Thoughts on this summer's transfer window

[Belfast Mags]

I'm really caught between two stools here, on the one hand I think we've managed to rotate out some players that are never going to assist us (going forward) Smith & Lovens and have brought in some promising young talent on the cheap which given our recent success in scouting can only be viewed a good thing.

 

That said, I like a lot of you, I can see the three positions that could really do with an upgrade (was tempted to use the word NEED but refrained) if we are to really mount a serious challenge on all fronts.

 

There is an argument as to how you would keep 3 top class CB's or 3 top class strikers happy given they won't all play but it really depends on how far up the food chain you are heading towards the end of the season.

If we were doing well in the league, still in one domestic cup and still in Europe heading into the last 8/10 games of the season then you'd have no problem rotating those players.

 

If that isn't the case then we would naturally struggle (I guess) to keep everybody on board for the longer term.

 

It really comes down to an educated gamble at the end of the day and perhaps this is my frustration as a fan, if we signed a quality CB, Debuchy and someone like Remy, then I honestly think we'd be there, a squad (if we could keep it together) for the next 4/5 years requiring no big outlays.

 

With regards to selling on, again it really comes down to ambition and how far you think you can go.

Personally, I think we have set our stall out pretty well on this front if I'm honest, if somebody is prepared to pay top wack, then of course they'll be gone, but it'll only be for a fee that will help us in other areas so I'm prepared for some bad news (if it comes)

The only caveat I would tag onto that is, I think it will become increasing difficult to sell/buy, sell/buy like this going forward as everybody will be wise to us trying to pick up "good" players at knock down prices.

 

Perhaps this explains our current predicament, certainly at the start of the summer there was big talk (and chunky bids) for some players that haven't come off so maybe we are struggling a little bit now with this strategy.

 

Sometimes though in business you need to speculate to accumulate and take that little extra punt to get where you want to be.

 

Argument against that is a lot of "failing" clubs who have done the same and flopped.

Having put a scouting network in place (and having seen it work and work well) I not convinced paying a little over what we would like, would be that much of a gamble in the overall scheme of things, but I say that as a fan.

 

[mrmojorisin75]

lot of big posts here with plenty of thoughts

 

for me the carroll approach is baffling, assuming that's a deal they're sitting on waiting for liverpool to "fold" i fear they're sadly deluded...didn't rodgers yesterday basically say something like we'd not sell cheaply to newcastle (implying they would elsewhere)?  i think they'd rather see him rot than sell to us and hope that deal isn't possibly impacting other targets

[The College Dropout]

The one thing I would like clarification on is the status of Ashley's promise to invest 20 million per year into the club on an ongoing basis.

 

I know that other clubs are apparently pissing on it from great height, but wouldn't this endanger your compliance of FFP?

 

Personally, I think that Top 4 is a closed shop between London and Manchester, which is not to say you shouldn't be ambitious. But I wouldn't frustrate myself demanding a Top 4 challenge this season, or even thinking you're just 2-3 signings (that probably won't happen) away from being in that position. Rather, focus on building a team where finishing 5th-6th isn't seen as an overachieving season, but your natural place in the PL. I think you have made big strides on that regard, with the signing of Arnita and - again - retaining and having people like Santon, HBA, Cissé, Cabaye, etc... fully adapted and able to spend an entire season with you.

Look at Sunderland, they have retained Sessegnon but look at the other outstanding players they had these past years... Bent, Gyan, Cana... did any of them spend more than 18 months at the club?

Have in mind that you were promoted two years ago, and you have covered a lot more ground than anybody could expect. But building the structure and the reputation to consistently attract players and always be "in the mix" still takes more time than that. Personally, I think the aim this season is to show the world that you weren't a flash in the pan (and I think you have the quality for it).

 

Agreed.

[Ronaldo]

Bent and Cana are outstanding players?

