Sunderland

[Ashley17]

To an extent, but the bulk of football clubs aren't still paying Lee Cattermole.

[KDT]

To an extent, but the bulk of football clubs aren't still paying Lee Cattermole.

 

Probably still paying for Tore Andre Flo

[Guest Howaythetoon]

Unless they are bought out by someone soon who can afford to pump money into the club to keep it going, they risk going under. And even then such a person will have to be in it for the long run and for none money/profit return reasons to keep them going. That person will need deep pockets because it’s could cost 100m alone just to get them challenging for promotion back to the PL. Sadly they lack wealthy individuals in their own fanbase to take them on or local businesses who could get together and take them on, the result? They will be bought and sold by chancers like the Don and Methven over and over again and used to enrich such people the most at the expense of the club and everything else.

 

Back to the academy, again if they lose that, they lose everything and whether it is viable or not in terms of costs in the real world, any real businessman or people would recognise the true value of the academy or rather having one and how important it is to the club’s own viability in the now, the tomorrow, the future and to the existence of the club say 100 years from now.

 

For the sake of a few million in terms of selling up or a few million to keep it going, it’s the one asset that again is a genuine proven business model that is critical to the entire operations of the club and of huge importance beyond that in terms of the community, the grassroots game and ensuring they adhere to FA and EFL policy in order to operate as a football club.

 

I don’t know how much it costs them to run the academy or their budget, what I do know is it’s a PL standard set-up and current operated with a reduced and largely volunteer or part-time staff. I also know there is a pressure to find the next big star, who the club can sell for millions or will help them be successful on the field which means they have had to shift their focus away from almost being a community youth club centre open to the regions talented kids from all walks of life to a talent finder/spotter.

 

But being that ethos, the core values of the academy thanks to the good men and women who work there remains the same. I’ll give you an example. They scouted my then 5 year old and invited him to join one of their academy programme which I knew was a glorified trial set up. I didn’t need told that and I wasn’t, but I was told when they take on a kid and bring him into any programme of theirs, be it the elite academy or the black cat mini dribblers or whatever they are called, it’s a long term thing, 6 months at least and any kid who they don’t take on into other programmes they don’t just cut them off. They are welcome, as Sunderland family as I was told, to come and keep training and they would help find kids a club or help put them into people who could help them with their game etc.

 

From the start they said that first starter type programme existed to find and spot talent for the elite academy where it was all about the business of making footballers, for the first team or who could be sold to make the club money.

 

After 4 weeks in the starter programme my son along with 3 others, by then 6 years old, was invited into their elite academy programme and I as a parent was told this is the serious part of business and where the academy changes from local youth team club to making professional stars if the future. Again they said they would give us 6 months at least and if anyone didn’t like it or wasn’t up to it, they could return to the starter programme.

 

We were told our boys at 6 would be if good enough, develop into SAFC under us team and their entire goal was to have them progress through the age groups and onto professional terms and into the first team. If our kids didn’t make it to the under 15, the failure was all theres. We were told 70% plus who make it go the elite academy make it to under 15s where the danger zone kicks in between the ages of 15 and 18 where you could be the most talented player in the world and your chances of making it ar slim. Factors like agents, earning upto 5k or more a week, international representation, scoured by other clubs, pushy parents, star signs in the eyes and pound signs, girls, hormones, everything we were told would all play a part equal or over and above talent.

 

That said they told us their job outside of any club job description was to ensure that those in their programmes could earn a living playing a game they love and have the ability to do most can’t and won’t and that’s where they get their reward the most because again, they know the odds of a Pickford or a Henderson are slim.

 

Those that don’t make it again aren’t cut off, they can come in and work, train and use SAFC’s facilities and they will be helped in lots of ways so if they want to, they remain in the game and can have a career in the game. From refereeing, coaching, admin, fitness, medicine and even becoming an agent, SAFC’s academy has programmes that teach, educate and employ people.

 

An academy that works with colleges, grassroots football, youth clubs, schools, the local community that is run and maintained and viable because of every day ordinary people who are often volunteering, part-time, on a work placement or didn’t make it and want to give something back.

 

Today they’ve kept me informed and been checking up on my son, they’ve sent me links to drills and such and reassured me that when this is all over, my son and everyone else, their doors will be one to us all again.

