teasy Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 Christ, are you really wanting to start this debate off again? Pardews previous jobs did not prove that time and time again that he hadn't got a clue. His record showed no small amount of success and a fair bit of promise punctured by a couple of collapses, one of which I'd only half lay at his door. He was certainly not a manager you could or should have written of entirely before his appointment here. Actually, he was. Been trying to give this thread as wide a berth as possible, but in fairness Mick, Pardew had and still does have, a pretty good reputation within the game. That's what really counts when you're managing professional footballers. The opinions of fans on or off the internet is very much secondary to that. I have no doubt that Pardew will sooner or later be pushed out of NUFC, but he won't be out of work for long. Why would he be pushed out of NUFC, his remit is hardly demanding? Keep us up with a squad that is probably among the 8 most expensive in terms of value in the premier. Very unlikely as far as fees but we do have the 8th highest wage bill in the league so he's got a point. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varadi Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 Just realised there's been 14 new pages in this thread in the last 3 days and it's nearly a fortnight since we even had a game! Now should I go back and read them all - decisions, decisions.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Haris Vuckic Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 Christ, are you really wanting to start this debate off again? Pardews previous jobs did not prove that time and time again that he hadn't got a clue. His record showed no small amount of success and a fair bit of promise punctured by a couple of collapses, one of which I'd only half lay at his door. He was certainly not a manager you could or should have written of entirely before his appointment here. Actually, he was. Been trying to give this thread as wide a berth as possible, but in fairness Mick, Pardew had and still does have, a pretty good reputation within the game. That's what really counts when you're managing professional footballers. The opinions of fans on or off the internet is very much secondary to that. I have no doubt that Pardew will sooner or later be pushed out of NUFC, but he won't be out of work for long. Why would he be pushed out of NUFC, his remit is hardly demanding? Keep us up with a squad that is probably among the 8 most expensive in terms of value in the premier. Very unlikely as far as fees but we do have the 8th highest wage bill in the league so he's got a point. That's probably offset by our transfer profit - plus I imagine it's fictional anyway - our squad is pretty small and nobody is getting daft money. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Flash Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 Christ, are you really wanting to start this debate off again? Pardews previous jobs did not prove that time and time again that he hadn't got a clue. His record showed no small amount of success and a fair bit of promise punctured by a couple of collapses, one of which I'd only half lay at his door. He was certainly not a manager you could or should have written of entirely before his appointment here. Actually, he was. Been trying to give this thread as wide a berth as possible, but in fairness Mick, Pardew had and still does have, a pretty good reputation within the game. That's what really counts when you're managing professional footballers. The opinions of fans on or off the internet is very much secondary to that. I have no doubt that Pardew will sooner or later be pushed out of NUFC, but he won't be out of work for long. Why would he be pushed out of NUFC, his remit is hardly demanding? Keep us up with a squad that is probably among the 8 most expensive in terms of value in the premier. Very unlikely as far as fees but we do have the 8th highest wage bill in the league so he's got a point. That's probably offset by our transfer profit - plus I imagine it's fictional anyway - our squad is pretty small and nobody is getting daft money. It was 8th in April. Wage bill: 8th, £64m (up from £54m in 2011) Wages as proportion of turnover: 69% Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Haris Vuckic Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 Well - ok - but that doesn't do much to contradict my point. We spent the utter minimum we can. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spudil Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 Well - ok - but that doesn't do much to contradict my point. We spent the utter minimum we can. Of course it does ffs, are you daft? Let's look at what happened here - You laughed at the suggestion that we probably have the 8th most valuable squad in the league. Not just disagreed with it, you laughed at it. This obviously implies that you think that its far from the truth. It would be a strange thing to laugh at if you believed we had the 9th most valuable squad in the league, for example. You say that "We spent the utter minimum we can." -as if this somehow backs up your point (You think we have far from the 8th most valuable squad in the premier league). Is Arsenal's squad of inherently lower value because they have a low net spend too? No, let's not be stupid. Now squad value is not anywhere near an exact science but there are some factors that we can look at to get an objective view: salary (the big one) and transfermarkt values, even, yes, net spend/feed paid but they have to be looked at within context. To sum up, you're talking utter s**** as usual. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 Well - ok - but that doesn't do much to contradict my point. We spent the utter minimum we can. Of course it does ffs, are you daft? Let's look at what happened here - You laughed at the suggestion that we probably have the 8th most valuable squad in the league. Not just disagreed: laughed. This obviously implies that you think that it is far from the truth. It would be a strange thing to laugh at if you believed we had the 9th most valuable squad in the league, for example. You say that "We spent the utter minimum we can." -as if this somehow backs up your point (You think we have far from the 8th most valuable squad in the premier league). Is Arsenal's squad of inherently lower value because they have a low net spend too? No, let's not be stupid. Now squad value is not anywhere near an exact science but there are some factors that we can look at to get an objective view: salary (the big one) and transfermarkt values, even, yes, net spend/feed paid but they have to be looked at within context. To sum up, you're talking utter s**** as usual. That's a pretty good breakdown of what I was saying. Look at Cabaye for example. Just because we paid £4.5m for him doesn't mean he's a £4.5m player. We've already rejected an offer of over £10m and you could probably add at least another £5m to that for his true value. Norwich, Swansea and Southampton have spent shedloads this season but I'd be surprised if man for man they have a squad that is valued at anything close to ours. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
merlin Posted October 17, 2013 Share Posted October 17, 2013 Christ, are you really wanting to start this debate off again? Pardews previous jobs did not prove that time and time again that he hadn't got a clue. His record showed no small amount of success and a fair bit of promise punctured by a couple of collapses, one of which I'd only half lay at his door. He was certainly not a manager you could or should have written of entirely before his appointment here. Actually, he was. Been trying to give this thread as wide a berth as possible, but in fairness Mick, Pardew had and still does have, a pretty good reputation within the game. That's what really counts when you're managing professional footballers. The opinions of fans on or off the internet is very much secondary to that. I have no doubt that Pardew will sooner or later be pushed out of NUFC, but he won't be out of work for long. Reputations ' in the game' mean absolutely nothing in England....there is a closed shop of former players who become managers and a cosy cartel between large sections of the media and managers. The only one I can think of that the media ganged up against(as a club manager), esp in the NE, was Dalglish at NUFC because he didn't give them lots of easy tit-bits every day so they could all run down to the pub and have an easy job. If Pardew had a 'reputation in the game' in the Bundesliga, for example, I might agree with your theory - as it is, the PL is over-hyped and overpaid compared to the professional set up they have in Germany which benefits the fans too by having cheaper(and better value) ST prices. The English game does hand stands if the national team manages to qualify for the WC when playing against nations who should in the main be easy meat for a country with such a major concentration on football as its main sport - that alone, and the record in WCs compared to that of Germany, indicates that the English game is not a great benchmark on which to be judged. Even using that, Pardew has had a poor record at the previous clubs he managed after his first season with them and both W Ham and Southampton have become better clubs since he left...his handling of Mascherano and Tevez alone at W Ham tells you all you need to know about his judgment of players and how to use them..ask Tevez what he thinks of Pardew.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ste Posted October 17, 2013 Share Posted October 17, 2013 Tevez claimed he was a good football man but out of his comfort zone with foreign players. I think he didn't play him in the correctly or Mascherano at all because they were forced on him and he felt slighted. He perhaps also felt a loyalty to the players already there. Strange given he's probably been behind the signings of only a few players here. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted October 17, 2013 Share Posted October 17, 2013 Tevez claimed he was a good football man but out of his comfort zone with foreign players. I think he didn't play him in the correctly or Mascherano at all because they were forced on him and he felt slighted. He perhaps also felt a loyalty to the players already there. Strange given he's probably been behind the signings of only a few players here. I guess his expectations were different there, and he was a bit more put out by the arrival of those two. It's easy to say he should have just got on with it and used them well, but I can understand how he was pissed off. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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