[themanupstairs]

Have no gripes with the window so far to be honest. I'll reserve judgement for when it has "slammed shut", as you do. We don't really know what's happening behind the scenes. I get the feeling there is a sense of apprehension coming from the manager, who maybe expected big bids to come in for our star players, but seen nothing forthcoming so far. We might be stuck between a rock and a hard place as the final week of the window approaches. We know that if a large enough bid comes in for one of the big boys (Cisse is the one I'm worried most about), we'll have to sell, especially if the player agrees to the move. We may not have enough time to replace a significant outgoing with a significant incoming.

 

I think we have done well again with the players we have signed on the other hand. Anita is a quality player who has the potential to have a hand in moving us up to the next level if his partnership with Tiote and Cabaye sees fruition. Amalfitano looks a handy squad player for now, able to play in several attacking positions. Bigi and Good seem very level headed youngsters, with good attitudes towards the professional game and real talent, which is all you could ask for from players at that age.

 

The priority for me at this point is keeping the current squad together. If the window shut right now I would be relieved if i'm honest, as we'll have done well to keep our star players.

 

 

[LesPaul]

Would have preferred if we'd soaked it in petrol and flicked a match in its general direction.

[pi_D]

We are doing an excellent job this last two years.

 

The same people just want us to enact the 'well proven' principal of having to spend a lot of money(relatively) in football to progress. Let's not do that again.

 

Stick to our structure, work within our framework and keep progressing. That's the plan and it's working

[themanupstairs]

We are doing an excellent job this last two years.

 

The same people just want us to enact the 'well proven' principal of having to spend a lot of money(relatively) in football to progress. Let's not do that again.

 

Stick to our structure, work within our framework and keep progressing. That's the plan and it's working

 

Yes, YES, YESSSSSSSSS *jizzes

[Village Idiot]

Bent and Cana are outstanding players?

 

I rated Cana a lot, although he indeed didn't look all that at Sunderland. And Bent isn't Van Persie indeed, but always delivers the goods.

 

The fact remains that all of those players were intended to take Sunderland forward, but they weren't unable to hold on them.

[Chicken Dancer]

I'm happy with the way the window has gone so far. We've not lost anyone of note, which is always a bonus, and have added 3 promising squad/youth players and a very highly rated player in Anita.

          Looking at the squad though, we are very thin, mainly at full back and striker. Judging by Pardew's quotes today though, he suggests we have 24 senior players. I count 22 senior players, unless he counts one or two of the younger players in it (I've probably forgot someone obvious)

 

GK: Krul, Harper, Elliot

FB: Santon, Simpson, Raylor

CB: Coloccini, Saylor, Williamson, Perch

CM: Cabaye, Tiote, Anita, Gosling, Amalfitano

WM: Jonas, Ben Arfa, Marveaux, Obertan

ST: Cisse, Ba, Shola

 

Younger/squad players: Vuckic, Abeid, Bigirimana, Tavernier, Sammy, Ferguson.

 

          I definitely think we need to add at least 2, maybe even 3 players. Being in Europe means we need these, because extra pressure will be put on the whole squad. A FB (right or left back, not bothered) and a striker are a necessity. I am very comfortable with our strongest 11, but it's the back up players that given a prolonged run in the side would worry me, although to be fair, they never (rarely) have before.

        The beauty of our squad is we have many versatile players who could play in 2 or 3 positions to cover, and all of the lads work hard for each other. Most likeable squad for a while, and with 2 or 3 signings there is no reason whatsoever we can't have a successful season at home and in Europe.

 

[Tiresias]

I think this window Ashley was caught out by the difference in negotiating when you're a midtable club and when you're competing for champions league. Teams expected us to give them a payday when we came in for a player and played hardball with us. We possibly have a bargain in Anita but even he was more expensive than Cabaye.

 

On the plus side still feeling confident we won't sell anyone, and a full season of Cisse and Ben Arfa will be brilliant. I have high hopes for Anita and our younger players.

[Dokko]

Of course the first window I'm fully behind the club and it's policy they are going to let me down. 

[leffe186]

The one thing I would like clarification on is the status of Ashley's promise to invest 20 million per year into the club on an ongoing basis.

 

I know that other clubs are apparently pissing on it from great height, but wouldn't this endanger your compliance of FFP?

