Colos Short and Curlies

I'm going to try and dig around a bit, but a very quick glance around does suggest that Belgium wont be an isolated case. Between 2010 and 2015 SD charged UK VAT on all sales to EU countries, HMRC recommended that they contacted all 27 countries to clarify the position - SD appealed against this and won in a UK court but that doesn't mean that an EU court wouldn't over rule this (As the Belgians have done). SD have a distribution centre in Austria so I can definitely see that being an issue (and the Austrian tax regime is tough). France and Germany unfortunately I think will be pretty much covered as I think SD have registered companies there so not much in the way of sales from the UK. Fingers crossed Italy get interested, if so expect this total bill to be north of €1bn, the question would then be how much is VAT (and in part reclaimable form HMRC) and how much is fines and interest

Unfortunately I think mike is right on this one. f*** off Rafa plays politics, always pushing for more. You're right, he does but he always pushes for more for the club first and foremost I actually do think Rafa had settled in China early, but only after it was obvious that it was a lost cause trying to push us forward. Turning down a number of jobs in Europe supports this, but if Ashley had turned round in June and said let's do it 80% your way he'd still be here

Both happened yesterday didn't they? Id say KB knew that the fans would latch onto the tax so has given them something else to focus on

That bit is very clever wording that actually says he was willing to put in 23million to support Rafa but no mention on what he is doing now. We all know how it pans out anyway, budget is cut by 23million on the sly and magically MA was due a 23million payment against his loan which he didn't take to fund the transfer. Reality is 'has he bollocks' but the accounts suggests he has

Hope you mean millions instead of thousands I do - its Friday, its late and my dealings in this have been in the thousands (my defence your honour)

Ongoing. Although the mounts here are nowhere near the Belgian amounts, if found guilty we could see some serious charges levied against Ashley and Charnley and we would be sold and would be hit with some hefty FA/PL penalties as it is genuine tax evasion and fraud that is being investigated, not a technical oversight

Righto - and warning this is pretty boring tbh so only read on if you have insomnia, So this all centres on online sales made to customers in Belgium, basically in every EU country there is a threshold of annual sales (Belgium is €35,000) after which you have to register for VAT in that country and pay local VAT at their rates - you don't pay it to HMRC as well. Back in 2017 HMRC lost a case where they wanted all SD sales to be under UK VAT and outside of the above rule, from this point a Belgian bill was always going to come (I'd actually wager that SD sell sufficient values to have this situation in every EU country) and they really should have been accounting for it (hence my earlier comment that they've known about this for 2 years). Certainly up to 2017 all VAT would have been paid to HMRC an this will be reclaimable. Hopefully (for the innocent shareholders) they have continued to pay VAT on Belgian sales to HMRC after this point and if so then is also fully recoverable. The problem they have though is that VAT in Belgium is 21% and they can go back to the point at which it should have been payable - 1% on all sales to Belgium over say 10 years is a lot of VAT to pay. The authorities can also levy fines and interest on the full amount that should have been paid, not just the difference in VAT rates. My gut feeling is that SD have not disclosed the bill to Belgium, and it has been the Belgian authorities who have made the first move. If so, and with SD being a plc with massive EU sales, the fines will be significant - in Italy it could be up to 500% of the liability in fines and interest on top. I've lived this for 2 years after joining an online retailer with a total turnover of £20m, unwinding a bill of £2m - 30% of this being fines and interest after we made the disclosure and it being a genuine oversight of a company with no accounting function prior to me joining. Boring bit over. Ashley can't be found personally liable for any of this so talk of tax evasion etc is fanciful. He does however have responsibilities as a director to make good decisions and this along with the HoF debacle could lead to him losing his position in SD. Impact on NUFC? HMRC will have looked into our transactions after finding irregularities in SD and it wouldn't surprise me if this was what started the whole transfer investigation. I think apart from this investigation there interest in us is done. Will it lead to him taking more cash out of NUFC? Unlikely as you would actually want to keep yourself and SD as low on cash as possible until it is resolved so you can plead poverty and an inability to pay. It could actually make him more likely to go on a spending spree. Could there be more? Potentially - all 27 EU countries will be looking at this unless SD are paying VAT there already. If Italy get involved it would dwarf this. The way its been handled today may lead to the shareprice absolutely tanking on Monday. I don't think SD will be in the FTSE100 for long if it does. They won't pay €600m, with the HMRC reclaim it will be €200-€300m max imo. It will be a pain in the ass for the finance team anyway. What we should all hope is that this is just the tip of the iceberg on how they account for things and a new auditor rips apart the acquisitions they have made. on its own its a technical correction to make, but if there is anything else dodgy going on it will now be found and if serious fraud charges may follow on the directors with prison being a possibility as well as a ban on being a director for any UK company for a while and failing the F&P test. Takeover impact? I can see him having enough of public life and retiring to the Bahamas so it could make him a more receptive seller TLDR - on its own its an irritation to him but it may be the thread that when pulled makes the whole thing collapse

