Gary Speed (1969–2011)

[AyeDubbleYoo]

Surely he "might" have done a lot of things, but the fact he was found hanged by his own hand suggests by far the most likely verdict is suicide? Bit confusing this one.

[JH]

They're not here to deliver a "most likely" result though.

[Mick]

 

sounds like a load of crap to me.

 

Why?  Do people always make decisions and stick to them?

[AyeDubbleYoo]

They're not here to deliver a "most likely" result though.

 

Are they not? I thought they would come to a verdict on the balance of probabilities. I don't know like, obviously. Otherwise it's very difficult to ever record a verdict in these cases, unless there's a suicide note I suppose.

[cp40]

 

sounds like a load of crap to me.

 

Why?  Do people always make decisions and stick to them?

 

 

if they actually carried them out, then I would think that was fair evidence that they had stuck to them.

 

 

[James]

Something is incorrectly reported and commented on in this thread. It was Gary Speed who dismissed killing himself because of the kids in the text, not Louise dismissing the text.

[SEMTEX]

I imagine that a large amount of people threaten to hang themselves and don't go through with it tbh.

[Mick]

 

 

 

if they actually carried them out, then I would think that was fair evidence that they had stuck to them.

 

 

 

The Coroner is saying that he can't be sure that he wanted to take his life at the end, plenty of people go to commit suicide and don't go through with it.

 

I’m sure quite a few people will have died after deciding not to go through with it.  You put yourself in danger when you try to take your life and some people will have had a change of mind but will not have been able to prevent it.  How many times do people go onto a bridge and eventually get talked down?

 

Personally I cringe when climbing up steps without a wire around my neck, I’d hate to go up one with a wire around my neck and then try to get back down in one piece.

 

[cp40]

 

 

 

if they actually carried them out, then I would think that was fair evidence that they had stuck to them.

 

 

 

The Coroner is saying that he can't be sure that he wanted to take his life at the end, plenty of people go to commit suicide and don't go through with it.

 

I’m sure quite a few people will have died after deciding not to go through with it.  You put yourself in danger when you try to take your life and some people will have had a change of mind but will not have been able to prevent it.  How many times do people go onto a bridge and eventually get talked down?

 

Personally I cringe when climbing up steps without a wire around my neck, I’d hate to go up one with a wire around my neck and then try to get back down in one piece.

 

 

 

It appears like a reluctance from certain people to accept the harsh reality. Tho I understand your point. not going to get into an undignified exchange, its a tradgedy either way.

[Mick]

 

It appears like a reluctance from certain people to accept the harsh reality. Tho I understand your point. not going to get into an undignified exchange, its a tradgedy either way.

 

Nobody knows what he intended to do at the end, the only thing this verdict might do is help his kids if they think he wasn't going to go through with it.  I can only guess that it might make it a little bit easier for them.

[indi]

Inquests are always conducted in public. No-one can tell a coroner what to do and they can deliver whatever verdict they see fit, so if the coroner decides that it is uncertain that someone decided to commit suicide then that's the verdict. As harsh as it sounds the coroner won't have been concerned with making things easier for the family and they deal with harsh realities all day every day. The verdict will simply be what the coroner has determined to be the case having considered all the available evidence. It's quite common for the result of an inquest to be inconclusive, if you think about it how could it be anything else a lot of the time considering that the whole reason for having an inquest is because there have been unusual circumstances surrounding the death.

[Jill]

Grim.

[Tisd09]

It brought a lump to my throat listening to the reporter report the ins and outs of the inquest.

 

Lots of people go through relationship difficulties which seemed the only negative pressure in his life. But I suppose that couple with other possible mental health issues could be a lethal combination.

 

Its a horrible horrible thing. I really hope his family are coming to terms with it, I can't imagine how difficult this must be for them.

[LoveItIfWeBeatU]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-16760925

 

30 January 2012 Last updated at 16:06

 

Gary Speed narrative verdict after wife tells inquest of marriage strain

 

The coroner at the inquest into the death of Wales manager Gary Speed has said he cannot be satisfied he intended to kill himself.

 

Speed's widow, Louise, said his job had put strain on their marriage and told how they had a row the night before he was found dead.

 

She later found his body hanging in the garage at their home near Chester.

 

The coroner said "the evidence does not sufficiently determine whether this was intentional or accidental".