 

Personally, I think that Top 4 is a closed shop between London and Manchester, which is not to say you shouldn't be ambitious. But I wouldn't frustrate myself demanding a Top 4 challenge this season, or even thinking you're just 2-3 signings (that probably won't happen) away from being in that position. Rather, focus on building a team where finishing 5th-6th isn't seen as an overachieving season, but your natural place in the PL. I think you have made big strides on that regard, with the signing of Arnita and - again - retaining and having people like Santon, HBA, Cissé, Cabaye, etc... fully adapted and able to spend an entire season with you.

Look at Sunderland, they have retained Sessegnon but look at the other outstanding players they had these past years... Bent, Gyan, Cana... did any of them spend more than 18 months at the club?

Have in mind that you were promoted two years ago, and you have covered a lot more ground than anybody could expect. But building the structure and the reputation to consistently attract players and always be "in the mix" still takes more time than that. Personally, I think the aim this season is to show the world that you weren't a flash in the pan (and I think you have the quality for it).

 

Agreed.

 

And me too. The problem is when people talk about "investing" 25M, or "speculating to accumulate". Teams like ourselves and yourselves are now in a position when we are pretty much breaking even without transfers, and our wage bill is about where it should be. There just isn't much room for manoeuvre, and what are you going to accumulate?

 

If we now spend 25M on new players, how exactly do we balance the books? We need to get more money from somewhere. Breaking into the CL will cover that, but there is no guarantee that you will be able to do that every year. The increase in TV money will help, but I suspect a fair bit of that has gone, and will go, into increased wages and bonuses. Without a windfall, the only way to make forward steps is to exploit the transfer market and develop youth.

 

Spurs have been working on that for a while, and so we're a couple of years ahead of you on the pitch. We had a large enough squad to be able to handle selling squad players this summer - Corluka, Kranjcar, Bassong, Pienaar, prob Dawson - with others still available (Jenas, Bentley, Rose, maybe Defoe). We have a handful of youngsters who can expect to play regularly this year and next, plus others coming through. You're not yet in that position. With that in mind, the key is for you to keep players, pick up bargains, and develop the youth. You can then afford to sell one or two biggies to keep the squad improving. The signs are already there in Campbell and Ferguson, and the "cheaper" players like Anita and Bigi.

 

The sad truth is, without the silly money clubs we would both have qualified on merit for the CL this year. There's an argument that we would both have challenged for the title. With the silly money clubs, there are certain players that are simply out of reach, that beforehand might well have come to us (Oscar, Hazard, Aguero, even Dzeko ffs etc etc). As a result, we need to take the long view with the occasional punt. After all, for Berbatov there's a Bent, for Modric there's a Bentley. You have managed to pick up Cisse, Ben Arfa et al without having to gamble too much money. When you have a stronger squad you might be in a position to take more of a punt.

 

The bottom line is, unless FFP has teeth we're pissing in the wind.

[Unbelievable]

The £20m thing went out of the window years ago, Ashley said so in one of those statements.

 

Hmm, the original statement of the 20 million annual investment was done in 2008 after we went down: http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/teams/n/newcastle_united/7615655.stm

 

Pardew than mentioned in february 2011 that Mike Ashley long term wasn't willing to continue investing millions of his own money in the club: http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/3434247/Mike-Ashley-has-delivered-a-staggering-statement-of-Toon-intent.html

 

Huge shame, and you'd hope that our success on the pitch and the acceptance by our supporters that the club is on the right track and Ashley deserves a lot of credit for this would lead to him regaining his original interest and enthusiasm. May be wishful thinking, but it wouldn’t be outside of the realms of possibility that this could lead him to reconsider his stance on investing in the club. I don’t think FFP would be an obstacle, as he could simply pay the investment out of Sports Direct as a fee for the stadium renaming and SD signage all over SJP. Either way, I don’t think our transfer strategy dictates we set a budget beforehand; it’s much more opportunistic than that, so I’m reasonably confident the money will be there when there are good deals to be done.

