merlin Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 Right... First of all, I personally think Rafa is overestimating this division and its costing us in ways, but ultimately we are on course for promotion which is the number one goal here and therefore his methods cannot be knocked (too much), because they are working. I'm in no doubt that under say someone like (wor) Chris Hughton or dare I say it Steve Bruce with these group of players we will probably lose fewer games and play more direct and somewhat more adventurous than under Rafa, and that promotion would be achieved all the same. But... come the Premier League? What we are seeing under Rafa is a system, a method, a way of playing, a set of tactics that has seen him succeed at every club he has been at even at club's he's not exactly been welcomed at (Chelsea) or considered a good fit (Real Madrid). The man is a winner, whatever it is he does, it works. And its working here, albeit not to everyone's taste and I include myself in that. I don't like his tactics, his game plan or our style of play. I think we are making hard work of many a fixture and should not be losing the number of games we are. If only he would change things a bit... two up front maybe? Less holding midfielders maybe? Earlier changes maybe? More game time for Mitrovic maybe? Lots of maybes... Would we be any better off? Probably not and this is where we need to look at our manager and decide whether we trust him or not. Me personally I trust him 100%. Its all about promotion this season, forget record points, record wins etc. its about becoming a Premier League club come May. That said, however, for Rafa, its about becoming much more than that long-term and that's what we are to him - a long-term project. We are not even a year into that! I've been a fan of his way back when he was Valencia manager and was ridiculously jealous when Liverpool appointed him as we went for Souness. I regard him as the best or one of the best tacticians in the game and easily a world-class manager, top 10 without doubt! I love the man personally for firstly taking us on and secondly for reconnecting the fans and club and city even under the ownership of Ashley. He's made of the same cloth as KK and sir Bobby and yes Hughton, for me the best managers we've had in the modern era. But he isn't beyond critique or question. This season, we are seeing a very drilled and mechanical way of playing which suits some players, but not others. It will probably, hopefully, get us promotion. Rafa remember is all about the long-term. He is finding out which of our players are able to play how he wants us to play and who cannot and that will determine what happens should we become a Premier League club. I guarantee those that cannot play his way will make way for those that can. If this is the Rafalution we must think about evolution and that's what Rafa's sides are all about, evolving until perfection or almost near perfection. We are on a scale of 1-to-5 at the moment. If we reach stage 5 we will be very lucky and will no doubt be one of the better teams in the country. Back to his ways, its all about repetition so that every player regardless of their talent knows what to do and how to do it. Their level of skill or lack of will determine just how far that goes of course. Rafa will now know those that are capable and those that aren't. We will soon say goodbye to your Colbacks and Goufrans thankfully and we will, if backed, see much better players much more suited players to where he wants us heading. Remember he is a long burner, its all about the long-term. What we are seeing today is typical Rafa fayre. If we get promoted and the owner allows big investment we will become one of the best teams in the top-flight! A good summary, HTT and I agree with most of it. As I have said before, the problem is that if we were in the PL, we could afford to wait until Rafa's methods bring success and nobody would have a problem with that. We are NOT in the PL as you know and it is imperative that we go up this season or Rafa will be gone...I am sure of it. We will then be back to square 1 as a new manager will come in and change everything again...players sold, players bought, playing style altered and on we go.... That is why everyone who is expressing concerns is doing so - they know that it would be doubtful that Rafa would stay for another Champ season if he was being pursued by other big clubs at a higher level and Ashley would be very tempted to accept a compensation payment of, say, 25m to allow Rafa to leave ; although I don't think they would be his first choice West Ham would almost certainly cough it up if they stay up.... That is why we need to avoid losing any more games - we have lost 7 already and that is allowing other clubs to challenge us seriously for automatic promotion. IF we could guarantee promotion nobody would mind HOW Rafa achieved it but many of us have seen at first hand how NUFC are specialists in extracting failure from the jaws of success and we don't want a repeat of that this season. Your basic assessment and the fact that most fans do trust the manager is spot on though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmojorisin75 Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 In the hypothetical long run I know it'll work. Problem is, the prospect of having any long term with Rafa is completely predicated on being successful this season. His system has big limitations in this context but he just won't stray from it. Playing just one defensive midfielder is the most cavalier he'll ever be. We have to accept it and just hope we bring in players who'll make it work to the extent we pull well away from 3rd. This - it all HAS to work this season or he will be off. interesting that people are so certain of this, should he fail to get us promoted i'd be shocked if he walked away tbh Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Crooks Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 We're getting promoted like. First real kink we've had let's be honest. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy84 Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 It's pretty simple imo, we are missing Shelvey. He started his ban on Boxing Day and since then we've looked a bit flat footed and lacking a spark. Let's be honest, it took Forest to go down to 10 before we got a grip of that game and even then it wasn't great. Benitez and his tactics have won us the most games and we've scored the most goals, I think people over complicate things. Shelvey is back soon and we will bring in at least one addition to midfield to help drive us forward. I think we will be absolutely fine come May. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 It's pretty simple imo, we are missing Shelvey. He started his ban on Boxing Day and since then we've looked a bit flat footed and lacking a spark. Let's be honest, it took Forest to go down to 10 before we got a grip of that game and even then it wasn't great. Benitez and his tactics have won us the most games and we've scored the most goals, I think people over complicate things. Shelvey is back soon and we will bring in at least one addition to midfield to help drive us forward. I think we will be absolutely fine come May. This is my overall feel but it's a pain to have these games where we struggle so much. Slightly worried about the striking department as well, if Mitro is surplus to requirements then we definitely need a high-quality signing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scoot Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 We're getting promoted like. First real kink we've had let's be honest. Totally agree. People need to calm down a little bit. We were always going to hit a dodgy patch in the season. Brighton will as well between now and the end of the season. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
