Backroom & executive staff

[Sima]

Yeah, I think the option will be there to flex our financial muscle should the situation warrant it.  This could either be due to league position (our current position certainly warrants it) or a when unique opportunity to sign a player considered outside of our set roadmap arises.

 

 

Edited December 21, 2021 by Sima

[Rich]

Spoiler

 

Lucrative salary and huge resources but Dan Ashworth to Newcastle is not cut and dried 

Dan Ashworth has a tricky decision to make between unfinished business at Brighton & Hove Albion and the bigger potential of Newcastle United.

 

His salary will multiply if he abandons the role of technical director at Brighton to become director of football at St James’ Park — or whatever fancy job title is framed for the heavyweight task of bringing structure to a club that doesn’t have one. A lucrative wage increase will be accompanied by the resources necessary for a major rebuild.

 

More or less a done deal then? No dilemma, especially as Brighton have seemingly opened the exit door by giving him permission to speak to Newcastle.

 

Well, not quite. Let’s first address the issue of Brighton allowing Ashworth that opportunity, as revealed by my colleague David Ornstein. It’s easy to misinterpret this as a green light to go when the opposite is true.

 

Brighton desperately want Ashworth to stay, to complete the job started by the 50-year-old when he became the club’s first technical director in February 2019. They always give employees permission to speak to other clubs if they wish to, providing the approach is made properly rather than through the back door.

 

Newcastle have acted in exemplary fashion. They’ve hired recruitment company Nolan Partners to handle their search. The same firm dealt with Ashworth’s previous two moves, from West Bromwich Albion to the Football Association and from the FA to Brighton.

 

The reasons behind Brighton’s freedom to speak philosophy are twofold. Refusal can eventually breed resentment. It is regarded by owner-chairman Tony Bloom and chief executive Paul Barber — who is responsible for the day-to-day running of the club on Bloom’s behalf — as part of Brighton’s growth to allow freedom of opportunity and a pathway to satisfy ambitions.

 

It helps explain why people like Ashworth, with heavyweight CV’s, are prepared to sign up in the first place. An acceptance that good people will sometimes be lost as a result of this grown-up outlook is balanced by the opportunity created for somebody else. Succession planning at Brighton is constant.

 

Bloom will not be surprised that Newcastle have come knocking. The surprise would have been if Ashworth, who knows the game in England inside-out, wasn’t on their target list.

 

Ashworth wants to have a conversation with Newcastle. Why wouldn’t he, if only to satisfy his curiosity? What other factors will he consider, apart from the ticked boxes of personal remuneration and the financial resources to do the job?

 

An elephant will always be in the room under the new regime at Newcastle — the moral consideration.

 

Amanda Staveley and her colleagues have made a good impression in the way they have conducted themselves since taking over the club from Mike Ashley, not least on Brighton. But there is no escaping that Newcastle are bankrolled by Saudi Arabian money. There is no need to revisit their human rights record and how that could sow a seed of discomfort in Ashworth’s thought process.

 

Beyond that, he’d be swapping a club that is supremely well run for one that has been a basket case.

 

Then there’s the matter of what, precisely, his job would entail and whether it would be accompanied by realistic targets.

 

At Brighton, the role and expectations are clearly defined. Player recruitment is the most significant aspect, but Ashworth also oversees loans, has a major say in the men’s and women’s first teams, the academy and the medical and sports science departments.

 

Newcastle are a bigger club with huge potential, but they have a lot of catching up to do in most of these areas. Brighton are gradually progressing towards their goal of establishing themselves as a top-10 club in the Premier League. How realistic will the targets be for Ashworth at Newcastle when, for all their new-found riches, they are staring the Championship in the face?

 

There’s another consideration linked to player recruitment. Ashworth’s biggest area of expertise is identifying young players at relatively low cost who can be developed.

 

That has been the key strand in Brighton’s recruitment model since he joined the club. Tariq Lamptey (England), Jakub Moder(Poland), Alexis Mac Allister (Argentina), Moises Caicedo and Jeremy Sarmiento (Ecuador) are prime examples, young junior or senior internationals with promising futures.

 

That’s not where Newcastle are right now, that’s a lot further down the line. For somebody who cares about player recruitment as much as Ashworth does, there’s more satisfaction to be derived from spotting a gem and seeing a young player grow and progress than simply being able to chuck money at the transfer market and outbid the competition.

 

Ashworth saw the project at Brighton as a four-to-five-year task when he was appointed. That was effectively in September 2018, when it was first revealed he was leaving his role as technical director at the FA, after England reached the semi-finals of the World Cup in Russia.

 

The journey isn’t over. That will play a part in his thinking.

