Takeover Thread - July 1st statement, Staveley letter to Tracey Crouch (and response) in OP

[Dr.Spaceman]

It would be pretty fucking sweet seeing the likes of Arsenal and Spurs getting spanked every week. Their fans would have a meltdown.

[Dr Jinx]

Scrap the league cup and add 2 more teams to the Premier League.

 

So in year one that could potentially be 5 teams joining the league from the champo.

 

The top 2 in the championship get promoted.

 

Places 3, 4 and 5 go into a play off with the relegated clubs from the PL.

 

And each year after 3 teams get promoted/relegated. Except the play off to 6th is scrapped. 1st and 2nd get promoted. 3rd place goes into a 2 leg game with 20th from the PL

[Guest reefatoon]

Or just leave it alone.

[TRon]

This is an absolute mess and wouldn’t be at all surprised if it was a factor in putting off the likes of PIF from coming back in.

 

Uncertainty basically. Yes they were investing in the club but the club in the top league. You can’t really separate the two.

 

PIF will definitely be keeping an eye on developments. Unless this is nipped in the bud pretty quickly, there won't be buyers coming in for any of the clubs outside of the big 6. I've always understood why clubs want to keep more of the money they generate, but this top 6 cartel stuff is an absolute joke. It should have been shut down already tbh, they will wreck English football.

[Colos Short and Curlies]

Just can't see how a super league would work.  Genuinely think it would die on its arse pretty quickly.

 

People might be excited for a season or two, but a large proportion of non Big Six fans wouldn't watch (I certainly wouldn't - I barely watch the Champions League now) and I think Big Six fans would find it relatively dull after a while.

 

It would be so heavily commercialised that it would make the Champions League's presentation look like a GCSE project.

 

Sponsors printed on the pitch, substitution sponsors, goal music.

 

It would be unwatchable as a sport

[Teasy]

Not sure they'd be begging to rejoin like. A lot of the fans would lose interest because some clubs that dominated or did well in their country would become the dog s*** of the league, but they'd be extremely well compensated for it. The money would be insane. The league we'd be left in would be making f*** all and clubs would be feeling immense strain from that loss of finances. Take the top 5 or 6 out. The rest of of us would be earning Championship money if not less without the draw of the PL.

 

Winning the league would mean f*** all as well. Lets say we won that league, are we champions of England when clubs in Manchester, Liverpool and London are in the super league with some of the worlds best players in their squad? Not a hope, we'd be fake champions of England, the best English teams are in the super league.

 

We didn't earn Championship money when we were in the Championship so no I don't think we would in this situation either.  Other clubs would.  But I think over time things would change.  Fans dwindling from these super league clubs would inevitably mean TV money dwindling in the long term.  While the teams left in a genuine competitive domestic league would slowly grow. Long term I agree they'd want to rejoin.  Just my opinion but I think the entire idea of a super league is flawed and would fail long term

 

I think over 50% of the tv money is for the overseas deals. I have a strong suspicion this is to watch Man U, Liverpool etc.

 

Imho we would see a massive reduction of money in the English game should the top 6 form a European super league.

 

Sadly we’ve created a league where money is all that counts. Even if they were to leave this wouldn’t change that fact it would just lead to an inferior product.

 

Its about 40% of total TV money.  Obviously I agree that kind of reduction in TV money would have a big effect on the English game overall.  But even if we assume the entire revenue from overseas TV disappeared (which I'm sure it wouldn't, just a very large reduction) that would still leave NUFC earning £126m, which is more than some Premier League clubs earn now and about twice what a top Championship club gets.  Basically what I'm saying is some clubs are more reliant on TV money than others and luckily for NUFC (if you even give a shit under current ownership) we're one of the least reliant.  As shown in our Championship seasons when we still came out with more money than some Premier League clubs at the time.

 

Also should be remembered that, as much as they whine, the top 6 clubs received nearly 40% of total TV rights money last season.

[huss9]

with regards to a euro super league - you can make billions but does it matter if nee bugger is going to watch.

not great advertising for their "product" if only 10-20k in stadiums - it's not as if they'll start giving tickets away or even charging just  a tenner.

and what about the away fans? how many games a season will they get to?

[AyeDubbleYoo]

We must be heavily reliant on TV, surely? I know we have a big stadium but our commercial revenue is appalling under Ashley.

[Teasy]

We must be heavily reliant on TV, surely? I know we have a big stadium but our commercial revenue is appalling under Ashley.

 

Every club is heavily reliant on TV money, just a matter of degrees.  If theoretically you completely remove all TV money our revenue would drop from £176m to about £60m (still higher than most Championship clubs total revenue including TV money).  But some current PL clubs would be getting as little as £25m if all TV money was removed (Norwich revenue would drop from £126m to £30m).  Of course as you mention our commercial revenue should, and could be so much higher as well.  With owners who actually want to succeed.

 

Obviously TV money isn't going to disappear, just looking purely at how reliant clubs are on that revenue.

[gjohnson]

Genuine question...

 

Why would anyone pay a monthly fee to Sky/BT/Amazon, just to watch other teams most of the time?

 

I don't, but even if i did I would only watch the Newcastle games, and have no interest in watching a Southampton/West Ham tie, just because it happens to be on. At a push I'd watch a title decider.

 

If greed could be ignored (I know, i know) then surely a good option would be let people buy 'TV season tickets' for their own teams, but still keep the total broadcast revenue evenly distributed whilst allowing every individual match to be ppv. So say you have the TV season ticket for Newcastle, you pay the given subscription, but if you happen to want to watch Man U v Liverpool or whoever, pay a bit more to get that on top.

 

Alternatively just don't give clubs any of the direct TV revenue and let them generate cash purely through attendances, sponsorship, and a share of the income generated by the specific viewership of their match (yes i know full well they'd never agree to this!), and that would encourage genuine ambition rather than relying on x millions just for being in the league. This was would have seen Leicester rewarded paid handsomely for the last few games of their title season, and genuinely reward their achievement, which was never fully appreciated because the weren't  'Big 6''. As loathsome as it is, I'd rather let Sky keep all the cash from broadcasting rights just to make some decent TV.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Teasy]

When I was actually interested in NUFC outside of a potential takeover I did watch every Premier League game that was shown.  I mean NUFC was the only club I gave a shite about, but these other clubs were all competitors so I still enjoyed watching their matches.

[Scoot]

This is an absolute mess and wouldn’t be at all surprised if it was a factor in putting off the likes of PIF from coming back in.

 

Uncertainty basically. Yes they were investing in the club but the club in the top league. You can’t really separate the two.

 

PIF will definitely be keeping an eye on developments. Unless this is nipped in the bud pretty quickly, there won't be buyers coming in for any of the clubs outside of the big 6. I've always understood why clubs want to keep more of the money they generate, but this top 6 cartel stuff is an absolute joke. It should have been shut down already tbh, they will wreck English football.

 

Surely as the whole process started before project big picture starts, theyll have no "official" say in the Saudis owning us?

[TheInfiniteOdyssey]

Scrap the league cup and add 2 more teams to the Premier League.

 

So in year one that could potentially be 5 teams joining the league from the champo.

 

The top 2 in the championship get promoted.

 

Places 3, 4 and 5 go into a play off with the relegated clubs from the PL.

 

And each year after 3 teams get promoted/relegated. Except the play off to 6th is scrapped. 1st and 2nd get promoted. 3rd place goes into a 2 leg game with 20th from the PL

 

Why would any Newcastle fan want the League Cup to be scrapped? It's one of only two trophies we could ever realistically have a chance of winning

[Rosenrot]

Scrap the league cup and add 2 more teams to the Premier League.

 

So in year one that could potentially be 5 teams joining the league from the champo.

 

The top 2 in the championship get promoted.

 

Places 3, 4 and 5 go into a play off with the relegated clubs from the PL.

 

And each year after 3 teams get promoted/relegated. Except the play off to 6th is scrapped. 1st and 2nd get promoted. 3rd place goes into a 2 leg game with 20th from the PL

 

Why would any Newcastle fan want the League Cup to be scrapped? It's one of only two trophies we could ever realistically have a chance of winning

 

Because it's shit.

[wormy]

Scrap the league cup and add 2 more teams to the Premier League.

 

So in year one that could potentially be 5 teams joining the league from the champo.

 

The top 2 in the championship get promoted.

 

Places 3, 4 and 5 go into a play off with the relegated clubs from the PL.

 

And each year after 3 teams get promoted/relegated. Except the play off to 6th is scrapped. 1st and 2nd get promoted. 3rd place goes into a 2 leg game with 20th from the PL

 

Why would any Newcastle fan want the League Cup to be scrapped? It's one of only two trophies we could ever realistically have a chance of winning

 

Because he's proposing a relegation playoff which NUFC would have an even better chance at winning every year.

[gjohnson]

Scrap the league cup and add 2 more teams to the Premier League.

 

So in year one that could potentially be 5 teams joining the league from the champo.

 

The top 2 in the championship get promoted.

 

Places 3, 4 and 5 go into a play off with the relegated clubs from the PL.

