Zero Posted January 5, 2014 Share Posted January 5, 2014 I place my bet that we would get relegated within 3 seasons after we sacked Pardew. Why? And that's a pretty big timeline If we hire someone like Kinnear ---> Relegation If we hire someone like Pocchetino ---> fall out with Ashley within 1 year ---> club in chaos ---> relegation, possibly after hiring some fire saving (but actually shit) managers. By the way, I don't think Ashley will spend high salary on recruiting new manager as he is fucking scary of compensation. You can kinda expect what kind of managers would be eager to work under this regime then. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted January 5, 2014 Share Posted January 5, 2014 Our win at Old Trafford is being devalued by week. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeletor Posted January 5, 2014 Share Posted January 5, 2014 Our win at Old Trafford is being devalued by week. This season was the first time ever that I was really looking forward to playing them at Old Trafford. They've fallen a long way in just 6 months. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zippity Posted January 5, 2014 Share Posted January 5, 2014 I place my bet that we would get relegated within 3 seasons after we sacked Pardew. Why? And that's a pretty big timeline If we hire someone like Kinnear ---> Relegation If we hire someone like Pocchetino ---> fall out with Ashley within 1 year ---> club in chaos ---> relegation, possibly after hiring some fire saving (but actually s***) managers. By the way, I don't think Ashley will spend high salary on recruiting new manager as he is f***ing scary of compensation. You can kinda expect what kind of managers would be eager to work under this regime then. Man, since you put it like that, Mongo is an option. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zero Posted January 5, 2014 Share Posted January 5, 2014 I didn't deny that Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zippity Posted January 5, 2014 Share Posted January 5, 2014 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sifu Posted January 5, 2014 Share Posted January 5, 2014 Our win at Old Trafford is being devalued by week. Ah, don't be taking this away from us! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zippity Posted January 5, 2014 Share Posted January 5, 2014 Our win at Old Trafford is being devalued by week. Ah, don't be taking this away from us! Scoring 1 at Old Trafford is so last year, man. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanshithispantz Posted January 5, 2014 Share Posted January 5, 2014 Man U have been great for betting against this season. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
colinmk Posted January 5, 2014 Share Posted January 5, 2014 I think I'd take any Premiership manager apart from Asdaprice and Pulis ahead of Pardew. And a few of the Championship ones too. Petty much same as me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest palnese Posted January 5, 2014 Share Posted January 5, 2014 Add Mark Hughes to that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmojorisin75 Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 Fucking hell this thread is a massive circle of recycled points, so here's another. People pointing to the Spurs, Chelsea and Manyoo wins which have masked very bad losses to inferior teams: the haterz point about Pardew always comes back to sustainability. During the 5th season we said it was not sustainable to play football based on marginal results and one person scoring the goals from scraps. So it was proven right. This season he's pulled off 3 very good and unexpected wins that have papered over some of the same failings that had us in trouble last year. Does anyone see where I'm going with this? If we spend the rest of the season struggling against weaker teams and don't go to Anfield or the Emirates and take points chances are we'll end up bottom half of the table. Similarly if we rinse and repeat next season without the wins against the big teams. Shock results like we had are not the norm, top teams will not always be in transition, then where will we be? Until he can put out at team that goes at the weaker teams at home looking to score lots of goals and beat them senseless he's getting it very, very wrong. Keegan almost won the fucking title doing this tbh, 17 home wins that season but our away record was gash. Madness people can't or won't see it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisMcQuillan Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 f***ing hell this thread is a massive circle of recycled points, so here's another. People pointing to the Spurs, Chelsea and Manyoo wins which have masked very bad losses to inferior teams: the haterz point about Pardew always comes back to sustainability. During the 5th season we said it was not sustainable to play football based on marginal results and one person scoring the goals from scraps. So it was proven right. This season he's pulled off 3 very good and unexpected wins that have papered over some of the same failings that had us in trouble last year. Does anyone see where I'm going with this? If we spend the rest of the season struggling against weaker teams and don't go to Anfield or the Emirates and take points chances are we'll end up bottom half of the table. Similarly if we rinse and repeat next season without the wins against the big teams. Shock results like we had are not the norm, top teams will not always be in transition, then where will we be? Until he can put out at team that goes at the weaker teams at home looking to score lots of goals and beat them senseless he's getting it very, very wrong. Keegan almost won the f***ing title doing this tbh, 17 home wins that season but our away record was gash. Madness people can't or won't see it. Magnificent post. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