 

Speaking to The Athletic in February 2020 about how long he envisaged being at Brighton, Ashworth said: “You can never dictate that. Tony might have had enough of me next week and I’m done. You just don’t know. Touch wood, things like the health of your family, there are so many variables.

 

“The reason my last three jobs have been around about six years is not strategic planning from me. They just all naturally ran their course.

 

“I’ve been so lucky. I’ve loved all my jobs. It’s a super job with a super club and super owners. It just so happens it correlated with it being about time for me to leave the FA.

 

“I don’t apply for jobs, I’m not one that this could lead to that or the other. I just throw myself into anything that I’m doing and I think there is probably a natural point of time when either they’ve had enough of you or something else comes up but I hope I’m here for many years to come.

 

“It’s a big challenge, it’s a great club with great people.”

 

Bloom has built a hierarchy structure at Brighton with a unique camaraderie. Ashworth, Barber and head coach Graham Potter don’t just work closely together, they live on the same road. Ashworth and Barber have turned down other opportunities during their time at the club.

 

Ashworth may or may not reject Newcastle. That is uncertain, but it certainly won’t be an easy decision to make.

 

https://theathletic.com/3027185/2021/12/20/lucrative-salary-and-huge-resources-but-dan-ashworth-to-newcastle-is-not-cut-and-dried/?source=user_shared_article

 

 

[r0cafella]

@Richi understand the  really go after those who infringe their copyright. 

 

 

Edited December 21, 2021 by r0cafella
A word

[Rich]

I’ll expect a scary letter from their solicitors post-haste.

[JonBez comesock]

14 hours ago, ManDoon said:

Not having a go or anything but are you mates with him or know him? I thought I saw you mention him a while back 

Not mates,  but spoken with him a lot through work over the last 4-5 years.

 

He was fantastic whilst working with the England youngsters and doing very well at Brighton on a very very tight budget.

 

As soon as the takeover went through I was hoping we would ask him and a few of us were saying he would be the perfect appointment.

 

Dan and Eddie Howe get on really well too. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited December 21, 2021 by JonBez comesock
Typo

[JonBez comesock]

1 hour ago, Sima said:

While I welcome football people in football positions, I think we all should keep an open mind as to how much money will be spent long-term on the club.

 

On the face of it we’ve employed a manager recently relegated from Bournemouth and are about to take a DOF from Brighton, which doesn’t scream unlimited riches as is being suggested in some quarters.  Even Amanda Staveley has suggested £50m per window.

 

I’d love to be wrong and this is no way a criticism of Howe’s appointment or performance so far, by the way. I’m encouraged by our structure and the way we get forward now.

 

 

 

Yes I get the same feeling , However I also hear sound bites from PIF hierarchy that we are a team that will no doubt compete at the top end at some point and in their words (serious competition)

 

I think the structure is set up for a slow build but I have a feeling now and again (if the opportunity arises) they will not be able to resist a few trophy (wow) signings to prove a point.

 

[Guest]

Seen a clip earlier of Howe coming into the stand with Staveley before he was announced and Dan Ashworth is the first person he shakes hands with. Obviously it’s just coincidence but still.

[macphisto]

1 hour ago, Sima said:

While I welcome football people in football positions, I think we all should keep an open mind as to how much money will be spent long-term on the club.

 

On the face of it we’ve employed a manager recently relegated from Bournemouth and are about to take a DOF from Brighton, which doesn’t scream unlimited riches as is being suggested in some quarters.  Even Amanda Staveley has suggested £50m per window.

 

I’d love to be wrong and this is no way a criticism of Howe’s appointment or performance so far, by the way. I’m encouraged by our structure and the way we get forward now.

 

 

 

As the Saudi's are involved it's almost guaranteed that they'll splash the cash to get ahead of PSG (Qatar) and Man City (UAE). I realise nothing is certain but it would go against everything they have ever done in the past and relations with their neighbours. Difficult to put into words but I have visited Saudi a few times for business and their national pride wouldn't allow them to play second fiddle to the other countries in the region. 

[RS]

8 hours ago, Montey said:

If some on this forum got to decide who NUFC's managers and executives were to be, Kevin Keegan would never have been employed as a manager.

Ruud Gullit would, because of his sexy name

[TRon]

4 hours ago, JonBez comesock said:

Not mates,  but spoken with him a lot through work over the last 4-5 years.

 

He was fantastic whilst working with the England youngsters and doing very well at Brighton on a very very tight budget.

 

As soon as the takeover went through I was hoping we would ask him and a few of us were saying he would be the perfect appointment.

 

Dan and Eddie Howe get on really well too. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Being mates with Howe might be the only thing which has got him even considering the job then, from all reports he's not the type to switch projects at the drop of a hat, and seems he's really well settled on the south coast. Will be a massive shot in the arm for the new owners if we can get him on board, he seems really highly rated across the board. 

