Sven Botman

[Kid Icarus]

As good as Shadow Puppets' post is, it'll get buried in a pile of other posts soon enough

[gbandit]

I’m at a point where I’d like to see some unserious questions asked

 

”Sven, who farts the loudest in the changing room?”

 

”Eddie, you and Mad Dog are in a ring up against a lion and a kangaroo. Who takes which?”

[ExiledGeordie]

9 hours ago, McDog said:

 

No loyalty here on the faceless medical staff. I say again, if after reviewing the scans the medical team allowed him to play and his ACL was all but done then sure they should be fired. That also assumes the entire review process in the club is a giant mess. Botman is a valuable player and I personally highly doubt they would chuck him in knowing that kind of danger from the top. That said, I concede I know fuck all on who did what, just as everyone here I guess.

The scans were clearly inconclusive and therefore the medical team sought multiple opinions from knee specialists. One opinion was that it wasn’t a complete rupture and could be managed conservatively obviously with the opinion he could get back to full fitness. There was also the opposite opinion that he needed surgery. Usually with ACLs it is pretty clear cut but doesn’t seem so in this case. There are definitely questions to be raised regarding the medical staff this season but their decision will have been based on specialist opinion. Now it does appear that surgery was probably the best option because he’s re-injured the knee but to suggest they all need firing and are somehow negligent is way OTT. Collectively the club has got this wrong though I agree. 

 

 

Edited March 21, 2024 by ExiledGeordie

[Guest]

Miss you already, Sven

[rutland]

From last years injury...

 

https://www.nufcblog.co.uk/2023/11/30/sven-botman-injury-update-hope-for-howe-ahead-of-brutal-december-run/

 

and X discussion.

 

 

https://www.reuters.com/sports/soccer/newcastles-botman-faces-long-spell-out-with-knee-injury-2024-03-20/#:~:text="The Dutch centre back sustained,a full and speedy recovery."

 

[rutland]

And

 

https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/agonising-sven-botman-wait-goes-28168933

[STM]

Let's hope IF any error has been made, that an internal investigation is held to find out what they could have done differently.

 

I'm sure nobody at the club is happy about this situation and given our ambitions, I'm sure the right people are asking the right questions.

 

Let's hope Sven is back ASAP, thankfully the summer break takes up the majority of his time away and lets hope its closer to 6 than 9 months.

[Erikse]

25 minutes ago, rutland said:

And

 

https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/agonising-sven-botman-wait-goes-28168933

 

Quote

The requirement of surgery would likely see Botman ruled out for the first months of 2024, potentially altering Howe's January transfer plans in the process. Toon scouts have been scouring Europe in recent months, with interest in Sporting Lisbon's Oumane Diomande emerging in recent weeks.

 

What plans? Altering the plans of doing nothing

[Magpie]

1 hour ago, Kid Icarus said:

As good as Shadow Puppets' post is, it'll get buried in a pile of other posts soon enough

Genuinely feel like quoting it at the start of every new page 

[Erikse]

1 hour ago, janpawel said:

For those saying we now need 2 CBs, don't you think the club will consider if we can get away with 1 CB? 

 

It would be Schar, Lascelles, new CB and Krafth who could cover until Botman was back. Leaving Tino and Trippier cover for right back

 

Then at LB, Burn could also cover CB, assuming Targett and Hall are here for LB cover 

 

I was thinking it just pushes the need for a CB up the priority list

 

We won't buy 2x CBs, we will have to heavily prioritize again, as allways. Players are expensive, and several positions needs strengthening.

[andycap]

Lascelles could be away in the summer so we'll be even weaker at centre half then now. 

[TBG]

Negligent if we let Dummett go now. 

[arnonel]

9 hours ago, Shadow Puppets said:

 

Now, I’d really love it if we, as a forum/fanbase, could collectively stop loosing our shit over things we know nothing about. Feels like there’s a real appetite to pin blame on managers / players / staff / owners for everything at the moment (to suit your own agenda) when in many cases there is no blame to pin. 

[Scoot]

It's difficult to accept that surgery is out if the question.

Does that mean he's not getting surgery then?

[The College Dropout]

26 minutes ago, andycap said:

Lascelles could be away in the summer so we'll be even weaker at centre half then now. 

Has he not just signed an extension?

[RS]

Eddie to blame again then. What a poor choice this appointment has been. Couldn’t sign Mbappe. Couldn’t build a new stadium and now he’s injured Botman. 

[Nucasol]

44 minutes ago, andycap said:

Lascelles could be away in the summer so we'll be even weaker at centre half then now. 

He won’t unless we choose to cash in as he signed a one year extension.

[Earp]

48 minutes ago, arnonel said:

spot on

[George Bailey]

Gutting for the lad.

Hope for as speedy (and safe) recovery as possible. On his day is one of the very best, lets hope we see that Sven back soon in black and white.

