Newcastle United 1 - 2 Hull City - 13/09/08 - post match reaction from page 21

[Wullie]

Four games in and david edgar is starting. Steven taylor is starting. Charlie is starting at left back. Geremi is starting. Butt is starting. Shola is starting. And the transfer policy has been a success?

[BONTEMPI]

What stood out most for me today was the total lack of athleticism in our midfield. No real power of pace from Butt, Geremi and Guthrie. Even if we have Guti back we have no real presence in the middle. Barton had some at Man City but i didn't see much from him last season and i don't expect much this season tbh. The other thing that was painful to watch was Edgar at RB and Zog at LB. Both easy targets for counter attack.

 

Why people were crying out for an attacking midfielder a holding midfielder and another winger towards the end of the window, but we ended up with a couple of average players in the end and no Manager.

 

This club is going nowhere under Ashley

[Slugsy]

Exactly Wullie

[Thespence]

Four games in and david edgar is starting. Steven taylor is starting. Charlie is starting at left back. Geremi is starting. Butt is starting. Shola is starting. And the transfer policy has been a success?

 

Your not thinking long term though!!!

 

[Guest LucaAltieri]

This match has pretty much settles the internal debate for me.

 

Keegan vs. the Ashley setup.

 

There's not a single one of the purchases this summer that look to be bad signings. We haven't broken the bank and we've improved the squad no end. It still may be early to be judging those players but the quality of those brought in seems to be high right from the off.

 

The recruitment system works. Now we just need a manager happy to work within it. If there are no 'big' names willing then do an Arsenal and sign a relatively unknown, promising, young manager/coach.

 

Keegan isn't necessarily in the wrong or the bad guy, but he wants changes that the owner isn't willing to make - and I agree with Ashley in this instance. The recruitment/development setup needs to stay and be built upon.

 

Sorry to break this to you, but Newcastle lost today, man.

 

Yeah, due to lack of spine and poor performances from the old lot.

 

Which of the new signings were crap today?

 

Which of the new signings have shown signs of being crap since they arrived?

 

The recruitment is fine. Now we just need to give them a gaffer to bring it all together.

 

the fact you think this is a choice between the players we've signed and keegan is alarming.

 

when did this false dichotomy arise? from what i remember keegan was fine with bassong, coloccini, guthrie and Jonas, he 'green lighted' their signings in the same way he didn't sanction moves for Gomis or Zayatte. the problem is when the likes of wise and llambias started doing transfer deals without keegan's say so. had they left and keegan stayed, we'd still have kept Vetere the bloke who is actually going out and finding players.

 

For me, Xisco looks very strong and brave, and battles for everything. his first touch is very rusty, he's not particularly fast, his movement is ok, isnt the sort to beat players, has a bit of an eye for goal. promising but a long way to go for him.

 

Nacho looked decent when he came on, didnt do enough to make me think he's any better than (or even equal to) Emre, but the fact he tried to make adventurous passes is a plus with a lack of bodies and lack of quality endemic to our squad.

 

I agree with the majority of that but the part in bold is mostly assumption. Now I'm not going to pretend to know what kind of relationship existed between 'the board' and Keegan. I don't know what was agreed or what promises were broken... and neither do you. It's just one word against the other. We don't know what went on it's all opinion.

 

The one fact we can take from it is that the two entities couldn't work together. It took just one transfer window for it to all fall apart. You choose to blame Wise and Llambias but you know no more than I do. It's all hearsay.

 

Now the players that have come in have been good. It's still a little early to tell with Xisco and Gonzalez but they've at least looked promising. I see real cause for optimism in that regard.

 

As the two parties couldn't work together I think it's perfectly reasonable to evaluate what's more important for us as a club. A recruitment system that seems to be delivering the goods or motivation provided by a manager like Keegan.

 

I see the recruitment of talent as a much more long-term and eventually more beneficial to the club. We missed Keegan today, no doubt... and the sooner will fill the void he left, the better - but it shouldn't be at the expense of the setup.

