Success at what cost?

[triggs]

The point by Josh Turnbull is ridiculous mind. The Premier League don't give a shit about the Saudis murdering, etc.

[Guest NobbyOhNobby]

That's a pretty fucking awful comment from the chair of NUST though. He's basically said that as long as they're nice to us it doesn't matter what they do elsewhere. In his position, as an elected fan representative, that's really poor and shows a real lack of awareness

[triggs]

Don't think Glendenning said anything that bad there. Nothing we haven't said on here loads of times with regard to how poor the protests were normally

[WarrenBartonCentrePartin]

Don't think Glendenning said anything that bad there. Nothing we haven't said on here loads of times with regard to how poor the protests were normally

 

What are we, as a collective fanbase, to blame for? Saudis buying the club? The comments of one individual? Hacking a journalist to bits with a bone saw?

 

The bloke's a cretin.

[triggs]

Don't think Glendenning said anything that bad there. Nothing we haven't said on here loads of times with regard to how poor the protests were normally

 

What are we, as a collective fanbase, to blame for? Saudis buying the club? The comments of one individual? Hacking a journalist to bits with a bone saw?

 

The bloke's a cretin.

 

He didn't say that we were to blame for that

[AyeDubbleYoo]

What are we to blame for?

[Happinesstan]

Not sure what "blame" we can't easily absolve ourselves from? Bit lost at what point the mackem is making. 

 

(Original tweet is him questioning the chair of NUST saying "The involvement of Saudi Arabian wealth in the takeover is not a concern right now")

 

 

Ashley passed. Just sayin'.

[manorpark]

 

Tbf, Newcastle has a history as good as anywhere on particularly the fight against racism

 

 

Very much so, Newcastle as a City has a very proud record of fighting against racism, as is revealed in Brian Ward’s 2017 book "Martin Luther King in Newcastle upon Tyne" about the African American Freedom Struggle and Race Relations in the North East of England.

 

This great book formed the foundation of Newcastle’s Freedom City 2017 celebrations – a city-wide event marking the 50th anniversary of Dr King’s visit and the region’s extensive connections with the African American freedom struggle.

 

http://freedomcity2017.com/

 

https://www.northumbria.ac.uk/about-us/news-events/news/martin-luther-king-newcastle-visit-remembered-on-anniversary-of-his-birth/

 

 

 

[madras]

 

Tbf, Newcastle has a history as good as anywhere on particularly the fight against racism

 

 

Very much so, Newcastle as a City has a very proud record of fighting against racism, as is revealed in Brian Ward’s 2017 book "Martin Luther King in Newcastle upon Tyne" about the African American Freedom Struggle and Race Relations in the North East of England.

 

This great book formed the foundation of Newcastle’s Freedom City 2017 celebrations – a city-wide event marking the 50th anniversary of Dr King’s visit and the region’s extensive connections with the African American freedom struggle.

 

http://freedomcity2017.com/

 

https://www.northumbria.ac.uk/about-us/news-events/news/martin-luther-king-newcastle-visit-remembered-on-anniversary-of-his-birth/

 

 

 

Also...

 

  https://libcom.org/library/trouble-tyne-fight-against-blackshirts-north-east     

[St1pe]

One of the most annoying things to come out of all this is journalists using the "you think Ashley was reprehensible, this lot are on a whole other level!" argument. The hatred for Ashley stems from the absolutely shameful way he, often deliberately, mismanaged the club, not his other misdemeanours. Had he approached things in the correct way there would never have been calls for his head (pardon the pun), regardless of how disgraceful the conditions were for workers in his tat warehouses. We all know that.

 

My overall take on this is that we as fans should enjoy the ride we look set to go on, whilst refraining from fawning over the Saudi royal family as our wonderful saviours. We form the bottom rung on this f***ed-up ladder and there's very little that we can do that would affect matters. Be mindful of where the investment is coming from by all means, and don't fly the Saudi flag in your social media names like some weird obsessive teenagers, but don't feel guilty for supporting your club. We've waited a very long time for this.