 

I’m NUFC, but I look on in awe at the AOL and think to myself, fucking hell, what an amazing set up, with amazing people and how sad and big a loss to my son, kids like him, those I’ve got to know who work their and the community and indeed the game if it ceased to be and most of all how fucking great it is that my son, kids like him, those who work there and aye mackem land has it they have such a wonderful and meaningful and important asset that it wouldn’t bear thinking about of their club or the likes of my son were unable to benefit from and be part of.

 

I’ll defend it, speak up for it and champion the AOL and all that it is for what it’s worth because it’s worth it.

 

Sunderland can fester away in League One for a hundred years for all I care, but the AOL, I hope it prospers for the next 100 ears and every other academy does too because that’s what our clubs’ foundations should and must be built on, on and off the field.

 

Ashley of course thought otherwise, Rafa knew though, he knew best.

 

[Guest The Little Waster]

Why dont the fans get together and buy it once its gone into admin ?

[Rafalove]

That’s the reason I hope that doesn’t happen

[Raconteur]

Is this not going to apply to the bulk of football clubs?

 

I'm thinking most of League One is going to start next season on -12 points

[Guest Howaythetoon]

Why dont the fans get together and buy it once its gone into admin ?

 

The problem of financing the operation of the club would still exist and not go away.

 

They could end up with a non league club I suppose, but in reality they wouldn’t be able to buy back their club, they’d have to create their own Phoenix club. Once the vultures strip away the meat from the bone, well there’s nowt left.

 

Btw, if Covid-19 grounded our own club say for 12 more months, and Ashley still remained our owner, I guarantee he’d put us into administration and I can see many lower league clubs going under soon. The threat to SAFC is very real and I know people close to the club fear the worst without packed out stadiums, parachute money and a promotion any time soon.

[Matt]

I guarantee he’d put us into administration

 

Why?

[xLiaaamx]

Wouldn't that then make it a steal if anyone did want it at that point?

[Geordie Ahmed]

Before going into administration would the guys that gave the £10 loan not take ownership of the club? Would administration benefit them or would they be better off investing a few quid and getting them into The Championship?

[WarrenBartonCentrePartin]

Dunno how it can be seen as anything but funny as fuck tbh.

[Geordie Ahmed]

I think it's hilarious, I remember the grief they gave us over the 6 in a row (Thanks Pardew) and then when we got relegated

 

At the time I remember telling a couple of Mackems that us getting relegated is bad for them as were the only thing keeping them up for the last few years, I didn't quite expect them to fall this far but it's a bonus

 

I don't want to see them back in the premier league until they've at least humbled themselves (which is probably never)

 

[Stifler]

I’m going to say it. The EFL aren’t going to hand out 12-15 points deductions for going into administration. If they do then they could easily have have half of League 1 and the majority of League 2 having that many points deducted. Theirs going to more than Sunderland going to the wall, they will just likely be the biggest name with the biggest numbers.

If in this situation the EFL start punishing teams because they can’t get fans through the door and kicking them out of the league, then all of a sudden they don’t have a product to sell. A product that’s already going to be difficult to sell with no fans attending for at least 9 months.

It was easy for them to punish Bolton and kick out Bury last season because they can turn around and say that everyone is taking care of themselves.

 

The EFL are going to have a massive job on their hands on after this.

They are seriously going to need to look at wage caps, temporary all access TV coverage, potential for geographical split in the league system (similar to what was proposed a few years ago). I wouldn’t be surprised if the League Cup and League Trophy also have some changes in them as well.

Amongst that though they are going to have to be lenient on clubs who do go to the wall. Allow for new finance companies to be formed who own the clubs rights (like what happened to Rangers), be lenient if clubs go into administration. Above all they need to be working with fans groups. If clubs go to the wall, it would be great if they worked with fans groups to help then gain ownership from the administrators.

It would be great if they could turn around to Bury and say they could be allowed back in under new fan based ownership.

We know what we will get though, there will be little to no help.

[The Bonk]

I’m going to say it. The EFL aren’t going to hand out 12-15 points deductions for going into administration. If they do then they could easily have have half of League 1 and the majority of League 2 having that many points deducted. Theirs going to more than Sunderland going to the wall, they will just likely be the biggest name with the biggest numbers.

If in this situation the EFL start punishing teams because they can’t get fans through the door and kicking them out of the league, then all of a sudden they don’t have a product to sell. A product that’s already going to be difficult to sell with no fans attending for at least 9 months.