midds Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 Fucking hell this thread is a massive circle of recycled points, so here's another. People pointing to the Spurs, Chelsea and Manyoo wins which have masked very bad losses to inferior teams: the haterz point about Pardew always comes back to sustainability. During the 5th season we said it was not sustainable to play football based on marginal results and one person scoring the goals from scraps. So it was proven right. This season he's pulled off 3 very good and unexpected wins that have papered over some of the same failings that had us in trouble last year. Does anyone see where I'm going with this? If we spend the rest of the season struggling against weaker teams and don't go to Anfield or the Emirates and take points chances are we'll end up bottom half of the table. Similarly if we rinse and repeat next season without the wins against the big teams. Shock results like we had are not the norm, top teams will not always be in transition, then where will we be? Until he can put out at team that goes at the weaker teams at home looking to score lots of goals and beat them senseless he's getting it very, very wrong. Keegan almost won the fucking title doing this tbh, 17 home wins that season but our away record was gash. Madness people can't or won't see it. ding ding ding ding. This rings the fucking bell like. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 Some of the defence of Pardew in here today has been cringeworthy, Bret get's a special mention for asking about English Managers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JH Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 f***ing hell this thread is a massive circle of recycled points, so here's another. People pointing to the Spurs, Chelsea and Manyoo wins which have masked very bad losses to inferior teams: the haterz point about Pardew always comes back to sustainability. During the 5th season we said it was not sustainable to play football based on marginal results and one person scoring the goals from scraps. So it was proven right. This season he's pulled off 3 very good and unexpected wins that have papered over some of the same failings that had us in trouble last year. Does anyone see where I'm going with this? If we spend the rest of the season struggling against weaker teams and don't go to Anfield or the Emirates and take points chances are we'll end up bottom half of the table. Similarly if we rinse and repeat next season without the wins against the big teams. Shock results like we had are not the norm, top teams will not always be in transition, then where will we be? Until he can put out at team that goes at the weaker teams at home looking to score lots of goals and beat them senseless he's getting it very, very wrong. Keegan almost won the f***ing title doing this tbh, 17 home wins that season but our away record was gash. Madness people can't or won't see it. You've just won the forum - well done. It's worked for donkeys. We've never particularly had a good away record under our better managers (even in the later days under Bobby) but we were winning the games we were supposed to at home and giving the big teams a go as well. There's no point in one without the other. Until he starts treating the cup competitions with respect and stops trying to shut up shop against the 'weaker' sides, then he'll not be the manager for me tbh. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveMc Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 Yip you need a decent number of 2-0 standard home wins a season to make progress. We don't seem to be able to count on a result in any given game. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
colinmk Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 Mojo. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrettNUFC Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 Some of the defence of Pardew in here today has been cringeworthy, Bret get's a special mention for asking about English Managers. You lot just missed my point about English managers. I meant the style of play around the country in England, 90 percent of the country play this 'anti football'. I keep hearing sack Pardew and our next manager will get us playing attacking football but when asked for names i got Nigel Adkins and Billy Davies, so i'm guessing if he was sacked we want a foreigner as if that's the best these shores have to offer us then they can fuck right off People say managers with a high level of class players will get their teams playing the right way of football but then you only need to look at our international side and see the football Hodgson is producing. My point basically is if we sack Pardew and bring someone else in and he turns out to be a bog standard manager with no flair in his style, will you get behind him? If the results are positive but football is still on the whole rather plain and flat, will you be behind him? A lot of people forget i was in your position with Hughton, i wanted him out, i couldn't give a shit if he was a nice guy or not, he was a bang average manager at best and i wanted someone different to come in to upgrade and take us to next level. He got sacked and i was delighted, then we announced Pardew and i was absolutely livid but after the moaning and groaning realised this is the way it's always going to be with Ashley so may as well just put up with it, hope he does a good job and get behind the players on the pitch. Pardew has actually done a far greater job then i ever imagined him to do, certainly didn't see a 5th place finish and travelling around Europe with him in charge Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toonpack Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 End of the day basically the majority on here want him sacked and a foreigner brought in, i say foreigner because nobody was able to name someone from these shores to replace and play this exciting football they want to see. Question still remains if he was sacked and someone was brought in who wasn't known for his pretty football, would people accept him since it's not Pardew. I'm beginning to think it's basically Pardew as a person who is hated and wanted out, this whole we play such boring football is just a smokescreen as 90 percent of the football teams in the country don't play with the style of football people on here want to see. This kind of football was accepted with Hughton but he was a nice genuine guy, whilst Pardew is bullshitting c***. Saw a decent question put to David Peace (author of the Damned United) a few months back that was answered like this, and I think it said something about what people look for in a manager: Q I met Shankly with my dad once outside Anfield and he did possess this messianic aura. Grown men felt blessed to be in his company and there was a kind of Puritan work ethic that drove men like Shankly, Busby and Stein. With the retirement of Ferguson who was perhaps the last of that breed, the British game now seems to be controlled by dull pragmatists and technicians. At board level, old school spivs like Louis Edwards, Ken Bates, Ron Noades, Doug Ellis and Peter Swales have been replaced by global franchise gangsters for whom each club is merely an entry in a portfolio. Yet football has never belonged to the fans, footballers and managers have always been expendable and chairmen and administrators have always been incompetent and corrupt. Gazprom United will no doubt rule world football soon but is this necessarily a bad thing? A: One thing that struck me, again and again, researching and writing Red or Dead was, as you say, that football has never belonged to the supporters, the players or the managers. The