Víctor Muñoz: going to Liverpool (various)

[AyeDubbleYoo]

Just now, The College Dropout said:

Again we signed Isak in 4 days.

 

I have no idea TBH, I don't know when the clock starts from and I don't know if that is typical or an outlier. 

[Kimbo]

The lad might be pap anyway. A lot of his highlights are basically pace in transition, and a lot of the good reviews I’ve seen are because he performed well against the top teams, where his team were probably playing on the counter.

[Minhosa]

4 minutes ago, AyeDubbleYoo said:

 

Is it? It's a multi party, multi million deal which involves a player moving country and committing himself for several years. And he has an agent tasked with getting the most money for them both. 

 

I'm no expert but I think it's going to take a while. I've taken longer than that to get a new job. 

 

 

 

It’s exactly the same 

[AyeDubbleYoo]

Just now, Minhosa said:

It’s not about delays, it’s about us being in control of the process and not a fucking victim of it man. 
 

We’re gonna be wandering around the dance floor at 4am when every other bastard has taken a worldie home and we’re looking at the ugly fatties and wondering which is the least worse before the club closes and we’re going home alone. 
 

We’ve just lost the best bird in our nightclub to the same cunt that fucked us last summer. We need a radical new approach for the rest of them otherwise all we’re getting is laughed at and dose of the clap to show for our night out. 

 

But it seems like we have a new approach. Going early in the window, targeting players from abroad like everyone wanted. 

 

It's annoying when one fails. 

[AyeDubbleYoo]

Just now, Minhosa said:

It’s exactly the same 

 

It's much more important and complicated is my point. 

[stozo]

7 minutes ago, Minhosa said:

Good. We control the situation, we control the narrative and we move on. What we don’t do is blow about in the fucking wind waiting to be chosen or outbid by others. 
 

Set the parameters and move on. And do it every time. Explain this to Agents before you even begin conversations. 
 

We like player x but this is how we work. 
 

- If you leak it, we pull out

- If you move the goalposts once a deal is agreed in principle, we pull out

- We will pay you a handsome fee for getting it done by x date. If we don’t your fee reduces and we’ll not do business with you next time. 
- If the player has other options, he will have until x date to make his decision. If those other interested parties cannot complete by our drop dead date, we’ll pull out and you risk being stuck with an unhappy player who didn’t get any move. 
- If you play the game, we’ll recommend you to other players and also give you exclusivity on xyz terms. 

This will make us feel good but you can forget about getting a bulk of good players with this approach. There are very, very few players who only want Newcastle - the majority want to go to wherever they’ll be paid best and so will let things play out. 

 

The ‘we’ll pay you a handsome fee to get it done by X date’ is also completely impossible as for it to be a needle moving amount it will have an SCR impact. You aren’t getting Muñoz to move two weeks ago by bunging his agent £100k - we’d probably had to have sweetened the wages and agent fees by millions.

 

All this comes down to the fact we’re shackled by SCR and don’t have the financial firepower to blow anyone away. So the minute a big club comes in, we’re cooked. 

[Minhosa]

2 minutes ago, AyeDubbleYoo said:

 

But it seems like we have a new approach. Going early in the window, targeting players from abroad like everyone wanted. 

 

It's annoying when one fails. 

New approach? Seems startlingly like the one we used last summer so far to me. 

[Kanj]

10 minutes ago, The College Dropout said:

Liverpool just got Iraola in 2-weeks ago. I think he's been crucial to this transfer. There's a world we get the deal done or at least save a bunch of time before Iraola even gets to Liverpool.

 

All reports are that Liverpool decided to sack Slot fairly late in the day. 

 

The idea that time doesn't matter is ridiculous.

I hate to say this in this thread but I have to, the manager had to have played a big part. Young kid playing for his countrymen probably has some factor in it. 
 

i do have some gut pain thinking our manager may not have the pull needed to sign some of these wonderkids - what if Cesc was our manager?

[The College Dropout]

It wasn't Munoz that delayed this 2-weeks btw. He asked for 24 hours.

 

The 2-weeks was haggling with Osasuna and Real Madrid. Over £1m all-in.

[Choppy Chop Chop]

My hate of Liverpool is reaching Man U & Everton levels 

[Minhosa]

3 minutes ago, stozo said:

This will make us feel good but you can forget about getting a bulk of good players with this approach. There are very, very few players who only want Newcastle - the majority want to go to wherever they’ll be paid best and so will let things play out. 