He wont be

Didn't Odin say something similar Rumbled

You're going to depress the shite out of us arnt you mate? Or make your day...

And that will be linked, that is HMRC will have looked at us because of Ashley's involvement in tax issues at SD

They've known, or should have known, about this for at least 2 years BTW. I'll jump on the laptop later, too long for my fat fingers on mobile but I have first hand experience in this

Will expand later but unfortunately he will probably be able to get most of that back from HMRC. Paid to the wrong place rather than not paid at all would be my guess

And it will fail. Fees will peak this summer or next, but what we are seeing is that as clubs no longer need to sell at market prices players (Zaha, Longstaff, Mcguire) are being priced out of moves. The next phase is for 2 year contracts to be the norm with players leaving on a free or nominal fees and this money now going to them as signing on fees. Imagine Zaha looking at the £80m and going you know what I can cut that in half and take £40m over 2 years and then repeat with another club, and then another etc. 4-5 moves over a career, staying 2 years at each club and raking in £20m a year. Nice work if you can get it

It’s because Carrs first round targets always exceeds the fat cunt’s budget. But fatty has seen the lost profit on each of these targets subsequent sales...

He's going to have to become one of the best in the Premier League over the next 2 years to turn a profit. Ashley has gone the Everton route here, looking at Lukaku in particular, spend £30-£40m and double it. Easier than turning £15m profit 3 times isn't it? The problem may be however if this summer becomes a watershed - Mcguire, Zaha, Longstaff to name 3 all being priced out of moves with stupid valuations as clubs don't need the cash due to TV deals. Solution? Players start signing 2 year deals max and look to make their millions on 3-4 signing on fees, why should the clubs get this lovely transfer cash and tie the players into 4 year deals. Bye bye to the buy to sell at a profit model

What's the point? Hes just spent what he got for Perez. Shows how low we are when that actually is really good progress on what we've seen previously

So their wages won't appear in the future accounts? What happens with players whose wages were put into that charge who subsequently left before the end of their contract? Will that show up as being repaid? The whole thing seems bloody stupid if i'm honest, what's the point? If we don't pay the cash then yes you are correct

So Shelvey the architect, Darlow with crap purchase on his kick and Colback there but not getting involved. Seems legit

Can't see Austin here at all. It will be one of Carroll, Sturridge or as an outside bet Welbeck who lead the line next season alongside Lipton Tea or Gayle. Also not so sure that Cackback will be playing much, it will be Longstaff + Hayden or Shelvey as a 2 unless we bring another in

Loved the analogy on Talksport earlier - we were out on a date with Michelle Keegan and are going home with Susanne Boyle

But it’s a day oot with me mates man And I bet that in each group of me mates each and every one of them wants to stop and do something different but are waiting for someone else to suggest it

You watch Feb and Novak today and then England/New Zealand and you see 4 sporting individuals/teams going hell for leather and putting themselves through hell in order to try and reach the pinnacle of their sport - you realise why sport is such an important part of so many peoples lives and just how damn good it can be. Then you remember you are a NUFC fan and Mike Ashley is the owner.