 

And each year after 3 teams get promoted/relegated. Except the play off to 6th is scrapped. 1st and 2nd get promoted. 3rd place goes into a 2 leg game with 20th from the PL

 

Why would any Newcastle fan want the League Cup to be scrapped? It's one of only two trophies we could ever realistically have a chance of winning

 

Well only until the quarters/semis when we come up against Arsenal/Man City Reserves and generally get publicly humiliated playing a full strength team who cant string more than one or two passes  against players not considered good enough to play for them most of the time

[r0cafella]

Not sure they'd be begging to rejoin like. A lot of the fans would lose interest because some clubs that dominated or did well in their country would become the dog s*** of the league, but they'd be extremely well compensated for it. The money would be insane. The league we'd be left in would be making f*** all and clubs would be feeling immense strain from that loss of finances. Take the top 5 or 6 out. The rest of of us would be earning Championship money if not less without the draw of the PL.

 

Winning the league would mean f*** all as well. Lets say we won that league, are we champions of England when clubs in Manchester, Liverpool and London are in the super league with some of the worlds best players in their squad? Not a hope, we'd be fake champions of England, the best English teams are in the super league.

 

We didn't earn Championship money when we were in the Championship so no I don't think we would in this situation either.  Other clubs would.  But I think over time things would change.  Fans dwindling from these super league clubs would inevitably mean TV money dwindling in the long term.  While the teams left in a genuine competitive domestic league would slowly grow. Long term I agree they'd want to rejoin.  Just my opinion but I think the entire idea of a super league is flawed and would fail long term

 

I think over 50% of the tv money is for the overseas deals. I have a strong suspicion this is to watch Man U, Liverpool etc.

 

Imho we would see a massive reduction of money in the English game should the top 6 form a European super league.

 

Sadly we’ve created a league where money is all that counts. Even if they were to leave this wouldn’t change that fact it would just lead to an inferior product.

 

Its about 40% of total TV money.  Obviously I agree that kind of reduction in TV money would have a big effect on the English game overall.  But even if we assume the entire revenue from overseas TV disappeared (which I'm sure it wouldn't, just a very large reduction) that would still leave NUFC earning £126m, which is more than some Premier League clubs earn now and about twice what a top Championship club gets.  Basically what I'm saying is some clubs are more reliant on TV money than others and luckily for NUFC (if you even give a s*** under current ownership) we're one of the least reliant.  As shown in our Championship seasons when we still came out with more money than some Premier League clubs at the time.

 

Also should be remembered that, as much as they whine, the top 6 clubs received nearly 40% of total TV rights money last season.

 

On this point, those clubs leaving would also massively devalue the domestic broadcast rights as well.

 

I’m not sure of the numbers but it wouldn’t surprise if those 6 clubs accounted for 30-40% of the total football fanbase of this country.

 

Also, the economic shock of a sudden reduction of income akin to say relegation would create massive solvency issues throughout the remaining clubs.

 

I think, it’s important to remember that football is no longer a sport first, it’s primary function is to generate revenue these days.

[Happinesstan]

Genuine question...

 

Why would anyone pay a monthly fee to Sky/BT/Amazon, just to watch other teams most of the time?

 

I don't, but even if i did I would only watch the Newcastle games, and have no interest in watching a Southampton/West Ham tie, just because it happens to be on. At a push I'd watch a title decider.

 

If greed could be ignored (I know, i know) then surely a good option would be let people buy 'TV season tickets' for their own teams, but still keep the total broadcast revenue evenly distributed whilst allowing every individual match to be ppv. So say you have the TV season ticket for Newcastle, you pay the given subscription, but if you happen to want to watch Man U v Liverpool or whoever, pay a bit more to get that on top.

 

Alternatively just don't give clubs any of the direct TV revenue and let them generate cash purely through attendances, sponsorship, and a share of the income generated by the specific viewership of their match (yes i know full well they'd never agree to this!), and that would encourage genuine ambition rather than relying on x millions just for being in the league. This was would have seen Leicester rewarded paid handsomely for the last few games of their title season, and genuinely reward their achievement, which was never fully appreciated because the weren't  'Big 6''. As loathsome as it is, I'd rather let Sky keep all the cash from broadcasting rights just to make some decent TV.

 

By advertising hundreds of games, £60 per month comes over as a real deal, even if most games aren't watched. 38 games for £60 per month is not a good deal. The added costs of advertising each channel individually, the added commentary teams and pundits.

 

The 20 clubs currently promote the brands of the PL, FA, and the broadcasters. None of them are going to reverse that relationship.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

I’ve said before I’d love something like NBA/MLB have where you can watch every game and follow your own team. They do black it out for home games mind, so people in Newcastle wouldn’t be able to watch Newcastle home games. Without that it would be perfect, but obvs the worry is it would affect attendances and attendances for lower league clubs.