It was easy for them to punish Bolton and kick out Bury last season because they can turn around and say that everyone is taking care of themselves.

 

The EFL are going to have a massive job on their hands on after this.

They are seriously going to need to look at wage caps, temporary all access TV coverage, potential for geographical split in the league system (similar to what was proposed a few years ago). I wouldn’t be surprised if the League Cup and League Trophy also have some changes in them as well.

Amongst that though they are going to have to be lenient on clubs who do go to the wall. Allow for new finance companies to be formed who own the clubs rights (like what happened to Rangers), be lenient if clubs go into administration. Above all they need to be working with fans groups. If clubs go to the wall, it would be great if they worked with fans groups to help then gain ownership from the administrators.

It would be great if they could turn around to Bury and say they could be allowed back in under new fan based ownership.

We know what we will get though, there will be little to no help.

 

Why should there be?

[loki679]

I’m going to say it. The EFL aren’t going to hand out 12-15 points deductions for going into administration. If they do then they could easily have have half of League 1 and the majority of League 2 having that many points deducted. Theirs going to more than Sunderland going to the wall, they will just likely be the biggest name with the biggest numbers.

If in this situation the EFL start punishing teams because they can’t get fans through the door and kicking them out of the league, then all of a sudden they don’t have a product to sell. A product that’s already going to be difficult to sell with no fans attending for at least 9 months.

It was easy for them to punish Bolton and kick out Bury last season because they can turn around and say that everyone is taking care of themselves.

 

The EFL are going to have a massive job on their hands on after this.

They are seriously going to need to look at wage caps, temporary all access TV coverage, potential for geographical split in the league system (similar to what was proposed a few years ago). I wouldn’t be surprised if the League Cup and League Trophy also have some changes in them as well.

Amongst that though they are going to have to be lenient on clubs who do go to the wall. Allow for new finance companies to be formed who own the clubs rights (like what happened to Rangers), be lenient if clubs go into administration. Above all they need to be working with fans groups. If clubs go to the wall, it would be great if they worked with fans groups to help then gain ownership from the administrators.

It would be great if they could turn around to Bury and say they could be allowed back in under new fan based ownership.

We know what we will get though, there will be little to no help.

 

They're not going to have a lot of choice.  If they don't apply the rules as written they open themselves up to legal challenges.  I have to say that if I was one of the clubs who weren't in bother then half the league starting on -12 would look pretty good to me.  Almost guarantees not getting relegated and pretty much takes out 50% of the competition for promotion / playoff spots.

[Guest Carrick18]

Before going into administration would the guys that gave the £10 loan not take ownership of the club? Would administration benefit them or would they be better off investing a few quid and getting them into The Championship?

As I understand it, if they default on the loan it becomes the property of FPP.

 

That might be the only saving grace for them, really. They have sizable financial resources, but they're businessmen, they won't throw money at the issue.

[geordiedean]

Before going into administration would the guys that gave the £10 loan not take ownership of the club? Would administration benefit them or would they be better off investing a few quid and getting them into The Championship?

As I understand it, if they default on the loan it becomes the property of FPP.

 

That might be the only saving grace for them, really. They have sizable financial resources, but they're businessmen, they won't throw money at the issue.

 

They have zero interest in owning or running that football club

[Pons Alias]

So we’re worth 350m - ten times what Sunderland are valued at. That must hurt them.

[loki679]

So we’re worth 350m - ten times what Sunderland are valued at. That must hurt them.

 

Sartori got 20% of the club for a quid so strictly speaking they're valued at £5.

[Decky]

These going down again into League 2 and maybe non-league while we push and push higher up the Prem and into Europe. The dream.

[OpenC]

These fuckers out of business yet?

[Newcastle Fan]

So basically he used the club's parachute payments to fund his own purchase of the club and now he doesn't want to pay it back?

[Scoot]

I'll just leave this here for anyone who feels even slightly sorry for these nonce supporters.

 

[Guest chopey]

Can you fail the fair and proper owners test once you've owned the club for a few years

[NG32]

I'll just leave this here for anyone who feels even slightly sorry for these nonce supporters.

 

 

Wanting that club to vanish and cripple the city of Sunderland long term is a bit short sighted. Fair enough you get pissed off with their small time antics on social media but should this blind you of the overall impact of losing such a major player and identity of a city.