YNGLEGIONNAIRE Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 Yeah , I think 99% of us realise what we have now is way beyond what we could ever have wished for in probably the most miserable period in this club's history as we experienced under the 3 previous incumbents . We all feel frustration at debatable decisions made by Rafa affecting results , but there can't be many amongst us who don't have total commitment and belief in his long term planning. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 It's pretty simple imo, we are missing Shelvey. He started his ban on Boxing Day and since then we've looked a bit flat footed and lacking a spark. Let's be honest, it took Forest to go down to 10 before we got a grip of that game and even then it wasn't great. Benitez and his tactics have won us the most games and we've scored the most goals, I think people over complicate things. Shelvey is back soon and we will bring in at least one addition to midfield to help drive us forward. I think we will be absolutely fine come May. I think that is what has annoyed me most about our last couple of games, while Shelvey is obviously going to be a miss, I think we could have done a better fist of replacing him rather than try and get by with two defensive midfielders, one of who can't defend for his life in reality. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jayson Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 It's pretty simple imo, we are missing Shelvey. He started his ban on Boxing Day and since then we've looked a bit flat footed and lacking a spark. Let's be honest, it took Forest to go down to 10 before we got a grip of that game and even then it wasn't great. Benitez and his tactics have won us the most games and we've scored the most goals, I think people over complicate things. Shelvey is back soon and we will bring in at least one addition to midfield to help drive us forward. I think we will be absolutely fine come May. Agree with that. Ignoring the sending off, he's missed 5 other games this season. We've scored in just 2 of them & one of those was just that deflected free kick before they went down to 10 men. The other was 1-0 against Bristol city. Shelveys our ball player & gets us moving, we have no one to do a similar job when he's out and clearly struggle for goals. Getting another ball playing midfielder as back up to Shelvey would help a lot. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDonis Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 Put simply - there are games you might have won or got a point had Rafa played more openly or differently. But there also games you might have drawn or lost which you won if he had not. You are where you are, still in a very good position, and without Shelvey you are not as good. Other teams will have a sticky patch too, especially when they lose key players or tire as the season progresses. The championship is an insanely long season, games come thick and fast and what looks good/shit can look the exact opposite two weeks later. Remember: it's always a ride with Rafa. Don't expect it to go smoothly - expect drama, and expect good results and some great times. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elliottman Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 Put simply - there are games you might have won or got a point had Rafa played more openly or differently. But there also games you might have drawn or lost which you won if he had not. You are where you are, still in a very good position, and without Shelvey you are not as good. Other teams will have a sticky patch too, especially when they lose key players or tire as the season progresses. The championship is an insanely long season, games come thick and fast and what looks good/s*** can look the exact opposite two weeks later. Remember: it's always a ride with Rafa. Don't expect it to go smoothly - expect drama, and expect good results and some great times. Great post. We're not used to trusting managers round these parts, not recently anyway. Although some of the bed wetting - albeit generally online, has been a little embarrassing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 Who did Rafa have at L'pool when Alonso was out? It's not relevant - I just can't recall. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole_Toonfan Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 We're getting promoted like. First real kink we've had let's be honest. Aye the only question mark is 1st or 2nd IMO. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDonis Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 Who did Rafa have at L'pool when Alonso was out? It's not relevant - I just can't recall. Lucas Leiva Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 We don't have an alternative to Shelvey in the squad anyway. There are options like Diame and Anita, but understandably Rafa is wary of the knock-on effects of moving them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 Who did Rafa have at L'pool when Alonso was out? It's not relevant - I just can't recall. Lucas Leiva So similar in the sense... a passer goes out and a huff merchant comes in. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 Who did Rafa have at L'pool when Alonso was out? It's not relevant - I just can't recall. Lucas Leiva So similar in the sense... a passer goes out and a huff merchant comes in. Well yeah, but there isn't anyone else. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanji Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 Lucas Leiva a huff merchant - he's about 5,000x+ the player that Colback is. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
triggs Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 Lucas Leiva a huff merchant - he's about 5,000x+ the player that Colback is. Just as Alonso is way better than Shelvey Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanji Posted January 4, 2017 Share Posted January 4, 2017 Lucas Leiva a huff merchant - he's about 5,000x+ the player that Colback is. Just as Alonso is way better than Shelvey No shit man Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