[Skirge]

Our game is Game Of The Day on sky sports

[BONTEMPI]

Our game is Game Of The Day on sky sports

 

Oh whoopie fucking dooo! I can open a few tinny's get trashed then sob like a big kid.

[TRon]

Four games in and david edgar is starting. Steven taylor is starting. Charlie is starting at left back. Geremi is starting. Butt is starting. Shola is starting. And the transfer policy has been a success?

 

We definitely should have made at least two more major signings, especially in midfield, so no it wasn't a success. I think people who are positive are referring to the likes of Coloccini, Jonas, Guthrie and Bassong being good additions. Hopefully the two new lads will settle in as well.

 

The players you have mentioned there, not many of them would usually get a game but we had more than usual out through injury. I don't think any team has that sort of cover, other than Chelsea maybe. Not the best game to judge on.

[Skirge]

Our game is Game Of The Day on sky sports

 

Oh whoopie f***ing dooo! I can open a few tinny's get trashed then sob like a big kid.

 

So many better games played today yet the pick our boring game.

[johnnypd]

This match has pretty much settles the internal debate for me.

 

Keegan vs. the Ashley setup.

 

There's not a single one of the purchases this summer that look to be bad signings. We haven't broken the bank and we've improved the squad no end. It still may be early to be judging those players but the quality of those brought in seems to be high right from the off.

 

The recruitment system works. Now we just need a manager happy to work within it. If there are no 'big' names willing then do an Arsenal and sign a relatively unknown, promising, young manager/coach.

 

Keegan isn't necessarily in the wrong or the bad guy, but he wants changes that the owner isn't willing to make - and I agree with Ashley in this instance. The recruitment/development setup needs to stay and be built upon.

 

Sorry to break this to you, but Newcastle lost today, man.

 

Yeah, due to lack of spine and poor performances from the old lot.

 

Which of the new signings were crap today?

 

Which of the new signings have shown signs of being crap since they arrived?

 

The recruitment is fine. Now we just need to give them a gaffer to bring it all together.

 

the fact you think this is a choice between the players we've signed and keegan is alarming.

 

when did this false dichotomy arise? from what i remember keegan was fine with bassong, coloccini, guthrie and Jonas, he 'green lighted' their signings in the same way he didn't sanction moves for Gomis or Zayatte. the problem is when the likes of wise and llambias started doing transfer deals without keegan's say so. had they left and keegan stayed, we'd still have kept Vetere the bloke who is actually going out and finding players.

 

For me, Xisco looks very strong and brave, and battles for everything. his first touch is very rusty, he's not particularly fast, his movement is ok, isnt the sort to beat players, has a bit of an eye for goal. promising but a long way to go for him.

 

Nacho looked decent when he came on, didnt do enough to make me think he's any better than (or even equal to) Emre, but the fact he tried to make adventurous passes is a plus with a lack of bodies and lack of quality endemic to our squad.

 

I agree with the majority of that but the part in bold is mostly assumption. Now I'm not going to pretend to know what kind of relationship existed between 'the board' and Keegan. I don't know what was agreed or what promises were broken... and neither do you. It's just one word against the other. We don't know what went on it's all opinion.

 

The one fact we can take from it is that the two entities couldn't work together. It took just one transfer window for it to all fall apart. You choose to blame Wise and Llambias but you know no more than I do. It's all hearsay.

 

Now the players that have come in have been good. It's still a little early to tell with Xisco and Gonzalez but they've at least looked promising. I see real cause for optimism in that regard.

 

As the two parties couldn't work together I think it's perfectly reasonable to evaluate what's more important for us as a club. A recruitment system that seems to be delivering the goods or motivation provided by a manager like Keegan.

 

I see the recruitment of talent as a much more long-term and eventually more beneficial to the club. We missed Keegan today, no doubt... and the sooner will fill the void he left, the better - but it shouldn't be at the expense of the setup.