 

This wholeheartedly

 

I’ve been at odds with my own opinion on this issue but this nails it. Good post NEEJ[/member]

[Tiresias]

Also if Mike Ashley was ruler of a country he'd totally go full kim jong un

[jdckelly]

Our government don't think the Saudis are 'decent guys' at all. They know how awful their regime is, but they turn a blind eye and sell them weapons, which is arguably much worse.

sad thing is it really doesnt matter who's in the government of whatever country in the uks case torys or labour they still treat the likes of SA the same because they're useful with the oil.

[Collage]

Didn’t know Glendenning was a mackem

[Dokko]

The more I think of this the more I feel uneasy about it. I thought it was worth knowing a bit more about our bedfellows and tbh, it’s not great. I’m sure people have a greater depth on what has happened over time so won’t go there, but what I have read there isn’t any excusing and doesn’t sit well with me.

 

I really don’t know how I feel now. I’ve been desperate for so long for Ashley to leave and to have proper financial backing it has been anyone but Ashley, but now that’s happened I just wish it was someone else. RB & Staveley only would be great, and build up at a slower pace. But we don’t have a choice in who owns us, just what we as fans do next.

 

Can I tell myself PIF is not the royal family and is slightly removed? Can I hope no more atrocities and a new dawn for us and SA forgetting the past? Can I tell myself football shouldn’t have to deal with politics and not my problem? Do I hope they fail the test? Do I walk away?

 

I think the euphoria of getting rid of Ashley overlooked everything for some time. I was hoping to see what happens next before making a decision, now I just feel a little sick at the thought and guilty for still wanting more from the club.

 

 

[HawK]

Support the team, not the regime pal, worked for the 'pro-Ashley' brigade at least

[TRon]

The more I think of this the more I feel uneasy about it. I thought it was worth knowing a bit more about our bedfellows and tbh, it’s not great. I’m sure people have a greater depth on what has happened over time so won’t go there, but what I have read there isn’t any excusing and doesn’t sit well with me.

 

I really don’t know how I feel now. I’ve been desperate for so long for Ashley to leave and to have proper financial backing it has been anyone but Ashley, but now that’s happened I just wish it was someone else. RB & Staveley only would be great, and build up at a slower pace. But we don’t have a choice in who owns us, just what we as fans do next.

 

Can I tell myself PIF is not the royal family and is slightly removed? Can I hope no more atrocities and a new dawn for us and SA forgetting the past? Can I tell myself football shouldn’t have to deal with politics and not my problem? Do I hope they fail the test? Do I walk away?

 

I think the euphoria of getting rid of Ashley overlooked everything for some time. I was hoping to see what happens next before making a decision, now I just feel a little sick at the thought and guilty for still wanting more from the club.

 

 

 

I would tell myself, thank god they chose us. Probably the only buyers around in this market, football is up in the air at the moment, we don't even know when or if next season will kick off. These are probably the only buyers who would have pushed through with a deal, everyone else has probably run a mile. So when you wish it was someone else, truth is there is no one else. Either make peace with it, or maybe come to the conclusion Ashley wasn't so bad after all.

[Guest neesy111]

The more I think of this the more I feel uneasy about it. I thought it was worth knowing a bit more about our bedfellows and tbh, it’s not great. I’m sure people have a greater depth on what has happened over time so won’t go there, but what I have read there isn’t any excusing and doesn’t sit well with me.

 

I really don’t know how I feel now. I’ve been desperate for so long for Ashley to leave and to have proper financial backing it has been anyone but Ashley, but now that’s happened I just wish it was someone else. RB & Staveley only would be great, and build up at a slower pace. But we don’t have a choice in who owns us, just what we as fans do next.

 

Can I tell myself PIF is not the royal family and is slightly removed? Can I hope no more atrocities and a new dawn for us and SA forgetting the past? Can I tell myself football shouldn’t have to deal with politics and not my problem? Do I hope they fail the test? Do I walk away?

 

I think the euphoria of getting rid of Ashley overlooked everything for some time. I was hoping to see what happens next before making a decision, now I just feel a little sick at the thought and guilty for still wanting more from the club.