54 Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 http://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/newcastle-free-to-dream-big-again-under-benitez-sqplnq0pc?shareToken=c99afc4350ac78ef263920ca9a93d7e4 Tradition tells us to look back and to gaze forward, the calendar prompts us for resolution. As Newcastle United supporters contemplate what they were and who they are, it is worth recalling their club’s long, apathetic slide towards relegation, the arrival of Rafa Benítez and the change which has spread from the manager’s office towards every corner of the club. They are stronger now than they have been for years. Second in the Sky Bet Championship and with four defeats in their last eight league matches, this is not a moment for bravado or complacency, but resolution is worthwhile. Resolve. If this is a blip, then it has beauty; six points clear of third in the table, 17 wins behind them, more than any other side, scouting players in the loan market and with a manager whose record places him amongst the elite. If it is a test then it should be welcomed. Newcastle need to be tested, from the stands, to the pitch, to the boardroom, where relationships are still melding and corrosion is still being chipped from the stanchions. If they are to return to the Premier League, better to do so battled-scarred and hardened, having bitten and clawed and fought for every point, rather than via a lofty procession which teaches them little. Newcastle are still learning how to win, still learning what it means to be united. They have the deepest squad in the division, but it is not the most streetwise or experienced. Their previous demotion in 2009 came with a context of no manager, the club aimless and up for sale and from that character and determination were born. Kevin Nolan knew how to win free kicks, to tread on the toes of defenders. They knew the tricks. By contrast, their latest relegation was relatively serene. Benítez was already in place and the confirmation of his staying brought momentum. There was money to spend last summer and a profit made, too. The process of reconnection between club and support began in unlikely circumstances and has continued, but the recalibration of an institution is not a matter of pressing a button and resetting. It takes time, work, tests. There can be no guarantees, but what would be the point of football if there were? And yet Benítez is the closest to certainty that Newcastle could have, with a garlanded history, an obsession over minute details. His attraction to Tyneside was partly emotional, a feeling of restless potential, the possibility of doing something which, after years of truncated ambition and being told they could not compete, was a form of validation. Benítez never said that this would be easy and he was right. There have been episodes when Newcastle have looked far too good for their surroundings but on Boxing Day against Sheffield Wednesday, they were knocked from their rhythm, fouled and mugged and Benítez spoke about their game management afterwards. They have missed the suspended Jonjo Shelvey who, with a bit more intelligence, would be by far the best player in the division, but they need resolve, too. A year ago, Steve McClaren was head coach. He had postponed his dismissal with victories over Liverpool and Tottenham Hotspur, but there would then be a run of six games without a win, including a 1-0 defeat to Watford in the FA Cup. They were 18th. Ask McClaren about the club’s hierarchy, persuading directors to do things differently, and he would squirm and explain that, thanks to him, journalists were now offered tea and biscuits at press conferences. This grand old club in the heart of the city were cold and aloof, defined by their smallness, by their limitations. Benítez reverses that. They may not be in the Premier League, but they have been given a rare opportunity to start again, free, by and large, of financial restraint and with no lingering atmosphere of rancour. If they go up, Benítez will challenge the club to seek more than safety, but this is what all good managers do. A couple of months ago, a senior figure at St James’ Park said something which would once have been unsayable: that he was glad Newcastle were relegated with Benítez in charge. Money is not everything and the Premier League is not worthy of the hyperbole it generates, particularly in the bottom half, and this was a heartfelt, footballing response at a club which had morphed into a works team for Sports Direct. Newcastle have already cleared their biggest hurdle. With the important caveat that Mike Ashley’s ownership has never lost its capacity for self-defeating decisions, they have ripped up their rulebook and recognised their own role as a sporting entity. Promotion would bring another one, hard conversations about finance and ambition, but that is how it should be. And is it not better to stand for something and fail, to be a club again and fail, than relive what came before? Four defeats in eight games is a test and one that Benítez will pore over; how best to manipulate tactics, personnel, formations, who to bring in, what to do better. Some players may not stay the course. But four defeats in eight games is also a chance for Newcastle - a rejigged Newcastle, a new Newcastle - to show what they are made of. To be stronger, to be tougher and, as far as their stadium is concerned, to be louder. For resolution. By George Caulkin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmojorisin75 Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 A year ago, Steve McClaren was head coach. He had postponed his dismissal with victories over Liverpool and Tottenham Hotspur, but there would then be a run of six games without a win, including a 1-0 defeat to Watford in the FA Cup. They were 18th. Ask McClaren about the club’s hierarchy, persuading directors to do things differently, and he would squirm and explain that, thanks to him, journalists were now offered tea and biscuits at press conferences. This grand old club in the heart of the city were cold and aloof, defined by their smallness, by their limitations. Benítez reverses that. perfectly put Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkie Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattoon Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 An excellent piece by Caulkin, as usual, but this will have the Mackems fewmin: Money is not everything and the Premier League is not worthy of the hyperbole it generates, particularly in the bottom half Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted January 5, 2017 Share Posted January 5, 2017 Lucas Leiva a huff merchant - he's about 5,000x+ the player that Colback is. Just as Alonso is way better than Shelvey No s*** man Then what was the need for your comment? Lucas is a huff merchant in comparison to Xabi Alonso as Colback is a huff merchant in comparison to Shelvey. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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