 

it is an assumption but one that seems reasonable based on the facts. all the talk was about us going for Gomis, Keegan went to see him personally and concluded that he wasnt good enough. he also had Bassong in on trial and went for him, and had Zayatte in too, but chose not to pursue him. the earlier signings look like vetere doing the scouting, keegan filtering through his suggestions and getting those he likes, and jiminez sealing the deals. problems arose when the board started doing transfer business without his consent, both in and out - so really it's not that got that much to do with Vetere, the bloke who actually goes out and finds players.

 

as it stands, its too early to judge the signings. Remember people were mightily impressed with Emre early on but for various reasons that was a move that didnt work out. Nacho has played for a few minutes so its ridiculously early to make judgements about him, Xisco was fairly poor but had some positive elements to his game - looks like he needs more time. Guthrie was shit and topped it off with a silly red. Coloccini was hit and miss, sometimes very good, others bullied by the hull attack. the fact we're only missing one of our signings and we still lost suggests we're far, far from the required quality and quantity we need.

[Guest LucaAltieri]

This match has pretty much settles the internal debate for me.

 

Keegan vs. the Ashley setup.

 

There's not a single one of the purchases this summer that look to be bad signings. We haven't broken the bank and we've improved the squad no end. It still may be early to be judging those players but the quality of those brought in seems to be high right from the off.

 

The recruitment system works. Now we just need a manager happy to work within it. If there are no 'big' names willing then do an Arsenal and sign a relatively unknown, promising, young manager/coach.

 

Keegan isn't necessarily in the wrong or the bad guy, but he wants changes that the owner isn't willing to make - and I agree with Ashley in this instance. The recruitment/development setup needs to stay and be built upon.

 

Sorry to break this to you, but Newcastle lost today, man.

 

Vs Hull FFS

 

And only 1 player of the new so called outstanding transfer poilcy was missing today and we couldn't beat Hull? How is that a success?

 

Finding it hard to believe people are still backing Ashley after this shambles that we've witnessed over the last two weeks. Should be fucking ashamed of yourselves backing a bunch of cockney twats over a man that bleeds black and white.

 

Tossers

 

 

 

You're missing the point.

 

Yes, today's result was shite. We've got no manager and the place is full of bad feeling. You only had to see Shay's interview midweek to know that the players aren't exactly looking forward to turning up for training every day.

 

However, the point I'm actually trying to make is that emotions are temporary. Form, both good and bad, is temporary.

 

On the other hand, the players that have been brought in seem to have the required talent. If we can get in that new manager - preferably someone with a track record of bringing on young players - and the club returns to normality then we will see a much better side.

 

It's worth sticking with the current recruitment setup rather than just sacking everyone Keegan doesn't like.

[dcmk]

This match has pretty much settles the internal debate for me.

 

Keegan vs. the Ashley setup.

 

There's not a single one of the purchases this summer that look to be bad signings. We haven't broken the bank and we've improved the squad no end. It still may be early to be judging those players but the quality of those brought in seems to be high right from the off.

 

The recruitment system works. Now we just need a manager happy to work within it. If there are no 'big' names willing then do an Arsenal and sign a relatively unknown, promising, young manager/coach.

 

Keegan isn't necessarily in the wrong or the bad guy, but he wants changes that the owner isn't willing to make - and I agree with Ashley in this instance. The recruitment/development setup needs to stay and be built upon.

 

Sorry to break this to you, but Newcastle lost today, man.

 

Vs Hull FFS

 

And only 1 player of the new so called outstanding transfer poilcy was missing today and we couldn't beat Hull? How is that a success?

 

Finding it hard to believe people are still backing Ashley after this shambles that we've witnessed over the last two weeks. Should be f***ing ashamed of yourselves backing a bunch of cockney twats over a man that bleeds black and white.

 

Tossers

 

 

 

You're missing the point.

 

Yes, today's result was s****. We've got no manager and the place is full of bad feeling. You only had to see Shay's interview midweek to know that the players aren't exactly looking forward to turning for training every day.