[maybe_next_year]

i've been pleased overall i have to say. you look at the market and either nothing is happening, average players are going for huge sums or teams that we should be aiming to compete with are losing players (arsenal and seemingly spurs are going to too). its been dull, but we havn't been tempted to overspend and we havn't had to sell any of our quality players, as well as bringing in some young talent.  i'd give it a 7/10.

[Guest neesy111]

The club should still have transfer money to spend excluding any investment from Ashley, the figures from the 2010/11 season would lead to this conclusion.

 

We need a striker firstly and then a defender, if we sign them 2 then it's been a good window.  A striker decent.  None and we have stood still from last season.

[Mole_Toonfan]

So far it's a bit average but if we can get a RB and a CB or Striker before the deadline then i'll be very pleased, will save any judgement until then.

[themanupstairs]

The £20m thing went out of the window years ago, Ashley said so in one of those statements.

 

Hmm, the original statement of the 20 million annual investment was done in 2008 after we went down: http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/teams/n/newcastle_united/7615655.stm

 

Pardew than mentioned in february 2011 that Mike Ashley long term wasn't willing to continue investing millions of his own money in the club: http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/3434247/Mike-Ashley-has-delivered-a-staggering-statement-of-Toon-intent.html

 

Huge shame, and you'd hope that our success on the pitch and the acceptance by our supporters that the club is on the right track and Ashley deserves a lot of credit for this would lead to him regaining his original interest and enthusiasm. May be wishful thinking, but it wouldn’t be outside of the realms of possibility that this could lead him to reconsider his stance on investing in the club. I don’t think FFP would be an obstacle, as he could simply pay the investment out of Sports Direct as a fee for the stadium renaming and SD signage all over SJP. Either way, I don’t think our transfer strategy dictates we set a budget beforehand; it’s much more opportunistic than that, so I’m reasonably confident the money will be there when there are good deals to be done.

 

Ashley, being the astute businessman that he is, realized that there are opportunities in football, just like in any other business. He recruited people who in his view are top brass, such as Llambias, Charnley and Carr to help him exploit these opportunities. He also invested in the academy and in the club's training facilities. He realized that good players can always be found on the cheap, and it was important to have the right people and tools at the club to help them perform once they signed on the dotted line. Absolutely the only business model that will work for this club imo, as long as he is its owner.

[pi_D]

I reckon this is the beginning of NUFC realising its potential in the modern game.

 

How long have we been deemed 'sleeping giants'....

 

Finally... FINALLY I can see the potential being realised.

 

 

[Hanshithispantz]

I know it isn't exactly on topic, but are you happy with Tottenham's work this window Leffe?

 

I would say your squad has took a pretty big hit (especially with Luka on his way) but I haven't really took much notice of the transfer fees that yous have received, or if any of it is planned to be reinvested back into the squad before the window closes?

 

As a rival club (I think it's highly possible we'll be competing again this year, although probably for 5th or 6th place as opposed to 4th) I'm personally pretty happy with Tottneham's 'losses' as I think the squad and manager (at least in the short term) are weaker for it, I'm unsure if this is a misplace belief or not though.

 

EDIT: To answer the thread question I'm really happy, we've improved the squad that finished 5th last year without any major losses, what isn't there to be happy about? If we sign Debuchy I wouldn't know what to do with myself.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

The players we haven't sold (yet) make me very happy.

 

The young players and squad players we have signed look excellent additions so far.

 

Marveaux and Taylor are "like new signings".

 

Disappointed we let Best go if we don't have a replacement striker lined up. I really hope we don't buy Carroll.

 

If we get Debuchy I would basically be happy with the window, even though ideally I'd like a CB and striker as well. I guess the management have faith in Perch, Good and Shola and Sammy.

[Memphis]

It's been written before but I think it's pretty simple.

 

It's not all that difficult to break into the top 10 in the Premier League, we've seen the fact that, generally speaking, 10-12 teams each year are middling at best.  We didn't have any problem making that leap over the course of just a season or two.  But it gets exponentially harder to go any higher than 7th each year, especially since there's so much money and so much entrenched talent at the clubs above 7th.  You can spend 10-20 million and go from 17th to 8th/9th without a problem.  But spend that same 10-20 million when you're 7th and it might not even get you into the Europa League spots.

