Lotus

I can only imagine that Pardew is trying to make it clear, in no uncertain terms that Ranger needs to seriously buck up his ideas. And i reckon he's come to that conclusion from seeing him day in and day out. The bloke's got to want to become better before anyone at the club can help him improve.

Enrique was slated. Often. Anyway, that's not the point. Who do you think will prove the current perception wrong? Guthrie? Routledge? Ranger? Perch? I'll go for Perch.

Lots of peeps wrote off Enrique, very few defended him (i did though ) now he's great! Lots of peeps wrote off Colo, very few defended him (Ronaldo did though) now he's great! Lots of peeps wrote off AC9, after Man City that time i thought (and many others) that he just didn't have it in him. Now he's great! Simpson: Got better against better opposition. Go figure! Barton, bit of both from all posters, his value is evident now, so much good goes through him. So, maybe we need to have a bit more patience with players, maybe some need a year or two to really show some form. Current black sheep are: Guthrie: beefs up (body and mind), tries to impose himself, is there a player in there? I reckon there is. Needs to seriously grow some stones though. Time on his side. Possible. Perch: Good athlete. Looking out of his depth. If he learns to read the game better then i reckon he's got the physical attributes to have a career at this level. Remember the slating Jose used to get? People had NO time for him. Maybe Perch can come good or at least better than he is currently. Loverkrands: Too old to adapt for me. Ranger: Needs to figure what he wants out of life. If it's football then he needs to make sure all his choices outside of football reflect that. Smith: I think we're all agreed on this one. Routledge: Difficult this one for me. Hasn't got a great 1st touch imo. Scared to take a chance often. He has a bit of a mental block at this level it seems. I reckon he's worth persisting with. Jonas: I think he takes a lot of pressure of the team. I also think he'd benefit greatly from having HBA playing in the same side. Looks tired too. So, who do you think it's worth keeping and trying to develop them?

I had a very good friend who had manic depression. Then she had a stroke (young too) so she has other problems now. Her life was chaotic and often depairing. I don't for one minute believe Ronaldo is referring to cases like hers. Lots of people do use the word 'depression' without having a real idea of what it means. I hear it as often as i hear the term 'world class' on MOTD. Often in both instances, widly inaccurate.

To be honest, i understand your point (OP), however. Ashley has bought a club with a massive fanbase and his actions are turning them (slowly) into customers. You can treat supporters with contempt, and he has. But when they start becoming customers you have to think a little about what you're doing. And that's someting he's not doing very well. We can love the club for what it means to us but we don't have to love it for what it means to him.

Wouldn't it be weird if we ended with Jol & Pardew. Pardew as the assistant. or Jol as DoF.

Probably yes, looking at the perfomance. The total disinterest does seem to make sense now.

I wonder if the players had some hint of this before yesterday....

You're right, he did fine last year. Shak's also right though. Guthrie lacks bollox and you can't coach that into someone. I wouldn't sell him because we haven't got a player any better in the reserves. I'd be telling him he's a year to grow a pair though or he can move on and play at a lower level.

He would have looked a lot better if Carroll or Ameobi had actualy offered a short option when he ran with the ball. Even just now and again. Carroll surged forward and Ameobi always stood watching him. Our front 2 didn't work the channels. Made it hard for the wide men.

Well, i don't want to jump on him because of the goal last night. He was waiting to see what would happen with Colo and then had to make a jump from standing and lost out. Not great but Colo was the cause of the problem, that's just the plain and simple fact of the matter. Neither Williamson nor Krul did anything out of the ordinary to save the situation and so they scored. I like Williamson because he's normally fairly sound positioning wise, hasn't got much pace, isn't as strong as i expected given his height. I think he's a bit of an opposite to Steven Taylor actually, who has a better turn of pace and would of probably beaten Roberts to the ball yesterday. However, STaylor isn't so hot positionally, especially when the ball goes wide and Williamson often keeps a better body shape, on the turn, giving himself options. Still very happy with Williamson, he's more than worth his price. Last night was just one of those things.

Everytime i glance at the thread title i see 'Steve Bruce Toothache' Disconcerting.

Dunno, they bought that Moroccan lad in the transfer window though. You're wasted on here

I always feel like we never do well after international breaks. This is based on no empirical evidence whatsoever

Perch shouldn't be marking Huth to start with imo.

Can't agree with that. Brummie did warn us we'd go off this bloke though!

He's pretty good with the 2nd ball. We didn't win any 1st ball against Stoke. I think he works well with Kevin Davies but other than that i'm not too sure. He didn't look any better than the Stoke players.

Well i'd say the 1st job of a defender is to defend and he's not much good at that. If people are unhappy with Perch don't start expecting Raylor will be any better. Or Simpson for that matter.

My Tuppence: Colo did well, gotten beaten to a header that hit the post but he's never going to win those, overall i thought he did well/ Williamson gotten beaten to often by Jones for flick ons. They didn't dop much with them but i expected MW to be more dominant in the air tbh. Perch, did alright. Kept Etherington quiet mostly, unlucky for OG, happens to everyone at some point. Routledge seems to not have the best 1st touch and that limits his options when he gets the ball. Also seemed a bit in his shell. Seemed to lack ideas as to how to get himself into the game. Tiote, did ok. Would have left him on so Barton could have kept going forward. Barton, tried. Looking for decent passes down the channels, trouble was he didn't have much movement in front of him. Barfa, ok. If he was injured then right to sub him otherwise should have left him on and pushed him upfront. We needed some quick feet in their box. Nolan. Was no better than their players. He's good with the 2nd ball (i think the only thing he's good at) but as we weren't even winning the 1st ball i wasn't sure what he was offering. Carroll, too static. We needed a player with quick feet and someone to make little runs into the channels. We needed someone upfront to start pulling their back 4 around and that never happened. If we'd have moved them about we could have found spaces to shoot. Routledge never really turned their LB, in fact we rarely got in behind them. Their defence was more often that not facing out, that makes it easier for them to head it clear. We could have played through the middle if we have smarter players making little runs, splitting the CB and FB. After about 60 mins i thought we should try Ameobi, at least he may have drawn a foul or a penalty. We were too predictable.

Nicky Butt - WRONG & WRONG. Thought he was very average at first at Man U but he turned to a decent player. Very good cover for Keane, decent on the ball as well. Was also wrong when we signed him, thought he'd carry some of that over, he didn't!

Good call! Jenas - WRONG. Christ i was well off with him! Thought he'd be a good player. Viana - WRONG. Thought he'd be a really good player, spraying it around. Didn't have the mental strength though, as evidenced by his plummet of a career!

Enrique - i was RIGHT! Many a hater on here on yous know it Paul Huntington - RIGHT. Never though he'd make it, after seeing only once or twice. Carroll - WRONG. He hasn't made it but he's sooooooooo much better than i expected. Thought he was well average before. Which game was it? Man City maybe? He was brought on late nd he didn't bother his arse to even break into a trot. I thought then he was a tosser who's never get anywhere. So far, i'm WRONG. Bowyer - WRONG. Thought he'd drive and goals, turned out he didn't add a lot of either tbh. I'll think of more.

A lot of posters on here thought the same about Enrique. We all get it wrong sometimes. I always thought Enrique could be a good player, even when he was giving the ball away every other pass. Colo i wasn't that sure about, did well last season but the one before was haunting me a bit. He's playing clever this year though. Doesn't try to get involved in the brawn much, playing it smart instead. Very good 1st touch and composed on the ball, always good to have a CB who can play the ball out. This has given me an idea....

......................,.Schmeichel.................... van Gobbel..Desailly...Woodgate....Cole Cronaldo.....Gerrard....Vieira.......Giggs .........................Bergkamp...................... ...........................Drogba........................

If Campbell's fit i'd have a think about bringing him in for Colo. Everton are good in the air.