 

However, the point I'm actually trying to make is that emotions are temporary. Form, both good and bad, is temporary.

 

On the other hand, the players that have been brought in seem to have the required talent. If we can get in that new manager - preferably someone with a track record of bringing on young players - and the club returns to normality then we will see a much better side.

 

It's worth sticking with the current recruitment setup rather than just sacking everyone Keegan doesn't like.

 

So the new manager wont mind the constant interfering and won't mind being undermined.  That's no way to run a football club.

[Guest Howaythetoon]

Well done Ashley and co, you've broken the players too. Cunts.

 

 

[Dr Venkman]

Think we would have won if we'd started with a 4-4-2 formation with Nacho playing as an attacking midfielder, moving Owen up front and Ameobi to the bench.

Don't understand how we've had so many managers in recent years for NONE of them to see that Ameobi is beyond shite.

 

p.s. N'Zogbia is not a left-back 

 

this. it was a stupid starting line up and i said it as soon as they came on the pitch. how can anyone with eyes start ameobi? as an old jackie said to me on the metro on the way up 'we'd be better off starting with ten'.

 

we really missed beye and jonas today, and the 4-3-3 without martins and viduka is really struggling, add ameobi and a debut youngster and its just not gonna work, owen cant play three positions at once. incidentally i heard quite a lot of praise for owen on the way out 'at least he was trying' etc. seriously, fuck off man, he gives his all week in week out.

 

gonzalez looked promising, just what we need, nice to see a midfielder run with the ball and pass forwards.

 

as others have said, get a good man manager in, someone who's tactically good and i think we're still in for a decent season, providing we can keep most of the first team fit, if we cant i think we're comfortably bottom half.

[juniatmoko]

This match has pretty much settles the internal debate for me.

 

Keegan vs. the Ashley setup.

 

There's not a single one of the purchases this summer that look to be bad signings. We haven't broken the bank and we've improved the squad no end. It still may be early to be judging those players but the quality of those brought in seems to be high right from the off.

 

The recruitment system works. Now we just need a manager happy to work within it. If there are no 'big' names willing then do an Arsenal and sign a relatively unknown, promising, young manager/coach.

 

Keegan isn't necessarily in the wrong or the bad guy, but he wants changes that the owner isn't willing to make - and I agree with Ashley in this instance. The recruitment/development setup needs to stay and be built upon.

 

Sorry to break this to you, but Newcastle lost today, man.

 

Vs Hull FFS

 

And only 1 player of the new so called outstanding transfer poilcy was missing today and we couldn't beat Hull? How is that a success?

 

Finding it hard to believe people are still backing Ashley after this shambles that we've witnessed over the last two weeks. Should be f***ing ashamed of yourselves backing a bunch of cockney twats over a man that bleeds black and white.

 

Tossers

 

 

 

You're missing the point.

 

Yes, today's result was s****. We've got no manager and the place is full of bad feeling. You only had to see Shay's interview midweek to know that the players aren't exactly looking forward to turning for training every day.

 

However, the point I'm actually trying to make is that emotions are temporary. Form, both good and bad, is temporary.

 

On the other hand, the players that have been brought in seem to have the required talent. If we can get in that new manager - preferably someone with a track record of bringing on young players - and the club returns to normality then we will see a much better side.

 

It's worth sticking with the current recruitment setup rather than just sacking everyone Keegan doesn't like.

 

So the new manager wont mind the constant interfering and won't mind being undermined.  That's no way to run a football club.

 

hahaha... agree with you. ditto!

[The Prophet]

Some of the posts are laughable at times.

 

The board has broken the players, fuck off man. Of course they'll have been affected by the massive low the club everyone has, but it is there duty to go out and at least attempt to entertain us, they're paid professionals for fucks sake.

 

I had a feeling this would be a problem and felt the crowd really needed to get behind them, obviously this was not the case. Let down by both parties on this occassion.

[Guest Howaythetoon]

Some of the posts are laughable at times.

 

The board has broken the players, f*** off man. Of course they'll have been affected by the massive low the club everyone has, but it is there duty to go out and at least attempt to entertain us, they're paid professionals for f***s sake.

 

I had a feeling this would be a problem and felt the crowd really needed to get behind them, obviously this was not the case. Let down by both parties on this occassion.

 

The board have forced out the man who got them playing as a team, who instilled belief and confidence back into them, who set them up to have a more positive season as evidenced by the positive start. They obviously enjoyed working for him as a coach and liked him as a man, of course losing him will have a massive impact. Especially when there is no sign of anyone credible coming in and added unrest on the stands. I guarantee several will be eying January for a quick exit while others will fall into the same trap as fans, apathy towards the club and season resulting in piss poor performances and going through the motions. I fucking knew we'd lose today and I couldn't understand any predictions of a win or a decent performance, fan protests or no fan protests. Oh and fans did get behind their team, there is only so much we can do. Don't be one of those cocks that blames the fans.

[BONTEMPI]

This match has pretty much settles the internal debate for me.

 

Keegan vs. the Ashley setup.

 

There's not a single one of the purchases this summer that look to be bad signings. We haven't broken the bank and we've improved the squad no end. It still may be early to be judging those players but the quality of those brought in seems to be high right from the off.

 

The recruitment system works. Now we just need a manager happy to work within it. If there are no 'big' names willing then do an Arsenal and sign a relatively unknown, promising, young manager/coach.

 

Keegan isn't necessarily in the wrong or the bad guy, but he wants changes that the owner isn't willing to make - and I agree with Ashley in this instance. The recruitment/development setup needs to stay and be built upon.

 

Sorry to break this to you, but Newcastle lost today, man.

 

Vs Hull FFS

 

And only 1 player of the new so called outstanding transfer poilcy was missing today and we couldn't beat Hull? How is that a success?

 

Finding it hard to believe people are still backing Ashley after this shambles that we've witnessed over the last two weeks. Should be fucking ashamed of yourselves backing a bunch of cockney twats over a man that bleeds black and white.

 

Tossers

 

 

 

You're missing the point.

 

Yes, today's result was shite. We've got no manager and the place is full of bad feeling. You only had to see Shay's interview midweek to know that the players aren't exactly looking forward to turning up for training every day.

 

However, the point I'm actually trying to make is that emotions are temporary. Form, both good and bad, is temporary.

 

On the other hand, the players that have been brought in seem to have the required talent. If we can get in that new manager - preferably someone with a track record of bringing on young players - and the club returns to normality then we will see a much better side.

 

It's worth sticking with the current recruitment setup rather than just sacking everyone Keegan doesn't like.

 

 

I agree in keeping Vetere as it's quite apparent he's the one that has done these transfers but the rest can go and fuck themselves regarding the general running of the club.

 

These players should have been joined with some high quality proven premiership signings that Keegan was trying to aquire, But either lack of ambition or purposley undermining the manager put a stop to that, and Ashley would have known exactly what was taking place! So all blame lands at the owner in my view.

 

He's burned far too many bridges so the best option for all is a fresh start for the whole club.

[Mick]

Today’s poor performance has vindicated Keegan as far as I'm concerned.

[robbo_11]

I knew there would be a reaction to what has happened, but think the crowd went about it the wrong way. The only time any noise was generated was chants of "He's a dwarf", "We hate cockneys" and "Keegan". I don't think I heard any chants apart from a few "Newcastle" sparingly, but the general atmosphere was poor.

[juniatmoko]

some people here do missing.... the point... where on earth do we can get a great manager to become a happy puppy?

if the board the board still continue this policy. we'll ended extremely just fucked up.

 

PS: i don't talk about just keegan... mean do the kind of capello, lippi, or other great manager want to work for us... if they got this kind transfer policy... mackems.gif just laughable ashley more agree with wise.... do wise already had great CV? mackems.gif

[Guest toonlass]

Our game is Game Of The Day on sky sports

 

I don't think I'll bother, it was shite live, I don't want to see it again!