 

Louise Speed said she had gone for a drive after they had words when they returned from a dinner party, but she could not get back into the house.

 

Four days earlier Speed, 42, sent his wife a text talking "in terms of taking his life", but she said he had dismissed it because of their children.

 

She said the text conversation referred to their "ups and downs" but also mentioned "how important the boys were" and about "moving forward".

 

"The texts went on about our future together and how excited he was about our journey together," she told inquest.

 

Asked if the Wales job was forcing him to spend more time away from his family, Mrs Speed said: "I think he was spending more hours there than he thought he would do initially."

 

The Cheshire coroner Nicholas Rheinberg then asked if it was difficult for both of them "spending long periods apart?"

 

Mrs Speed responded: "Yes."

 

Mr Rheinberg asked if this had "put some degree of stress" on their relationship.

 

She responded: "I would say so, yes."

 

Mrs Speed said he did not leave a note. Det Insp Peter Lawless said his computer and phone were checked for a note, and none was found.

 

His friend, the former England captain Alan Shearer, who was with him the day before he was found dead, said he had become aware there were issues between the couple.

 

Shearer, whose family went on holiday with the Speeds, said he told him such issues were normal in a long-standing relationship.

 

Shearer last saw him at lunchtime on the Saturday before he died, when Speed appeared on the BBC's Football Focus programme.

 

He said Speed - who played for a number of Premier League clubs, including Leeds, Newcastle, Everton, and Bolton - seemed fine and was laughing and joking.

 

He got the call with the news of his death the next day. "It just didn't and still doesn't make sense to me," said Shearer's statement.

 

He also said his friend did not seem worried about anything and told him he would call him the following Monday. He also said he seemed to be enjoying the Wales manager's job.

'No greater honour'

 

The hearing was told by the Welsh national team's GP, Dr Mark Ridgewell, that Speed had showed no signs of stress and depression.

 

Dr Bob Muggleton, the medical officer at Sheffield United - the club Speed managed before taking on the Wales job - told the inquest in Warrington that he had worked with him until 2010 and no mental health issues were raised during that time.

 

The inquest was told about a dinner party hosted by a friend of Speed the night before he died, when he was in good spirits.

 

Speed had been pushed in the pool with his clothes on, along with other men, and he had tried to push everyone else in the spirit of good fun.

 

He had also been talking of booking a Christmas holiday to Dubai.

 

Robert Bateman, the taxi driver who took the Speeds home, said everything had seemed normal and they were "as normal as they always are".

 

The inquest was told Speed had alcohol in his blood, just over the UK drink-drive limit of 80mg.

 

In a statement, Speed's mother Carol said her son had said that there was "no greater honour than to manage his country in the game he loved".

 

She described him as a "half-empty person" and "certainly no optimist". The phone call from her daughter-in-law was the "worst moment of my life".

 

The inquest heard that investigators believed Mr Speed had been sitting in his garage.

 

Recording a narrative verdict, Mr Rheinberg said: "It seems likely that Mr Speed was sitting for some time with a ligature around his neck.

 

"It may have been that this was some sort of dramatic gesture, not normally in Mr Speed's character, but nonetheless, a possibility."

 

Mr Rheinberg said it was a "possibility" he was sat there for some time and he "nodded off to sleep" with the ligature still around his neck.

 

The League Managers' Association later released a statement on the family's behalf after the hearing.

Memorial match

 

After news emerged of his death, tributes were paid to Speed from around the UK and the sporting world.

 

Football matches around the country held minute's silences and applause, while fans of his former clubs, including Leeds United, Everton and Newcastle United, left scarves, shirts, photos and flags in Speed's memory.

 

Tributes were also left at the Millennium Stadium, Cardiff City Stadium and Wrexham's Racecourse Ground.

 

The Football Association of Wales announced a memorial international friendly game against Costa Rica in Cardiff, which will be held on 29 February.

 

He had earned the first of his 85 Welsh caps as a 20-year-old in a friendly against the Central American country in 1990.

 

The former Premier League star, who had two sons, went on to become Wales' most capped outfield player, captaining his country 44 times and scoring seven goals.

 

Before becoming Wales boss in December 2010, he enjoyed a distinguished career managing Sheffield United and playing for a variety of top clubs.