[Shearergol]

I’ve said before I’d love something like NBA/MLB have where you can watch every game and follow your own team. They do black it out for home games mind, so people in Newcastle wouldn’t be able to watch Newcastle home games. Without that it would be perfect, but obvs the worry is it would affect attendances and attendances for lower league clubs.

 

The lucky ones.

[madras]

Not sure they'd be begging to rejoin like. A lot of the fans would lose interest because some clubs that dominated or did well in their country would become the dog s*** of the league, but they'd be extremely well compensated for it. The money would be insane. The league we'd be left in would be making f*** all and clubs would be feeling immense strain from that loss of finances. Take the top 5 or 6 out. The rest of of us would be earning Championship money if not less without the draw of the PL.

 

Winning the league would mean f*** all as well. Lets say we won that league, are we champions of England when clubs in Manchester, Liverpool and London are in the super league with some of the worlds best players in their squad? Not a hope, we'd be fake champions of England, the best English teams are in the super league.

 

Good post, I agree with Decky here.

 

It maybe ok for those who want to see football return to a pre premier league era but Southampton vs West ham being a big game in said hypothetically situation doesn’t exactly get pulses racing.

Theyd be well compensated for so long till that leagues now bigger teams say "its us the public want to watch, those at the top not you" and then cut them off.

 

As for Southampton West  Ham not setting pulses racing. Neither would a mid table clash between Spurs and Marseilles in a league I have no interest in.

[Happinesstan]

Not sure they'd be begging to rejoin like. A lot of the fans would lose interest because some clubs that dominated or did well in their country would become the dog s*** of the league, but they'd be extremely well compensated for it. The money would be insane. The league we'd be left in would be making f*** all and clubs would be feeling immense strain from that loss of finances. Take the top 5 or 6 out. The rest of of us would be earning Championship money if not less without the draw of the PL.

 

Winning the league would mean f*** all as well. Lets say we won that league, are we champions of England when clubs in Manchester, Liverpool and London are in the super league with some of the worlds best players in their squad? Not a hope, we'd be fake champions of England, the best English teams are in the super league.

 

Good post, I agree with Decky here.

 

It maybe ok for those who want to see football return to a pre premier league era but Southampton vs West ham being a big game in said hypothetically situation doesn’t exactly get pulses racing.

Theyd be well compensated for so long till that leagues now bigger teams say "its us the public want to watch, those at the top not you" and then cut them off.

 

As for Southampton West  Ham not setting pulses racing. Neither would a mid table clash between Spurs and Marseilles in a league I have no interest in.

 

Not even for the Chris Waddle montage?

[Chris_R]

Scrap the league cup and add 2 more teams to the Premier League.

 

So in year one that could potentially be 5 teams joining the league from the champo.

 

The top 2 in the championship get promoted.

 

Places 3, 4 and 5 go into a play off with the relegated clubs from the PL.

 

And each year after 3 teams get promoted/relegated. Except the play off to 6th is scrapped. 1st and 2nd get promoted. 3rd place goes into a 2 leg game with 20th from the PL

 

Why would any Newcastle fan want the League Cup to be scrapped? It's one of only two trophies we could ever realistically have a chance of winning

 

Because it's shit.

 

It's not as good as the FA Cup, sure, but it's 50% of the trophies we're able to win. Probably more than 50% in that big teams tend to play weakened teams in it so we've got an even better chance. "Better" being relative, obviously.

[TRon]

This is an absolute mess and wouldn’t be at all surprised if it was a factor in putting off the likes of PIF from coming back in.

 

Uncertainty basically. Yes they were investing in the club but the club in the top league. You can’t really separate the two.

 

PIF will definitely be keeping an eye on developments. Unless this is nipped in the bud pretty quickly, there won't be buyers coming in for any of the clubs outside of the big 6. I've always understood why clubs want to keep more of the money they generate, but this top 6 cartel stuff is an absolute joke. It should have been shut down already tbh, they will wreck English football.

 

Surely as the whole process started before project big picture starts, theyll have no "official" say in the Saudis owning us?

 

I was thinking more from the Saudi side. Would they still want to buy us if we are going to be permanently handicapped for future success?

 

 

[LFEE]

This is an absolute mess and wouldn’t be at all surprised if it was a factor in putting off the likes of PIF from coming back in.

 

Uncertainty basically. Yes they were investing in the club but the club in the top league. You can’t really separate the two.

 

PIF will definitely be keeping an eye on developments. Unless this is nipped in the bud pretty quickly, there won't be buyers coming in for any of the clubs outside of the big 6. I've always understood why clubs want to keep more of the money they generate, but this top 6 cartel stuff is an absolute joke. It should have been shut down already tbh, they will wreck English football.

 

Busy in court today...