[Sibierski]

1 hour ago, Scoot said:

It's difficult to accept that surgery is out if the question.

Does that mean he's not getting surgery then?

Think it just means he’s gutted he can’t recover from knee ligament damage again by just resting up for 2-3 months and be fine. 

[PauloGeordio]

??

[Erikse]

12 hours ago, Shadow Puppets said:

Right… just to lay out the facts as I know them (those of you who know me know who my sources are). Had this confirmed tonight…

 

1) his initial injury in the Brentford game appeared minor at the time. There was never an indication, at all, that there was anything seriously wrong until the Sheff Utd game. That is the first time anyone became aware that there may be a deeper problem.

 

2) he saw 3 specialists, one in the UK and two in the Netherlands. ALL of them agreed that a period of rest and rehabilitation should prevent the need for surgery, though one of them was apparently less convinced than the others, but still it was an acceptable course of action to everyone.

 

3) he has had regular scans (I think we’re talking every month, but I might be wrong), to monitor the situation, and every one of them has been fine… no issues with him playing. The last one was 3 weeks ago, just prior to the Wolves game, that showed that he was absolutely fine to play.

 

4) the decision was not “left up to the player”… it has been an ongoing joint decision between the club, the specialists and Sven. Seems like everyone has been on the same page. 

 

5) to reiterate, Sven has physically felt absolutely fine for months. I think, personally, reading between the lines, that he has struggled more mentally with trusting his body, which had led to some mistakes and a bit of a loss of confidence.

Lastly, I’m trying to get confirmation of what exactly the injury is, and whether it’s the same as / a continuation of previous, or whether it’s due to a weakness in the area or something. Will report back if / when I hear anything.

 

Now, I’d really love it if we, as a forum/fanbase, could collectively stop loosing our shit over things we know nothing about. Feels like there’s a real appetite to pin blame on managers / players / staff / owners for everything at the moment (to suit your own agenda) when in many cases there is no blame to pin. Sometimes, people make decisions based on the best available information, and annoyingly sometimes those decisions turn out, in hindsight, to be wrong. It doesn’t mean that someone is shit at their job, needs sacking, or deserves public shaming… sometimes it just means that none of this is a perfect exact science.

 

I mean, I believe you, but did they really tell you all this without even telling you whether the injury was related, which is kind of the main part, and is the one thing that will definetly be known to everyone anyways? I guess we know now from the Botman post.

 

 

Edited March 21, 2024 by Erikse

[madras]

12 hours ago, Shadow Puppets said:

Right… just to lay out the facts as I know them (those of you who know me know who my sources are). Had this confirmed tonight…

 

1) his initial injury in the Brentford game appeared minor at the time. There was never an indication, at all, that there was anything seriously wrong until the Sheff Utd game. That is the first time anyone became aware that there may be a deeper problem.

 

2) he saw 3 specialists, one in the UK and two in the Netherlands. ALL of them agreed that a period of rest and rehabilitation should prevent the need for surgery, though one of them was apparently less convinced than the others, but still it was an acceptable course of action to everyone.

 

3) he has had regular scans (I think we’re talking every month, but I might be wrong), to monitor the situation, and every one of them has been fine… no issues with him playing. The last one was 3 weeks ago, just prior to the Wolves game, that showed that he was absolutely fine to play.

 

4) the decision was not “left up to the player”… it has been an ongoing joint decision between the club, the specialists and Sven. Seems like everyone has been on the same page. 

 

5) to reiterate, Sven has physically felt absolutely fine for months. I think, personally, reading between the lines, that he has struggled more mentally with trusting his body, which had led to some mistakes and a bit of a loss of confidence.

Lastly, I’m trying to get confirmation of what exactly the injury is, and whether it’s the same as / a continuation of previous, or whether it’s due to a weakness in the area or something. Will report back if / when I hear anything.

 

Now, I’d really love it if we, as a forum/fanbase, could collectively stop loosing our shit over things we know nothing about. Feels like there’s a real appetite to pin blame on managers / players / staff / owners for everything at the moment (to suit your own agenda) when in many cases there is no blame to pin. Sometimes, people make decisions based on the best available information, and annoyingly sometimes those decisions turn out, in hindsight, to be wrong. It doesn’t mean that someone is shit at their job, needs sacking, or deserves public shaming… sometimes it just means that none of this is a perfect exact science.

Welllllll that's all well and good but who do we blame ?Things aren't going as we want so we need to blame someone !

[BermyToon]

Disappointing. He didn't seem like his old self after his return from injury this year though. Hopefully Lascelles or Dummett could provide adequate cover till Botman's back.

[wormy]

I'm confused. He's talking about surgery being out of the question but he'd been trying to avoid that and is gutted? Is he getting surgery and gutted about it or not or is it just a translation issue?

 

Sorry but I really can't be arsed to trawl through the pages of 'could we have prevented this' talk to find out. 

 

 

Edited March 21, 2024 by wormy