 

Earlier this month Speed's friend and former Wales teammate Chris Coleman was unveiled as the new Wales manager.

 

Speed's mother describing him as a "half-empty person" and "certainly no optimist" is an eye opener. It's not how you would have expected him to be.

[Guest KeithKettleborough]

I always felt he was quite a serious sort of man but determined with it and not one to get into a situation that would result is this happening. So perhaps his mams words don't surprise me as much but still no understanding of it all. Sad thing still.

[Guest bimpy474]

 

Speed's mother describing him as a "half-empty person" and "certainly no optimist" is an eye opener. It's not how you would have expected him to be.

 

That sounds very much like a "low self esteem" thing that

 

Sorry for my bad use of quotes there.

[ponsaelius]

I've tried to avoid this thread and the news stories today. The whole thing just makes me feel very, very sad.

[Guest bimpy474]

Very true

[Interpolic]

Yep, still gutted. Such a horrible and staggering thing to happen. Won't forget that awful day in a hurry, can remember walking up to get some shopping before the first match kicked off that day and being in a real daze.

 

[Cajun]

Depression is an absolute cunt (apologies for that word but it was the one that felt most fitting) of a thing, it really is as bad as a lot of the scary illnesses but still misunderstood quite a lot which becomes apparent when you see comments like "what did they have to be depressed about? They were rich, well loved etc..".

 

Depression is very much a disease, it's not just something people feel because they are going through a tough time, it's something that takes over and no matter how good some might seem to have it that won't stop depression.

 

Rest in peace Gary Speed and very best wishes to his family, feel so sorry for his wife as she will be feeling guilty about the argument etc.. when she really, really shouldn't

 

 

[wacko]

"Cunt" is the right word. They should give it a different name than "depression". It makes it sound like you're just down, which most people associate with stress and problems, and think, "what the fuck has he/she to be depressed about?"

 

It's a proper illness, just like schizophrenia or psychopathy.

[madras]

"c***" is the right word. They should give it a different name than "depression". It makes it sound like you're just down, which most people associate with stress and problems, and think, "what the f*** has he/she to be depressed about?"

 

It's a proper illness, just like schizophrenia or psychopathy.

there is clinically depressed, also manic depression which always hint at more than just feeling a bit miffed with things.

[madras]

 

Speed's mother describing him as a "half-empty person" and "certainly no optimist" is an eye opener. It's not how you would have expected him to be.

 

That sounds very much like a "low self esteem" thing that

 

Sorry for my bad use of quotes there.

i'm sure thats supposed to be "half empty person" as in someone who see's the glass as half empty, not that he was lacking as a person.

[wacko]

"c***" is the right word. They should give it a different name than "depression". It makes it sound like you're just down, which most people associate with stress and problems, and think, "what the f*** has he/she to be depressed about?"

 

It's a proper illness, just like schizophrenia or psychopathy.

there is clinically depressed, also manic depression which always hint at more than just feeling a bit miffed with things.

 

I know. But "depression" is far too often used as shorthand for both. Which gets conflated with what you and I mean when we say we're feeling a "little depressed". So people mix up manic or clinical depression with being "really depressed", in the lost my job, wife and kids sense. The kind of things that might drive an otherwise mentally-healthy person to suicide. And they look at an extremely successful and rich guy like Gary Speed, and think, "what the fuck did he have to be depressed about? He's never know real problems, like where am I going to get the money to feed my kids."

[madras]

"c***" is the right word. They should give it a different name than "depression". It makes it sound like you're just down, which most people associate with stress and problems, and think, "what the f*** has he/she to be depressed about?"

 

It's a proper illness, just like schizophrenia or psychopathy.

there is clinically depressed, also manic depression which always hint at more than just feeling a bit miffed with things.

 

I know. But "depression" is far too often used as shorthand for both. Which gets conflated with what you and I mean when we say we're feeling a "little depressed". So people mix up manic or clinical depression with being "really depressed", in the lost my job, wife and kids sense. The kind of things that might drive an otherwise mentally-healthy person to suicide. And they look at an extremely successful and rich guy like Gary Speed, and think, "what the f*** did he have to be depressed about? He's never know real problems, like where am I going to get the money to feed my kids."

i agree and it's been done a fair bit on here in the past. stan collymore has been really good in opening this up a bit and showing to a new audience what depression really is.