Kid Icarus Posted February 22, 2023 Share Posted February 22, 2023 Agree with a lot of points there. Re Disney etc, I've made this point before, but if we're supposed to put Newcastle United, the club we've supported our whole lives on equal footing with brands like Disney, Uber, EA in terms of its meaning to us, then that tells its own story about what social and cultural institutions are increasingly viewed as. They're not supposed to be a brand, they're supposed to mean something more than that. They're supposed to be local cultural and social institutions that serve the community without it being just as a means to write off some tax. The over riding point for me is that it's become nigh on impossible to point out something you don't like without someone going 'well what about...?' because the tentacles of capitalism and these investment funds are everywhere and unavoidable. There's not a brand out there that isn't guilty of something. Pointing out that you don't like that situation - where it's impossible to make an ethical individual consumer choice, let alone a collective choice - and that you'd rather it wasn't that way doesn't make you a hypocrite, it means that maybe pointing the finger at each other at all, whether it's as accuser or as hypocrite, isn't a solution. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
et tu brute Posted February 22, 2023 Share Posted February 22, 2023 3 hours ago, Kid Icarus said: You always do that like Fair enough, your choice. Because I can't be arsed going over and over again on something we (or other) don't agree on. Same with the other times, what's the point fucking about going back and forth when it's obvious views are different. I was going to let it go from yesterday, until the sportwashing accuser piped up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solitude20 Posted February 22, 2023 Share Posted February 22, 2023 6 hours ago, Kid Icarus said: Agree with a lot of points there. Re Disney etc, I've made this point before, but if we're supposed to put Newcastle United, the club we've supported our whole lives on equal footing with brands like Disney, Uber, EA in terms of its meaning to us, then that tells its own story about what social and cultural institutions are increasingly viewed as. They're not supposed to be a brand, they're supposed to mean something more than that. They're supposed to be local cultural and social institutions that serve the community without it being just as a means to write off some tax. The over riding point for me is that it's become nigh on impossible to point out something you don't like without someone going 'well what about...?' because the tentacles of capitalism and these investment funds are everywhere and unavoidable. There's not a brand out there that isn't guilty of something. Pointing out that you don't like that situation - where it's impossible to make an ethical individual consumer choice, let alone a collective choice - and that you'd rather it wasn't that way doesn't make you a hypocrite, it means that maybe pointing the finger at each other at all, whether it's as accuser or as hypocrite, isn't a solution. Oh I agreed with your last paragraph in my post. We all have the right to speak up, and we should. My only issue is when our moral standards are called into question if we didn’t take an action (In this case it’s Eddie signing that letter). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted February 23, 2023 Share Posted February 23, 2023 19 hours ago, christ said: Is this a wind up, because I don’t think at any point I claimed Eddie Howe was responsible for what’s going on in Saudi? I said he’s the most prominent spokesperson for any entity owned by Saudi (name me one other individual involved of any of their projects who is in front of the media at least twice a week) so he’s going to catch some flack from those trying to bring to people’s attention what’s going on over there. This is a circular argument where we are all making the same points again and again. You support fans harassing Eddie Howe on account of him being complicit with the Saudi regime. I say that they should shove their letters at Staveley or Al-Rumayyan or some other cogs in the hierarchy. Or better still they could just shove off. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Icarus Posted February 23, 2023 Share Posted February 23, 2023 You seem to keep putting words in his mouth tbh. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
OverThere Posted February 23, 2023 Share Posted February 23, 2023 I don't think Eddie should have to answer anything with regards to Yemen or any other Saudi involvement in the world. He is the manager of the football team and should answer things about football only. His remit is not the geopolitical position of Saudi Arabia. If anyone should be answering questions like that it should be at the ownership/board level of NUFC. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
simonsays Posted February 23, 2023 Share Posted February 23, 2023 Surely the letter should be given to Steve Bruce, seeing as how he got Eddie the job in the first place. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted February 23, 2023 Share Posted February 23, 2023 5 hours ago, Kid Icarus said: You seem to keep putting words in his mouth tbh. "He’s the de facto spokesperson for the Saudi state’s most visible asset. This is a thing that he’s going to have to confront on occasion" These are his words, they seem pretty clear enough, I don't see how I am putting them in his mouth. He's entitled to think it's fine to badger Howe on his role, I just don't agree with him. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Icarus Posted February 23, 2023 Share Posted February 23, 2023 37 minutes ago, TRon said: "He’s the de facto spokesperson for the Saudi state’s most visible asset. This is a thing that he’s going to have to confront on occasion" These are his words, they seem pretty clear enough, I don't see how I am putting them in his mouth. He's entitled to think it's fine to badger Howe on his role, I just don't agree with him. You said he supports Eddie Howe 'being harassed', that he holds Howe responsible for what goes on in Saudi Arabia, and that he thinks Howe taking the job makes him complicit in what goes on there. None of which he's got anywhere close to even implying let alone saying. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted February 23, 2023 Share Posted February 23, 2023 47 minutes ago, Kid Icarus said: You said he supports Eddie Howe 'being harassed', that he holds Howe responsible for what goes on in Saudi Arabia, and that he thinks Howe taking the job makes him complicit in what goes on there. None of which he's got anywhere close to even implying let alone saying. Not sure what else he's saying then. Otherwise why even single out Howe in the first place? These fans think it's a good idea to target Howe for their protests because they believe he is complicit with the Saudi regime. We can argue over exact wording, but ultimately what is they expect from Howe? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Icarus Posted February 23, 2023 Share Posted February 23, 2023 Nothing. And I very much doubt they think he's complicit either. It's a PR stunt to raise public awareness. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abacus Posted February 23, 2023 Share Posted February 23, 2023 4 minutes ago, TRon said: Not sure what else he's saying then. Otherwise why even single out Howe in the first place? These fans think it's a good idea to target Howe for their protests because they believe he is complicit with the Saudi regime. We can argue over exact wording, but ultimately what is they expect from Howe? They probably don't expect anything. They don't think he can change or affect anything. What they want is publicity, and targeting the manager of a club just before their first major final in decades is the way to get it. So yes, it's a publicity stunt more than anything. You can argue that it's personally unfair on Howe (it probably is), but then, they'd argue that what's more unfair is the Saudi regime etc which justifies what they're doing because it gets the attention they want, which might itself cause change. And around and around we go. FWIW, we criticise the mackems for suddenly caring about human rights since the takeover. There's a reverse thing happening with some of our fans where people suddenly feel the need to justify themselves. Not saying that's what these people are doing, but no-one has any responsibility for sorting the world's problems because of which team they support. Personally, I care about human rights in the world just as much or as little as I did before the takeover, and that's my business. As a Newcastle fan all I care about is whether they are good custodians of the club or not. If they aren't (and it's not just about spending money, this), I'll want them gone just as much I wanted rid of Ashley. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Crooks Posted February 23, 2023 Share Posted February 23, 2023 I’ve probs said this before but I’ll say it again - I hate what they’ve done with that Saudi flag third kit like and it makes the managers job harder to keep distance between the team and the geopolitics of it all. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted February 25, 2023 Share Posted February 25, 2023 On 23/02/2023 at 17:10, Kid Icarus said: Nothing. And I very much doubt they think he's complicit either. It's a PR stunt to raise public awareness. Well if that's the way they think is best for their cause crack on with it, but personally I think it will have the opposite effect for the majority of fans. Personally I'm not a fan of PR stunts which try to piggy back on the popularity of a respected football man like Howe. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sampokong Posted February 26, 2023 Share Posted February 26, 2023 Our beloved owners at Trafalgar Square last night Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sampokong Posted February 26, 2023 Share Posted February 26, 2023 (edited) Howe just should ignore them all. Edited February 26, 2023 by sampokong Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hovagod Posted February 26, 2023 Share Posted February 26, 2023 Tory cunts Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NWMag Posted February 27, 2023 Share Posted February 27, 2023 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan Posted February 27, 2023 Share Posted February 27, 2023 25 minutes ago, NWMag said: What a guy 😂 he did this at Atlanta as well didn’t he? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoSelecta Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 I was stood about 30 metres away from that and thought it was the pub landlord (couldn't see him, just heard a southerner on the mic thanking us) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PauloGeordio Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LV Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 We may not. But I love the ambition Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
geordie_b Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 14 hours ago, NWMag said: Careful now... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
80 Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 48 minutes ago, LV said: We may not. But I love the ambition I don't doubt her... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LRD Posted February 28, 2023 Share Posted February 28, 2023 Is that a real quote? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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