clubs have always been owned by the men with the brass. But what also struck me was the way in which men like Shankly, Stein and Busby – coming from backgrounds that were much harder and poorer than most of us (not all of us) will ever know – through their sheer bloody-mindedness and hard work, their sacrifices and struggles, taking on the owners and the directors, created clubs in their own and the supporters’ image. And even in times as dark as these, I still do find that inspirational. When you think of a manager like that at our club you would think of Robson or Keegan - they weren't just good managers, they were brilliant representatives of the club and the region, and as Peace said 'they shaped the club in their own image'. "Great managers" (Robson, Clough, Revie, Paisley, Shankley) first emerged in large numbers after the abolition of the maximum wage. They were able to scour the country searching for talent, and then assembling it at clubs in the big cities, who would have a financial advantage over those outside the cities (although the inequality was nowhere near as vast as it is today). They would often find the players themselves, and they would run the club from top to bottom. They were the club, and if successful they would be worshipped, and in this country that is what a great manager is still defined as. I think it's pretty obvious, even to a Pardew fan like me, that Alan Pardew is definitely not going to be that man for Newcastle United. However, it is also obvious to me that as long as Ashley is in charge we aren't going to have a manager like that. No one is going to be allowed that level of control. Pardew is consistently undermined in transfer windows, and it is obvious that unfortunately, for as long as Mike Ashley is here, the club will project Mike Ashley's image. But there is something to be said for the system that is put in place. I don't think it is as easy for a manager to build a dynasty on his own as it was in the 70s / 80s. There is only one manager in the league who has built his club from top to bottom. It is a global game now - you cannot have a manager and his sidekick driving round the country for players like Clough and Taylor at Forest. But the current accepted thinking in this country hasn't changed. We gave £50m to Souness, he rang up his mates like Boersma and Saunders and gave them jobs, then he rang his old club and other mates and the likes of Boumsong arrived. Then we had to spend more to sack him. Absolute insanity but common enough in football. Down at Sunderland, Short has been instructed in conventional thinking by everyone in football's best mate Niall Quinn - and has poured millions down the drain while Quinn, Bruce, and ONeill walk away with millions. Its an outdated method and clubs in this country are seeking an alternative. There is an argument that the days of truly iconic managers may soon be gone. Ashley is a loathsome individual and projects a terrible image for our club. But he has a system in place that does not rely on one man and there is something to be said for that. Pardew is never going to bestride this club like a collosus, but no one is while Ashley is here. Pardew is always going to tow the party line in interviews and his attitude to the cups, but so will any manager while Ashely is here. Pardew's style reflects the fact that we will not spend large amounts on forwards - any manager here will have to contend with this. He is though, the most important cog in the machine Ashley has put in place. He has done a good job for Newcastle United in that role, and he deserves praise for it. Important stuff bolded. Whilst I found Red or Dead a little hagiographic & at times cringe worthy I though it was a good portrayal of Shankly on a whole & a decent read. Peace seems to write football brilliantly which I previously thought was impossible. I had a look at Red or Dead but didn't think I'd be able to get away with the style unfortunately. Its a shame because after reading The Damned United, I'd have been really interested to see his portrayal of Shankly . The interview with Peace is here if you're interested: http://yerknowthedance.wordpress.com/2013/09/02/peace-in-our-time/ Regarding your bold bits. No-one other than Ferguson has been a colossus at their clubs. Ferguson even being a colossus towed the party line. Define "large amounts" if you mean £40+ million you're right. We paid a canny wedge for Cisse. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 I just don't get his approach to the cup here. Maybe Gerrard scarred him for life when he robbed them of the FA Cup with that screamer and it's a phobia. West Ham's squad was worse yet he took it seriously there. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 There was an article in the Independent at the weekend before the game making the case that we were the only Premier League team that could afford to throw our full weight at the FA Cup, and that we should do exactly that. So glad we didn't, will make for such an exciting run in. Will be it 8th? Will it be 9th? Be still my beating heart. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 Does anyone think if we replaced Pardew with Carver or Willie Donaghie from the coaching staff we'd be much worse off? Chris Hughton was just a coach before Ashley decided he had enough of spending money on proper managers and he did ok. Ashley brings in quality players on the cheap and even without much coaching they'll get some good results and some bad. Pardew really has a hard time trying to figure out how to get 5ft 10 players to jump higher. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrettNUFC Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 People act like Pardew done an Allardyce and fielded an under 21 side like he wasn't arsed. When in fact it was a very strong side that should have been capable of beating Cardiff and when you're 1 up with 20 minutes to go and Cardiff haven't really threatened much, i certainly thought we were in the next round and the players probably did too. Match got turned on it's head by poor keeping and a set piece, let's not go overboard here. We didn't batter Cardiff, they didn't batter us, was a poor standard of a game which we threw away when in control. To say Pardew deliberately got us knocked out on advice from Ashley or just because he wasn't arsed himself about the cup is mental. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dilligaf Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 To say Pardew deliberately got us knocked out on advice from Ashley or just because he wasn't arsed himself about the cup is mental. I don't think he got us knocked out because of orders from above but I do think he got us knocked out by piss poor team selection and tactics. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts