Positive Optimism - Saudi Takeover Edition

[Pons Alias]

Even if that's right - when we go down, and if arbitration fails, we're doubly fucked.

[Ketsbaia]

Yeah, I think Ashley naively believes there's a sale whichever division we're in. Maybe he's been told that in conversation. But he'll get a shock once we go down and PIF re-negotiate.

[gdm]

Sacking Bruce would come out the clubs account. I’m no way would Ashley have to pay for it. If the club is sold in his eyes as you say why would Ashley care about the £4m

This thread is a great laugh 

[Pons Alias]

 

It's gone on so long now, that I don't think the corrupt powers in charge of EPL/EFL - proxy for the 'big 6' - will ever let the Saudis buy us. 
Even though hypocritically Man City and Chelsea were pretty much in the same 'sleeping giant' position before they got taken over. 
(And Spurs are not a big club like Liverpool or Man U - they are and always will be, jumped up no-marks who are only included because Arsenal need the rivalry)

*Sorry for not being positive.

 

 

Edited March 26, 2021 by Pons Alias

[Jackie Broon]

They won't have any choice if the arbitration finds in our favour.

It's more likely that Mike Ashley / Steve Bruce will kill off any chance of the Saudis coming back for us even if we do have a positive outcome from the arbitration.

[Whitley mag]

19 minutes ago, gdm said:

Sacking Bruce would come out the clubs account. I’m no way would Ashley have to pay for it. If the club is sold in his eyes as you say why would Ashley care about the £4m

This thread is a great laugh 

You do realise if it comes out of the clubs account it affects the agreed price at this point, thereby Ashley would care. The past 15 years should tell you he cares about every penny.

Keep popping in for a laugh though 

[Alberto2005]

2 minutes ago, Whitley mag said:

You do realise if it comes out of the clubs account it affects the agreed price at this point, thereby Ashley would care. The past 15 years should tell you he cares about every penny.

Keep popping in for a laugh though 

I think the cost of relegation is slightly more than paying off Steve Bruce.

[Wandy]

1 hour ago, Whitley mag said:

It’s quite simple I believe, Ashley has sold the club for an agreed price and in his eyes he’s just waiting on approval. Forking out 4 million in compensation would probably come out of his pocket now. 

As the poster above has stated, it is unquestionable that relegation has not been discussed privately between buyer and seller at this stage. I certainly don’t think where deliberately trying to get relegated as i believe the arbitration ruling will stand regardless if we’re in EFL. Remember Rick Parry is on the payroll of project big picture so no way he waves this through.

What I do believe however is that the deal will be structured in a way Ashley is not worse off once add ons have been paid. He will be very confident that the prospective owners have the cash to bring us straight back up. Also the prospective buyers are so rich that they will have no issue with paying the balance on promotion.

So in my eyes it’s all on arbitration and relegation isn’t a deal breaker.

 

 

If we go down then money will need to be spent, by whoever owns the club, on players to get the club promoted. Your suggesting that the Saudi's will be happy with paying extra money on these players, and also eventually giving Ashley his full £320m through a structured deal? Never in a million years.

The idea that the Saudi's are so cash rich that they will casually just throw extra money at NUFC ...no matter the circumstances ... to complete the sale, is simply bonkers.

 

[Whitley mag]

3 minutes ago, Wandy said:

If we go down then money will need to be spent, by whoever owns the club, on players to get the club promoted. Your suggesting that the Saudi's will be happy with paying extra money on these players, and also eventually giving Ashley his full £320m through a structured deal? Never in a million years.

The idea that the Saudi's are so cash rich that they will casually just throw extra money at NUFC ...no matter the circumstances ... to complete the sale, is simply bonkers.

 

Disagree Wandy, they see the price Man City are now valued at. If the club is valued at 2 billion in 10 years it still represents value in their eyes. It won’t take a fortune to get out of championship.

Respect you’re opinion though, you usually speak a lot of sense on here.

 

 

Edited March 26, 2021 by Whitley mag

[Hhtoon]

27 minutes ago, gdm said:

Sacking Bruce would come out the clubs account. I’m no way would Ashley have to pay for it. If the club is sold in his eyes as you say why would Ashley care about the £4m

This thread is a great laugh 

Are you assuming that the club has sufficient operating funds at the moment considering no matchday incoming revenues? If it doesn't, where would the cash come from?

I don't have a clue if course, I assume there are more TV rights as more matches televised but does that cover matchday shortfalls?

[Whitley mag]

6 minutes ago, Alberto2005 said:

I think the cost of relegation is slightly more than paying off Steve Bruce.

I honestly think he believes we have enough to stop up though mate.

[Hhtoon]

19 minutes ago, Whitley mag said:

You do realise if it comes out of the clubs account it affects the agreed price at this point, thereby Ashley would care. The past 15 years should tell you he cares about every penny.

Keep popping in for a laugh though 

And this. Value would have been based on the position at that point. So if we had £xm in the bank at valuation, it needs to reflect that at handover. Not £50m less for whatever reason. 

[Wandy]

8 minutes ago, Whitley mag said:

Disagree Wandy, they see the price Man City are now valued at. If the club is valued at 2 billion in 10 years it still represents value in their eyes. It won’t take a fortune to get out of championship.

Respect you’re opinion though, you usually speak a lot of sense on here.

Lol. Mate, I admire your relentless confidence in this going through, I really do. Myself, I am also still fairly optimistic, or I simply wouldn't be on this thread. But it's a different ball game if we go down.

Its only us, the fans, who wouldn't be put off paying the full whack if the club is relegated. Business people don't look at it like that though. They will want value for money and wont want to come away from a deal feeling like they have been fleeced. Even if the long-term prospects are still great.

I can still see them buying us upon relegation, but it would have to be at a pretty significantly reduced price.

[et tu brute]

20 minutes ago, Whitley mag said:

You do realise if it comes out of the clubs account it affects the agreed price at this point, thereby Ashley would care. The past 15 years should tell you he cares about every penny.

Keep popping in for a laugh though 

So when did money coming out of the club’s account not effect the agreed price? After the purchase of Wilson? After the purchase of Lewis? The signing on fees for Hendrick and Frazer? These were all completed after the price had been agreed. 

[gdm]

26 minutes ago, Whitley mag said:

You do realise if it comes out of the clubs account it affects the agreed price at this point, thereby Ashley would care. The past 15 years should tell you he cares about every penny.

Keep popping in for a laugh though 

So wait you think in the event of relegation ‘add ons’ will be agreed and Ashley will be no worse off but the £4m from sacking Bruce will come off the price of the club and Ashley will be  £4m worse off 

Honestly buckled 

[gdm]

10 minutes ago, et tu brute said:

So when did money coming out of the club’s account not effect the agreed price? After the purchase of Wilson? After the purchase of Lewis? The signing on fees for Hendrick and Frazer? These were all completed after the price had been agreed. 

The players would be assets and hold value but the logic that Ashley will be no worse off if we are relegated but amazingly £4m worse off if he sacks Bruce is hilariously baffling 

 

 

Edited March 26, 2021 by gdm

[et tu brute]

15 minutes ago, gdm said:

The players would be assets and hold value but the logic that Ashley will be no worse off of relegated but amazingly £4m worse off if he sacks Bruce is hilariously baffling 

I get that (no guarantee they hold value though) was just making the point that there have been many outgoings in the club’s account since the deal was agreed, so when did Ashley draw the line. I agree he’s going to lose millions, and the fact that it’s now being portrayed that relegation is being allowed to allow a takeover is just lala land stuff.

 

 

 

Edited March 26, 2021 by et tu brute

[Hhtoon]

13 minutes ago, gdm said:

The players would be assets and hold value but the logic that Ashley will be no worse off if we are relegated but amazingly £4m worse off if he sacks Bruce is hilariously baffling 

That wasn't your point on this, you said that the £4m comes out of the clubs account and doesn't impact Ashley. 

[Pons Alias]

JoeLinton is worth a lot less than £40m now - our determination to buy him must have been a tax write off or something.

It makes no sense in a footballing context.

[Hhtoon]

7 minutes ago, Pons Alias said:

JoeLinton is worth a lot less than £40m now - our determination to buy him must have been a tax write off or something.

It makes no sense in a footballing context.

Yeah, the club will likely be amortising him as 40m, but new owners would look at any assets and ensure appropriately valued. I suspect they may have tweaked that one 

[Candi_Hills]

Perhaps they have already agreed on a knockdown price if we get relegated, so from Mike's point of view, there are 4 outcomes.

1 Sack Bruce and stay up

2 Sack Bruce and go down

3 Keep Bruce and stay up

4 Keep Bruce and go down

Option 3 is the best deal for him. He just doesn't realise how long the odds are.

As for the idea that sacking and replacing Bruce costs Ashley nowt because it comes out of the club's account, would that not just mean the buyers ask for the sale price to be adjusted accordingly? I honestly don't know. I won't pretend to understand everything but a gamble on Mike's part, with a sale agreed either way, seems as good an explanation for sticking with the cabbage as any.

[gdm]

26 minutes ago, Hhtoon said:

That wasn't your point on this, you said that the £4m comes out of the clubs account and doesn't impact Ashley. 

It does come out the clubs accounts just like every player purchase and wages come out of the clubs accounts and I stand by that. the £4m is essentially paying up Bruce’s contract it’s not a fuckin gift. Does Ashley personally pay Bruce’s wages or does it come out of club funds 
 

I then moved on to another point wether it comes off the price of the club or not and wether it affects Ashley or not. Keep up. 
 

im not at all convinced Ashley sacks Bruce and Amanda is straight on the phone saying that will now be £346m for the club. It just disnae work like that 

 

 

Edited March 26, 2021 by gdm

[Hhtoon]

2 hours ago, gdm said:

Sacking Bruce would come out the clubs account. I’m no way would Ashley have to pay for it. If the club is sold in his eyes as you say why would Ashley care about the £4m

This thread is a great laugh 

It comes out of the clubs accounts. However if the club is sold and the club at that point has £4m less than when the agreement and original valuation was made, then it would likely be adjusted and only £346m would be payable (very basic scenario obviously). Where does that £346m go to? Ashley. So who pays the £4m?

 

26 minutes ago, gdm said:

It does come out the clubs accounts just like every player purchase and wages come out of the clubs accounts and I stand by that. the £4m is essentially paying up Bruce’s contract it’s not a fuckin gift. Does Ashley personally pay Bruce’s wages or does it come out of club funds 
 

I then moved on to another point wether it comes off the price of the club or not and wether it affects Ashley or not. Keep up. 
 

im not at all convinced Ashley sacks Bruce and Amanda is straight on the phone saying that will now be £346m for the club. It just disnae work like that 

No interest in keeping up with your other points thank you, but appreciate the offer.

How do you think it works? You agree a price for a house and then someone rips the roof off before completion and you still pay full whack?? 

 

 

Edited March 26, 2021 by Hhtoon

[gdm]

12 minutes ago, Hhtoon said:

It comes out of the clubs accounts. However if the club is sold and the club at that point has £4m less than when the agreement and original valuation was made, then it would likely be adjusted and only £346 would be payable (very basic scenario obviously). Where does that £346 go to? Ashley. So who pays the £4m

 

No interest in keeping up with your other points thank you, but appreciate the offer.

How do you think it works? You agree a price for a house and then someone rips the roof off before completion and you still pay full whack?? 

Just like players value is factored in i assume the managers contract and wages are also factored in. As I said this is a case of a paying up a contract not giving him a nice £4m fuck off bonus.

the new managers contract however.

also my initial post was in reply to WM’s ludicrous suggestion that Ashley would lose nothing if we got relegated but £4m if we sack Bruce that’s mental 

 

 

Edited March 26, 2021 by gdm

[Dr Jinx]

26 minutes ago, gdm said:

Just like players value is factored in i assume the managers contract and wages are also factored in. As I said this is a case of a paying up a contract not giving him a nice £4m fuck off bonus.

the new managers contract however.

also my initial post was in reply to WM’s ludicrous suggestion that Ashley would lose nothing if we got relegated but £4m if we sack Bruce that’s mental 

Mike Ashley has never lost a penny when it came to the bad decisions he had made at this club. Relegation? Grand, loan the club money that he gets back even though it was his fault we were relegated in the first place. He’s never had to take responsibility for his actions.

It’s slightly different this time as he wants to sell. He wouldn’t be paying big money for a legal team if he intended on keeping the club for any longer than he had to.