 

Ashley's not a guy that easily takes those sorts of financial risks.  There's no guarantee that we'll push on even if we brought in Debuchy, Douglas, Striker X, whoever.  It is so hard to get into that closed shop.  I suspect Pardew's trying to convince him to spend but he already went unusually large in the spending to bring in Cisse in January.  He will see it as a concession to renew Colo's contract considering his age.  We bought Anita when it isn't necessarily the position of greatest need.  I don't know how many more concessions Pardew can get him to make.

 

I'd be happy with this window if we brought in one more player and kept the existing squad intact.  We'd still be short in one area of another but we'd be well-positioned to build on last season's platform, consolidate, and perhaps take advantage of a more consistent situation to bring in players in January or next summer.  I would be surprised if we spend big money on anyone (other than Carroll - just as a pisstake) in the next week.  But I'd still class us as right there with Arsenal, Spurs, Everton, as teams in that mix for the 4th spot.  I'm assuming Manchesters/Chelsea have 1-3 sewn up.

[TRon]

I am not in a massive hurry to see new signings as I believe our squad is pretty decent overall. I would be disappointed if we didn't sign a new full back though, whether left or right, as it's the one area where I think we look weak in our first 11, never mind as cover. The only quality full back on our books is David Santon in my book. The rest shouldn't be starting as first choice. Other than that, a central defender and striker would be nice as well but if we sign for one position before the deadline it has to be full back.

[Consortium of one]

ManCity have tons of talent.  ManU are weak in central defense, IMO, but with all that talent up front and Fergie, they along with Man City will be clear of the field.  I think Chelsea brought in some dynamic talent but still have holes.  Arsenal are sliding.  Liverpool are floundering.  Tottenham has some real talent but if Modric leaves, they are a cut below.  I'm also not convinced that AVB can cut it in the EPL.  That being said, I think a move into the top four is a very real possibility if we can shore up the three areas we agree on: 3rd striker, 3rd/4th centerback and Debuchy.

 

I'm genuinely pleased we've been able to hang on to everyone, too, and I hope we can until the WINDOW SLAMS SHUT.

[leffe186]

I know it isn't exactly on topic, but are you happy with Tottenham's work this window Leffe?

 

I would say your squad has took a pretty big hit (especially with Luka on his way) but I haven't really took much notice of the transfer fees that yous have received, or if any of it is planned to be reinvested back into the squad before the window closes?

 

As a rival club (I think it's highly possible we'll be competing again this year, although probably for 5th or 6th place as opposed to 4th) I'm personally pretty happy with Tottneham's 'losses' as I think the squad and manager (at least in the short term) are weaker for it, I'm unsure if this is a misplace belief or not though.

 

EDIT: To answer the thread question I'm really happy, we've improved the squad that finished 5th last year without any major losses, what isn't there to be happy about? If we sign Debuchy I wouldn't know what to do with myself.

 

I'd say it's exactly on topic

 

It really is far too early to say, for us even more than you. I'm happy so far, but so much hinges upon Modric and his replacements. We were comfortably the better side against you in that first half, yet there was evidence of a dearth of creativity (despite hitting the woodwork twice). If VDV goes, as well as Modric, I would be very unhappy with the window, as that's a level of class that's hard to find.

 

It's clear that Levy will back AVB's judgement, in particular from the Dawson sale. I like that he's so confident, but it makes me nervous, as the consequences of failure may be all the more grievous. The advantage of having everything built around a clear philosophy is that the kids can be brought through more easily. It does have to work in the first place though.

 

I like Verts and Sigurdsson, and Adebayor. I can live with us getting decent money for Corluka, Pienaar, Kranjcar, Bassong and Dawson - that prob covers wages and transfers in and leaves a small amount left over. It all hinges upon what happens next though. I'd like LB cover, a young keeper, a young CB, someone interchangeable with Bale and/or Lennon, shit-hot replacement for Modric and possibly another forward. All of that is simply not going to happen. The shit-hot replacement plus one of the others would probably leave me happy.