 

The ‘we’ll pay you a handsome fee to get it done by X date’ is also completely impossible as for it to be a needle moving amount it will have an SCR impact. You aren’t getting Muñoz to move two weeks ago by bunging his agent £100k - we’d probably had to have sweetened the wages and agent fees by millions.

 

All this comes down to the fact we’re shackled by SCR and don’t have the financial firepower to blow anyone away. So the minute a big club comes in, we’re cooked. 

I’m suggesting we sign less players and spend more on agents fees to get the ones we want. I’m talking about big payments/incentives to agents. 
 

As I said last night, if we need to sign 8 players this summer, let’s use the transfer fee for player 8 (say £20m) as the ‘get shit done fund’ and go without him.  That way, we end up with 7 x first choices and a small vulnerability in one position which can be addressed in the next window. 

 

 

Edited 1 hour ago by Minhosa

[Kid Icarus]

Just now, The College Dropout said:

It wasn't Munoz that delayed this 2-weeks btw. He asked for 24 hours.

 

The 2-weeks was haggling with Osasuna and Real Madrid. Over £1m all-in.

 

It wasn't over £1m man, release clauses have tax implications in Spain. 

I'm all for bashing the club over this, but this keeps getting ignored. 

[The College Dropout]

Just now, Kanj said:

I hate to say this in this thread but I have to, the manager had to have played a big part. Young kid playing for his countrymen probably has some factor in it. 
 

i do have some gut pain thinking our manager may not have the pull needed to sign some of these wonderkids - what if Cesc was our manager?

Think the issue here is more slowness. We activate the release clause while selling Gordon - the deal is done before Iraola even gets to Liverpool. Reports are he's asked for 24-hours once everything was agreed, he wasn't stringing us along Etikite PSG move style. Etikite type deals I have no issues with - that can happen to anyone.

[El Prontonise]

My issue is if you spread out how long it takes to agree the deal, then you give other clubs time to evaluate whether they want to sign him or not (e.g.  speak to other targets first).

[AyeDubbleYoo]

4 minutes ago, Minhosa said:

New approach? Seems startlingly like the one we used last summer so far to me. 

 

Not really. Moving much earlier, completely different profile of targets. 

 

The common thing being a deal that failed, granted. 

[ffs]

8 minutes ago, Kimbo said:

The lad might be pap anyway. A lot of his highlights are basically pace in transition, and a lot of the good reviews I’ve seen are because he performed well against the top teams, where his team were probably playing on the counter.

so a bit like... *elanga*? 😱

[ffs]

2 minutes ago, The College Dropout said:

Think the issue here is more slowness. We activate the release clause while selling Gordon - the deal is done before Iraola even gets to Liverpool. Reports are he's asked for 24-hours once everything was agreed, he wasn't stringing us along Etikite PSG move style. Etikite type deals I have no issues with - that can happen to anyone.

the fact is we don't really know. need to get jocky on a pod 

[black_n_white]

1 minute ago, ffs said:

so a bit like... *elanga*? 😱

If Liverpool are interested it’s highly doubtful he’s rubbish

[Kimbo]

2 minutes ago, ffs said:

so a bit like... *elanga*? 😱

Well he can control a ball tbf.

[The College Dropout]

1 minute ago, Kid Icarus said:

 

It wasn't over £1m man, release clauses have tax implications in Spain. 

I'm all for bashing the club over this, but this keeps getting ignored. 

So potential what - £5m? 8m? Genuinely, what would be the financial impact for us activating the release clause like Liverpool have vs the structure we eventually agreed 

[Keggy_Keagal]

Post Staveley and dare I say Ashworth this seems to be happening far too often to simply be a case of bad luck or coincidence. 

[GEFAFWISP]

Just now, black_n_white said:

If Liverpool are interested it’s highly doubtful he’s rubbish

But Gordon is worse than shit don't you know and that Italian wastrel Tonali is wanted by all the tops clubs.

[Minhosa]

Just now, Keggy_Keagal said:

Post Staveley and dare I say Ashworth this seems to be happening far too often to simply be a case of bad luck or coincidence. 

Agreed. Feels a systematic or bureaucratic issue to me. The approach is broken. 

[Shays Given Tim Flowers]

I know it's easy to get down on the club (though I feel it's mostly transference from being down on football) but by all accounts the youth departments are really beginning to make signigifcant progress towards becoming the type of club we want to be. 

[SUPERTOON]

3 minutes ago, Keggy_Keagal said:

Post Staveley and dare I say Ashworth this seems to be happening far too often to simply be a case of bad luck or coincidence. 

We haven’t had a good window since they left. The whole club has gone stale since then as well tbh.