[BlueStar]

Almost fucking inevitable that result.  Good metaphor for the past week, utter fucking shit with a little glimmer of hope at the end which came to nothing.  I've no fucking idea where we go from here, absolutely no idea.  Is there any point talking about the players?  Xisco looked lost, but that's not particularly surprising.  Ameobi was even worse than I remember him.  Guthrie looked OK but then became an absolute fucking idiot, who exactly are we going to replace him with for 3 games?  Not looking forward to West Ham, only good thing is that the actual match will probably be a drunken blur because I'm going down on the Friday.

[indi]

...

 

I agree with the majority of that but the part in bold is mostly assumption. Now I'm not going to pretend to know what kind of relationship existed between 'the board' and Keegan. I don't know what was agreed or what promises were broken... and neither do you. It's just one word against the other. We don't know what went on it's all opinion.

 

The one fact we can take from it is that the two entities couldn't work together. It took just one transfer window for it to all fall apart. You choose to blame Wise and Llambias but you know no more than I do. It's all hearsay.

 

Now the players that have come in have been good. It's still a little early to tell with Xisco and Gonzalez but they've at least looked promising. I see real cause for optimism in that regard.

 

As the two parties couldn't work together I think it's perfectly reasonable to evaluate what's more important for us as a club. A recruitment system that seems to be delivering the goods or motivation provided by a manager like Keegan.

 

I see the recruitment of talent as a much more long-term and eventually more beneficial to the club. We missed Keegan today, no doubt... and the sooner will fill the void he left, the better - but it shouldn't be at the expense of the setup.

 

it is an assumption but one that seems reasonable based on the facts. all the talk was about us going for Gomis, Keegan went to see him personally and concluded that he wasnt good enough. he also had Bassong in on trial and went for him, and had Zayatte in too, but chose not to pursue him. the earlier signings look like vetere doing the scouting, keegan filtering through his suggestions and getting those he likes, and jiminez sealing the deals. problems arose when the board started doing transfer business without his consent, both in and out - so really it's not that got that much to do with Vetere, the bloke who actually goes out and finds players.

 

as it stands, its too early to judge the signings. Remember people were mightily impressed with Emre early on but for various reasons that was a move that didnt work out. Nacho has played for a few minutes so its ridiculously early to make judgements about him, Xisco was fairly poor but had some positive elements to his game - looks like he needs more time. Guthrie was shit and topped it off with a silly red. Coloccini was hit and miss, sometimes very good, others bullied by the hull attack. the fact we're only missing one of our signings and we still lost suggests we're far, far from the required quality and quantity we need.

 

So it seems that things were going along quite well until a point, which begs the question: why did that change?

 

Most people seem to assume that the board just started doing transfer dealings without Keegan's consent out of spite, deliberately to try and undermine him and force him out of the club. I'm yet to see a convincing argument as to why they would do that?

 

There is an possible argument that they might have done that after Keegan stopped playing ball and started vetoing everyone they tried to bring in, possibly because his "list" wasn't happening for whatever reason. That's a theory based upon rumour and intrigue, just like all the rest of them, but at least it's believable, unlike many of the "Keegan is innocent, he has done no wrong and the board are entirely at fault" type tosh that's being spouted and swallowed by many people.

 

Seems to me that things were working, something stopped them from continuing to work, with the deadline looming the club recognised the need for extra bodies and brought in a couple of players seemingly without Keegan's consent, he walked, the board tried to get him to reconsider and for whatever reason it didn't work.

 

The crux of the matter is what stopped things working and caused the situation to explode into the farce that it has now become? I think that it's pretty obvious that everyone's made mistakes and behaved badly since that happened, but what caused it all to escalate in the first place? My guess is that it'll be both sides' fault and that the people who are heavily heavily pro-Keegan will get quite a rude awakening, that is if they ever do wake up.

[johnnypd]

my guess would be - fighting over limited resouces (in this case transfer funds). a story as old as time.