steve_69 Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 1 minute ago, ManDoon said: Our bench was much stronger than theirs imo. That’s where we had an edge and didn’t use it Exactly that. We arguably had better options on the bench than we did on the pitch. Southgate seems like a great guy and the players obviously love him but it just feels like a bit of a bottle job at the most crucial times. Absolutely paramount in his mind last night should've been to do everything to avoid penalties and yet he left his substitutions (barre one) until extra time whereas i think Mancini made 5 trying to win the game. We didn't have a shot for about 70 minutes and still no changes. We almost bottled it against Denmark with similarly shit decisions and i think he could've done more to try and change the game against Croatia in the world cup as well. That's the best chance we've had to win a trophy for 50 years and it just feels like we let them win rather than them having to fight tooth and nail to do it. We were in a final FFS - throw caution to the wind and unleash our creative players rather than bow out with a whimper and subject our players to another scarring penalty defeat. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happinesstan Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 33 minutes ago, HTT II said: Agree with a lot of this, he now needs to find a way to implement a winning formula in attack as he has done with the defence and to be fair in how technical we now play. Can he do that? The signs are positive given he has literally transformed the whole team on and off the pitch in such a short time. We would never lose to say Iceland or the like again under Southgate. We always had that in us under the previous managers dating back to KK. He’s by and far the best manager in my lifetime of following England we’ve had in terms of results and tournament success. He well and truly deserves to lead us out in the World Cup. Aye but he pulled the blanket up too far. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 22 minutes ago, HTT II said: That was the most frustrating thing about the whole game. We could have fielded an entire different 11 to the one that started and I’d still have had us equal to Italy in talent and ability if not more so. Southgate needs to start trusting his more forward thinking players more and ditch this two deep lying defensive midfielders nonsense. The defensive midfielders ploy is understandable to some extent, it got us through to the final after all. Problem is he was too scared to expand on it during the tournament, or even during games. When opposition has tired after an hour, why not try switching it up and bringing in some players who can open defences up? He kind of froze and played safe once too often. That's my major criticism of him, although I like him immensely, think he's a great amabassador for the national team. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Duper Branko Strupar Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 (edited) Still spaced out to fuck after this. The penalties were a blur. Maybe because I was so angry after Rashford's, I didnt really take in the rest properly. Someone else mentioned it a few pages ago but I was still celebrating Jorginhos miss when Saka missed and I didnt realise what had just happened immediately. My mind's still not cleared after that. Really annoyed by the lack of subs late on and the lack of effort to push them back and try and win it. It was just so obvious, wasnt it? It has to be Southgate that continues as manager and takes us in the the Qatar winter world cup but I hope the team philosophy changes after that experience. Glad I've pretty much had today off. Everyone started at 1 but no one is doing anything. Dont think I could work. Edited July 12, 2021 by Super Duper Branko Strupar Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest HTT II Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 Just now, TRon said: The defensive midfielders ploy is understandable to some extent, it got us through to the final after all. Problem is he was too scared to expand on it during the tournament, or even during games. When opposition has tired after an hour, why not try switching it up and bringing in some players who can open defences up? He kind of froze and played safe once too often. That's my major criticism of him, although I like him immensely, think he's a great amabassador for the national team. It did, but the nagging question I’d ask is would a different player or players in for say Phillips and Rice got us there too? Maybe not, but maybe a change would have helped us to actually win it. It was obvious after 40 minutes we needed to switch up that system and bring on a more forward thinking player or two for example. And I like him too, in fact I love him, I think he’s perfect for these players and this team and what it’s all about or has become, he’s the leader for sure and a bit of a statesman. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest HTT II Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 1 minute ago, Super Duper Branko Strupar said: Still spaced out to fuck after this. The penalties were a blur. Maybe because I was so angry after Rashford's, I didnt really take in the rest properly. Someone else mentioned it a few pages ago but I was still celebrating Jorginhos miss when Saka missed and I didnt realise what had just happened immediately. My mind's still not cleared after that. Really annoyed by the lack of subs late on and the lack of effort to push them back and try and win it. It was just so obvious, wasnt it? It has to be Southgate that continues as manager and takes us in the the Qatar winter world cup but I hope the team philosophy changes after that experience. Glad I've pretty much had today off. Everyone started at 1 but no one is doing anything. Dont think I could work. I had half a bottle of whiskey, I’m suffering today and most of extra time and the pens are a blur, but on reflection as gutted as I am and as disappointed as I am, I’m fucking well proud today of them all and have enjoyed every minute of it, as it involved my boys and wife who we all got that England/tournament bug and the memories my boys will heave of this team and this tournament will take them into every next one we are in like it did with me when I was a kid. I can’t fucking wait for the WC now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Icarus Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 As time goes on this feels more and more devastating and a massive opportunity missed. Italy were the better team overall, but I look back on our first 45 minutes and Italy's chances created with all the possession they did have overall and wonder exactly what the hell happened and try to wrap my head around most of the decisions Southgate made. What changed where there was a need for England to change their approach from the first half? It felt like, aside from being a little too direct when on the ball, we were in control and limiting Italy to pointless possession, wayward passes/crosses, and pot-shots from distance. So the approach to our play seemed to change and Italy dominated possession and started looking more threatening - but even then, did they really have to turn it up to 11? It didn't feel like it and aside from the equaliser I can't think of any really huge chances or sustained pressure. It felt like we decided to hold out for 1-0 and then when it went to 1-1 it felt like we were holding out for 1-1, really disappointing to see after the first half and we were worse for it. Mason Mount, who I really like, has played 180 minutes in the last two matches and done more or less nothing. Sterling was completely out on his feet at the end and was kept on only to not take a pen, Rashford and Sancho not getting a chance to get a feel for the game before pens and who probably should have been on earlier anyway. Just the raft of unused or completely underused talent on the bench - Grealish and Sancho in particular. The pen choices and giving 5th pen to a 19 year old in a European Cup Final felt like Southgate was acting out some sort of abused to abuser PTSD fantasy. It's very hard to be critical, Southgate's record speaks for itself and for all we know we'd continue to be nowhere without him having nurtured the unbelievable team spirit and togetherness these players have, but similar to Chris Hughton and the 'group of lads' we had in the Championship it's hard to know how much of that success is down to him or the group. That aside though, his philosophy with player selections and team cohesion are his and are really good and welcomed, so you do maybe have to take the rough with the smooth, especially considering it got England to a final, but it's hard not to ignore his decisions which have baffled even through the victories tbh. It really does feel like he fucked it yesterday tbh and that takes absolutely nothing away from him having got us there in the first place or the great work he's done, it just feels like such a missed opportunity and really disappointing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TenkoDaLuz Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 Pickford would be the 6th taker? Wtf... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest HTT II Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 7 minutes ago, kisearch said: As time goes on this feels more and more devastating and a massive opportunity missed. Italy were the better team overall, but I look back on our first 45 minutes and Italy's chances created with all the possession they did have overall and wonder exactly what the hell happened and try to wrap my head around most of the decisions Southgate made. What changed where there was a need for England to change their approach from the first half? It felt like, aside from being a little too direct when on the ball, we were in control and limiting Italy to pointless possession, wayward passes/crosses, and pot-shots from distance. So the approach to our play seemed to change and Italy dominated possession and started looking more threatening - but even then, did they really have to turn it up to 11? It didn't feel like it and aside from the equaliser I can't think of any really huge chances or sustained pressure. It felt like we decided to hold out for 1-0 and then when it went to 1-1 it felt like we were holding out for 1-1, really disappointing to see after the first half and we were worse for it. Mason Mount, who I really like, has played 180 minutes in the last two matches and done more or less nothing. Sterling was completely out on his feet at the end and was kept on only to not take a pen, Rashford and Sancho not getting a chance to get a feel for the game before pens and who probably should have been on earlier anyway. Just the raft of unused or completely underused talent on the bench - Grealish and Sancho in particular. The pen choices and giving 5th pen to a 19 year old in a European Cup Final felt like Southgate was acting out some sort of abused to abuser PTSD fantasy. It's very hard to be critical, Southgate's record speaks for itself and for all we know we'd continue to be nowhere without him having nurtured the unbelievable team spirit and togetherness these players have, but similar to Chris Hughton and the 'group of lads' we had in the Championship it's hard to know how much of that success is down to him or the group. That aside though, his philosophy with player selections and team cohesion are his and are really good and welcomed, so you do maybe have to take the rough with the smooth, especially considering it got England to a final, but it's hard not to ignore his decisions which have baffled even through the victories tbh. It really does feel like he fucked it yesterday tbh and that takes absolutely nothing away from him having got us there in the first place or the great work he's done, it just feels like such a missed opportunity and really disappointing. You’ve summed it up really well there like. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElDiablo Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 Have to say I was very disappointed with Henderson last night. I'd hoped him coming on would calm things down and provide some leadership (as I think we lack that badly on the pitch). He actually just worsened the anxiety in the team by being sloppy as fuck. He came on at a big moment and fucked it tbh. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest HTT II Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 2 minutes ago, ManDoon said: Yeah he's escaped because of the pens but he was absolutely horrific. Not only did he give the ball away, he was nowhere near getting posession back for us, he was so far off the pace it was scary. A player like him needs to be starting though IMO… Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shays Given Tim Flowers Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 Has anyone made a gif of that in goal camera Maguire penna? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
huss9 Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 people say southgate got us to a semi final, semi final then a final in the last 3 tournaments. but look at who he to play. on these 3 occasionas, as soon as he has met a decent team, he's had no answers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NE27 Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 1 minute ago, huss9 said: decent team The best team, unfortunately. I get what you're saying though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ponsaelius Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 This kind of stuff is disrespectful to other teams tbh. The idea that nations in the top 15 in the world like Germany and Denmark are just walkovers. Especially in a tournament that was full of big upsets. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest neesy111 Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 A winter/xmas football tournament is not going to be as good to watch imo, cold, wet etc. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Duper Branko Strupar Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 BBC got 18m and ITV 4m in ratings last night. At peak BBC hit 25m and ITV hit 5. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 8 minutes ago, ponsaelius said: This kind of stuff is disrespectful to other teams tbh. The idea that nations in the top 15 in the world like Germany and Denmark are just walkovers. Especially in a tournament that was full of big upsets. You'd think Colombia who won their group in the last WC were a bunch of mugs as well. "Look at who we've played!" Croatia who took Spain to ET? The Czechs who dumped the Dutch out? It's like getting to a final is only an achievement if you played France in every single round (and simultaneously ignore that they got dumped out by a team who, if we had played them, would have been counted amongst the easy pointless no-hopers). We've failed to get this far for 55 years and some of our fans suddenly go on like we'll always easily brush aside everyone other than 3 or 4 teams. Fucking Iceland put us out last time. Short memories. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kimbo Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 The dismissal of Germany is annoying considering they smashed Portugal. Not the best German side does not mean they’re an easy game. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToonArmy1892 Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 This feels so shit Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 1 minute ago, Kimbo said: The dismissal of Germany is annoying considering they smashed Portugal. Not the best German side does not mean they’re an easy game. 8 of the German starting XI has won the Champions League, and Kroos was the only one of those 8 who hasn't won it either this season or last. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beren Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 22 minutes ago, Super Duper Branko Strupar said: BBC got 18m and ITV 4m in ratings last night. At peak BBC hit 25m and ITV hit 5. Shocked it was as high as 4m. Who are these freaks? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Duper Branko Strupar Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 Better privatise the BBC soon. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbandit Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 Of course it’s a missed opportunity, we were one game from winning the Euros, by definition that’s a missed opportunity. I think playing games at home gave us a decent advantage as well but we also have to look at the fact we achieved something we hadn’t ever done in the Euros. I’m disappointed with our second half and our late subs in extra time but it was fucking amazing to have those emotions whilst watching a match again. Just a shame the next tournament is in Qatar where some of the lads will die from the humidity, pale ass Declan Rice wasn’t built for playing there Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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