[rgk_lfc]

10 hours ago, Sima said:

While I welcome football people in football positions, I think we all should keep an open mind as to how much money will be spent long-term on the club.

 

On the face of it we’ve employed a manager recently relegated from Bournemouth and are about to take a DOF from Brighton, which doesn’t scream unlimited riches as is being suggested in some quarters.  Even Amanda Staveley has suggested £50m per window.

 

I’d love to be wrong and this is no way a criticism of Howe’s appointment or performance so far, by the way. I’m encouraged by our structure and the way we get forward now.

 

 

 

 

Have to disagree a bit on that statement. Once FSG fired Kenny Dalglish, their first real appointment was the manager of Swansea. That was also the time they setup the current version of LFC transfer committee. Members of that include Edwards (who was number crunching at Portsmouth and Spurs before that), Julian Ward (Played for Morecambe, scout for City and had a informatics background), Graham (Phd in Physics background and working in a sports analytics company and was at Swansea for sometime I believe).  Did not exactly scream elite. Those appointments along with Klopp set the foundation for our league and CL win. 

 

British unis are doing high tech research in data analytics, machine learning etc. Not just Oxbridge, but universities at all levels have high level data mining researchers which are producing graduates with top level data skills. This has led a number of talented young folks who are applying these skills to things they are passionate about like football. Michael Edwards for example had a Bachelors in Information Science. One of the reasons for our success is the analytics team setup at LFC which are primarily these young graduates combined with football folks who understand data.  In terms of scouting and performance analysis,  there is no need to search for them in places like Bayern or Sevilla or Madrid or Dortmund. If you are looking to employ smart scouting, folks like Edwards and Ashworth are as good if not better than anywhere else in the world. 

 

Also appointment of these folks doesn't mean the owners are not going to spend money. It doesnt mean you are trying to get things done on the cheap.  Klopp first choice for left attacker was Gotze. Gotze was showing reluctance to come to England. Edwards and team convinced him to spend more money on Mane. Similarly Brandt was Klopp's first choice. The scouting team strongly advised him to consider Salah over Brandt. Again, we spent more on Salah than what we would have on Brandt. Klopp was reluctant to spend a world record fee on VVD and Allison. The transfer committee pushed for both these transfers. Appointment of folks like Ashworth and Edwards, ensures that you have value and consistency in the transfers, whether you spend 10 or 100 or 1000 million. Their role is not just to get a a 40 million player for 25 million. These are the kind of folks who will state rather than spend 25 million on this player, spending 40 million on the other will have more impact. 

 

 

Edited December 21, 2021 by rgk_lfc

[Kanj]

What a post.

[TRon]

2 hours ago, Kanji said:

What a post.

 

I concur.

[Elliottman]

Excellent ?? actual knowledge, refreshing. 

[The Prophet]

Mr Waugh in today's Mailbag:

 

"Interestingly, as The Athletic reported last week, Nick Hammond, the former Celtic and Reading director of football, has been hired as a temporary consultant, to provide counsel and expertise. Rather than recommending players himself, Hammond is believed to be advising on how negotiations are conducted, contracts and the general environment in which transfers are concluded.

 

Sources insist that Newcastle have “clearly determined” targets and have prepared their moves, but completing those signings is another matter and it will be a significant test of the novice ownership team’s ability to operate without an experienced executive structure yet in place."

[Thiago]

Ashworth would be a fascinating appointment for my money. 

 

He's clearly taken insights from the Udinese/Benfica/Porto model where it's best to speculate on a number of promising youngsters very early in their career in the hope a few graduate to massive success. It would intrigue me how he'd handle bigger budgets and greater attraction compared to rivals. Sam Allardyce was a prime example of someone that totally tanked when he came here.

[gjohnson]

Just now, Thiago said:

Ashworth would be a fascinating appointment for my money. 

 

He's clearly taken insights from the Udinese/Benfica/Porto model where it's best to speculate on a number of promising youngsters very early in their career in the hope a few graduate to massive success. It would intrigue me how he'd handle bigger budgets and greater attraction compared to rivals. Sam Allardyce was a prime example of someone that totally tanked when he came here.

Unpopular opinion....Sam was sold down the river a bit when he joined us.

 

No argument  that he was absolutely terrible as a manager for us, but Shepherd went for him as he'd shown at Bolton he could make a decent team on a very limited budget by getting outcasts/rejects/olders to work well. We were skint at the time and needed someone to find cheap/hidden gems in the same fashion.

 

Allardyce always said he came here as he would be allowed a big budget and thought he'd be able to spend far more than he did. 

 

Didn't help himself with his attitude to us, and it probably was a good thing that he didn't get serious money to spend. We'd probably still have Campo and Okocha on contract now if he did.

[Thiago]

7 minutes ago, gjohnson said:

Unpopular opinion....Sam was sold down the river a bit when he joined us.

 

No argument  that he was absolutely terrible as a manager for us, but Shepherd went for him as he'd shown at Bolton he could make a decent team on a very limited budget by getting outcasts/rejects/olders to work well. We were skint at the time and needed someone to find cheap/hidden gems in the same fashion.

 

Allardyce always said he came here as he would be allowed a big budget and thought he'd be able to spend far more than he did. 

 

Didn't help himself with his attitude to us, and it probably was a good thing that he didn't get serious money to spend. We'd probably still have Campo and Okocha on contract now if he did.

I mean, you could go down rabbit holes about how Sam got the best out of those older players, but I still think the ones he did sign were awful. 

 

We paid Man Utd £6m for a crocked Alan Smith when Man City were picking up Elano for £2m more and Blackburn got Santa Cruz for half that. He just didn't have a good eye for what we needed and so fell on to 'old reliable'. We shifted Parker and Dyer for £12m and replaced it with Geremi and Joey Barton. 

 

I don't disagree he may have had a hard hand to play but in many ways it proves my point that when he tried to utilise those same tactics he showed that a Bolton type club was his ceiling. Even at more recent gigs like Sunderland his players aged like milk the second that he left. 

[Jackie Broon]

Allardyce made his own bed here, he signed players with a scattergun approac and squandered a decent start by not settling on first 11, which ended up sucking all confidence out of the team. His fate was 100% on him and deserved.

 

 

Edited December 23, 2021 by Jackie Broon

[Dr Venkman]

43 minutes ago, Thiago said:

I mean, you could go down rabbit holes about how Sam got the best out of those older players, but I still think the ones he did sign were awful. 

 

We paid Man Utd £6m for a crocked Alan Smith when Man City were picking up Elano for £2m more and Blackburn got Santa Cruz for half that. He just didn't have a good eye for what we needed and so fell on to 'old reliable'. We shifted Parker and Dyer for £12m and replaced it with Geremi and Joey Barton. 

 

I don't disagree he may have had a hard hand to play but in many ways it proves my point that when he tried to utilise those same tactics he showed that a Bolton type club was his ceiling. Even at more recent gigs like Sunderland his players aged like milk the second that he left. 

Cacapa in the hole. 

[wormy]

58 minutes ago, gjohnson said:

Unpopular opinion....Sam was sold down the river a bit when he joined us.

 

No argument  that he was absolutely terrible as a manager for us, but Shepherd went for him as he'd shown at Bolton he could make a decent team on a very limited budget by getting outcasts/rejects/olders to work well. We were skint at the time and needed someone to find cheap/hidden gems in the same fashion.

 

Allardyce always said he came here as he would be allowed a big budget and thought he'd be able to spend far more than he did. 

 

Didn't help himself with his attitude to us, and it probably was a good thing that he didn't get serious money to spend. We'd probably still have Campo and Okocha on contract now if he did.

 

Have I misremembered? I thought Allardyce came here well aware of the financial constraints that were to be expected under Shepherd. As you mentioned, Shepherd went for him specifically because of his bargain bin achievements, and I recall everyone and their dog know that ahead of the appointment. If he didn't realise it then I've even less respect for him than the little I already had.

 

If anything, he lucked out with Ashley coming in and not yet being the prick we all know and hate, as a quick look at Transfermarkt tells me we had the 9th biggest expenditure in the league that summer. Nothing crazy, but I'm sure it's a damn sight more than if Ashley hadn't taken over that summer.

 

Maybe it's an overreaction but in hindsight, I actually hold Fat Sam responsible for a lot of what we saw over Ashley's tenure. Maybe it was just always destined to go wrong, but it sure as hell didn't help that he had to sack his first manager after less than a season for spunking any money given up the wall. Probably what led him to trust very few managers again, leading to the undermining of KK and overall deterioration of his relationship with the fans and ultimately, the wild swings between negligence and spiteful actions.

 

Ashley was clearly always a prick, but I blame Allardyce for it surfacing so damn quickly.

[Guest neesy111]

He signed Alan Smith FFS.

[Dr Venkman]

17 minutes ago, neesy111 said:

He signed Alan Smith FFS.

Not only that, he played him as a defensive mid every fucking week. It was excruciating.

[Guest neesy111]

5 minutes ago, Dr Venkman said:

Not only that, he played him as a defensive mid every fucking week. It was excruciating.

Then upfront for a few games where he played with his back to goal for the whole game.

 

[STM]

51 minutes ago, neesy111 said:

He signed Alan Smith FFS.

Interesting fact. Did you know that Alan Smith was shagging Neve Campbell?

 

Fwiw, despite being shite for us, hes actually sound. My brother does footballing coaching with him out in the U.S.