Happinesstan Posted January 2, 2022 Share Posted January 2, 2022 6 minutes ago, St. Maximin said: What’s the criteria for defining world class? He hasn’t really done anything of note in years. You can see the clear impact he had here but he wouldn’t be the first or last manager to get a team promoted and then mid-table in the Prem. Seems to be a reason he isn’t getting attention from the best teams now. Saying that managers and clubs can often just be the wrong for each other and that’s clearly happened here and I imagine China too. Clearly not all his fault, but pretty understandable if Everton fanbase is annoyed. Top clubs don't need a Rafa anymore. You have to remember Liverpool were anything but a top club when he took over. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 2, 2022 Share Posted January 2, 2022 (edited) 52 minutes ago, The Butcher said: Very good prospect. Get experience for 2-3 years at a middling Premier League team then we can get him to replace Trippier. Edited January 2, 2022 by Optimistic Nut Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrRaspberryJam Posted January 2, 2022 Share Posted January 2, 2022 2 minutes ago, Optimistic Nut said: Very good prospect. Get experience for 2-3 years at a middling Premier League team then we can get him to replace Trippier. Nice. Real nice. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Posted January 2, 2022 Share Posted January 2, 2022 13 minutes ago, Mr Raspberry Jam said: Nice. Real nice. No need for stuff like this IMO. "Middling" my arse. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted January 2, 2022 Share Posted January 2, 2022 1 hour ago, Thiago said: The decision to join Everton while our fate was still unknown. When he was announced we were hearing that there was no viable way for them to stop the takeover. I can promise you their chats with Rafa would have been a lot more informative and clear on timelines etc. I love the guy, but he was never going to be a success there. There's a reason only one man had done it before him in 129 years. Even the briefings coming out painted him as 'the best they could get'. I admire his work ethic, but for someone that has spent his whole career wanting total control it baffles me why he wouldn't wait another six months to a year. He'd have had chance to shape this club in every conceivable way, and basically been seen as the man that ushered in a revolution at a success starved club. He's never really done that before either. He's usually only ever done it at clubs with a past. Even if he hadn't worked with Liverpool previously, what is appealing about that job? No disrespect to Everton, but you're going into a two team city in which the other team is streets ahead and you've got no money to change things. Throw in that a good portion hate you, it just screams dumb idea. His home is in Liverpool. If you can recall, he came to us ahead of London clubs because he wanted to be closer to home. That's it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sh74 Posted January 2, 2022 Share Posted January 2, 2022 1 hour ago, TRon said: His home is in Liverpool. If you can recall, he came to us ahead of London clubs because he wanted to be closer to home. That's it. He went to China. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wormy Posted January 2, 2022 Share Posted January 2, 2022 I get he loves his work but I find it mad that instead of just going and spending some time at his home in Liverpool whilst biding his time for a more suitable role, he jumped at a job that everyone (apart from him, I guess) knew would end in tears solely because of the fans just because said job is near that home. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Posted January 2, 2022 Share Posted January 2, 2022 It's not solely because of the fans at all, though. It's because our club needs gutting from top to bottom. He's not helping himself however with a series of utterly bewildering decisions. Players may have let him down, we may have had some bad luck with injuries but it genuinely seems like he's losing the plot. Playing an ageing full back out of position instead of the extremely capable left back he'd ostracised on the bench is indicative of where things are at. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dokko Posted January 2, 2022 Share Posted January 2, 2022 2 minutes ago, Neil said: It's not solely because of the fans at all, though. It's because our club needs gutting from top to bottom. He's not helping himself however with a series of utterly bewildering decisions. Players may have let him down, we may have had some bad luck with injuries but it genuinely seems like he's losing the plot. Playing an ageing full back out of position instead of the extremely capable left back he'd ostracised on the bench is indicative of where things are at. Massively petty by him. Also with a new LB coming and and Digne frozen out it devalues him for when other clubs come in knowing everton are up against if for FFP. Especially as another big fee signing is coming in as well. Just don't see the logic in doing this. You play him till he leaves if the position requires. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Prophet Posted January 2, 2022 Share Posted January 2, 2022 Rafa has always been quite petty like. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Posted January 2, 2022 Share Posted January 2, 2022 6 minutes ago, Dokko said: Massively petty by him. Also with a new LB coming and and Digne frozen out it devalues him for when other clubs come in knowing everton are up against if for FFP. Especially as another big fee signing is coming in as well. Just don't see the logic in doing this. You play him till he leaves if the position requires. Makes little to no sense. Don't understand what he's really achieving other than getting rid of one of our best players in one of the few positions we have someone of actual quality (albeit hes been below his best the last 12 months). In short, club is a fucking mess but Rafa is threatening to make it worse rather than better. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LV Posted January 2, 2022 Share Posted January 2, 2022 1 minute ago, Neil said: Makes little to no sense. Don't understand what he's really achieving other than getting rid of one of our best players in one of the few positions we have someone of actual quality (albeit hes been below his best the last 12 months). In short, club is a fucking mess but Rafa is threatening to make it worse rather than better. Does he have the final say on transfers? Surely those above him are agreeing/ sanctioning these moves? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Jinx Posted January 2, 2022 Share Posted January 2, 2022 Apparently having a board meeting tomorrow to see if they are still all on the same page after backing him before. If he’s still in favour they will approve a transfer strategy, if not then he’ll be gone before end of month. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wormy Posted January 2, 2022 Share Posted January 2, 2022 (edited) 20 minutes ago, Neil said: It's not solely because of the fans at all, though. It's because our club needs gutting from top to bottom. He's not helping himself however with a series of utterly bewildering decisions. Players may have let him down, we may have had some bad luck with injuries but it genuinely seems like he's losing the plot. Playing an ageing full back out of position instead of the extremely capable left back he'd ostracised on the bench is indicative of where things are at. Agreed on all of the above and wasn't meaning to blame it solely on the fans; badly worded. More that the instant pushback over his rumoured appointment alone should've set alarm bells ringing for him. Edited January 2, 2022 by wormy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fantail Breeze Posted January 2, 2022 Share Posted January 2, 2022 29 minutes ago, Neil said: It's not solely because of the fans at all, though. It's because our club needs gutting from top to bottom. He's not helping himself however with a series of utterly bewildering decisions. Players may have let him down, we may have had some bad luck with injuries but it genuinely seems like he's losing the plot. Playing an ageing full back out of position instead of the extremely capable left back he'd ostracised on the bench is indicative of where things are at. They’ve let Rafa start a process of building his own team of players he trusts to play his system and methods, with Rodriguez shipped off sharpish and Digne seemingly following. What good would it do to rip all of that up and start again with someone else? Unless Everton are in real danger of relegation, which I don’t think will happen, why not let him have this season and see what he builds? Arteta is a good recent example of a manager being afforded time and the rewards coming through. Otherwise you’ll stay stuck in this cycle of new managers bringing in new players and new systems and ending up with this complete mishmash. Of course there will be some managers that don’t deserve said time (Bruce, for example) based on their entire career of failure. Rafa doesn’t have that. Even OGS who I ridiculed for most of his tenure deserved some time to build something, although it was very clear he was never going to succeed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
1892er Posted January 2, 2022 Share Posted January 2, 2022 The Rafa / Everton thing never seemed a good fit from the get go. Gut feeling tells me he'll be gone sooner rather than later. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 8 minutes ago, Fantail Breeze said: They’ve let Rafa start a process of building his own team of players he trusts to play his system and methods, with Rodriguez shipped off sharpish and Digne seemingly following. What good would it do to rip all of that up and start again with someone else? Unless Everton are in real danger of relegation, which I don’t think will happen, why not let him have this season and see what he builds? Arteta is a good recent example of a manager being afforded time and the rewards coming through. Otherwise you’ll stay stuck in this cycle of new managers bringing in new players and new systems and ending up with this complete mishmash. Of course there will be some managers that don’t deserve said time (Bruce, for example) based on their entire career of failure. Rafa doesn’t have that. Even OGS who I ridiculed for most of his tenure deserved some time to build something, although it was very clear he was never going to succeed. I'm happy to give him more time as his record deserves it and you're right that we badly need some stability. But he's seriously not helping himself at the moment. 5 points in 12 games is diabolical whatever way you cut it - I'm willing to accept a transitional season to implement his methods but that needs to improve ASAP because that is quite simply relegation form. The one beacon of light is it sounds like he's getting a lot bigger hand in transfers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeletor Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 (edited) 14 minutes ago, Neil said: I'm happy to give him more time as his record deserves it and you're right that we badly need some stability. But he's seriously not helping himself at the moment. 5 points in 12 games is diabolical whatever way you cut it - I'm willing to accept a transitional season to implement his methods but that needs to improve ASAP because that is quite simply relegation form. The one beacon of light is it sounds like he's getting a lot bigger hand in transfers. What about 11 in 19? Edited January 3, 2022 by Skeletor Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 Guess the problem is where you go after two champions league winning managers with excellent records and experience have ‘failed’. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 Seems a bit daft to sack him after letting him spend money on "his" targets rather than the director of football they sacked. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danh1 Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 Has Rondon shown any signs of improvement? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaqen Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 1 hour ago, wormy said: I get he loves his work but I find it mad that instead of just going and spending some time at his home in Liverpool whilst biding his time for a more suitable role, he jumped at a job that everyone (apart from him, I guess) knew would end in tears solely because of the fans just because said job is near that home. Thing is with football management, a job going badly just means you get a massive payout Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gazza ladra Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 23 minutes ago, Skeletor said: What about 11 in 19? Howe is at 5 in 7. Still not good enough. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bonk Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 23 minutes ago, Danh1 said: Has Rondon shown any signs of improvement? Sent a decent chance into the rafters. Not sure booing him onto the pitch helped his confidence much. Think we saw him at his peak in a NUFC kit, tbh. How fucking awesome was he? Same goes for Rafa, I suppose. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bonk Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 4 minutes ago, gazza ladra said: Howe is at 5 in 7. Still not good enough. Swap squads and I bet that’s a different number. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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