 

 

 

I would tell myself, thank god they chose us. Probably the only buyers around in this market, football is up in the air at the moment, we don't even know when or if next season will kick off. These are probably the only buyers who would have pushed through with a deal, everyone else has probably run a mile. So when you wish it was someone else, truth is there is no one else. Either make peace with it, or maybe come to the conclusion Ashley wasn't so bad after all.

 

That last point is ridiculous.  You can come to dozens of conclusions.

[Guest NobbyOhNobby]

I just really wish our fans, en masse, could give up on the 'whataboutery' and go into this with their eyes open.

 

Yes, we have no say over who our owners are.

 

Yes, it'll be great if we can enjoy supporting our club again.

 

However, just admit the fact that a lot of people justifiably have reservations about who our owners will be. Don't feel it necessary to argue the point or make pointless comparisons to either make yourself feel better or convince the world not to have reservations about who is buying us.

 

"Oh, but do you get Ubers? Or have you ever been in a vehicle that uses oil?" Bullshit and pointless arguments.

 

"Oh, but there are bad people who have bought other clubs!" Aye, there are, but we're about to be purchased by a kingdom who execute LGBTQ+ people and any peaceful activists contra the Kingdom. That's not to mention the more often mentioned journalist murdering, Yemen bombing and general suppression of women.

 

I just want people to stop trying to justify this. Open your eyes. We all want rid of Ashley, but just accept that those buying us deserve scrutiny and, the more our fans continue to justify or provide stupid counter-arguments, the more we as a fanbase deserve scrutiny as well.

 

 

 

 

 

[Kid Icarus]

[TRon]

The more I think of this the more I feel uneasy about it. I thought it was worth knowing a bit more about our bedfellows and tbh, it’s not great. I’m sure people have a greater depth on what has happened over time so won’t go there, but what I have read there isn’t any excusing and doesn’t sit well with me.

 

I really don’t know how I feel now. I’ve been desperate for so long for Ashley to leave and to have proper financial backing it has been anyone but Ashley, but now that’s happened I just wish it was someone else. RB & Staveley only would be great, and build up at a slower pace. But we don’t have a choice in who owns us, just what we as fans do next.

 

Can I tell myself PIF is not the royal family and is slightly removed? Can I hope no more atrocities and a new dawn for us and SA forgetting the past? Can I tell myself football shouldn’t have to deal with politics and not my problem? Do I hope they fail the test? Do I walk away?

 

I think the euphoria of getting rid of Ashley overlooked everything for some time. I was hoping to see what happens next before making a decision, now I just feel a little sick at the thought and guilty for still wanting more from the club.

 

 

 

I would tell myself, thank god they chose us. Probably the only buyers around in this market, football is up in the air at the moment, we don't even know when or if next season will kick off. These are probably the only buyers who would have pushed through with a deal, everyone else has probably run a mile. So when you wish it was someone else, truth is there is no one else. Either make peace with it, or maybe come to the conclusion Ashley wasn't so bad after all.

 

That last point is ridiculous.  You can come to dozens of conclusions.

 

Yes but I said "maybe" come to that conclusion, you could always pick one of the other dozens if you prefer. But the central point remains, that there aren't going to be many buyers of football clubs in the present climate, it was probably only ever going to be a state backed investment group that would have taken the plunge. Whether you count that as good fortune or bad will depend on you, but Dokko was saying he wished it was someone else....how likely was that in the current world climate?

 

 

[triggs]

I just really wish our fans, en masse, could give up on the 'whataboutery' and go into this with their eyes open.

 

Yes, we have no say over who our owners are.

 

Yes, it'll be great if we can enjoy supporting our club again.

 

However, just admit the fact that a lot of people justifiably have reservations about who our owners will be. Don't feel it necessary to argue the point or make pointless comparisons to either make yourself feel better or convince the world not to have reservations about who is buying us.

 

"Oh, but do you get Ubers? Or have you ever been in a vehicle that uses oil?" Bullshit and pointless arguments.

 

"Oh, but there are bad people who have bought other clubs!" Aye, there are, but we're about to be purchased by a kingdom who execute LGBTQ+ people and any peaceful activists contra the Kingdom. That's not to mention the more often mentioned journalist murdering, Yemen bombing and general suppression of women.

 

I just want people to stop trying to justify this. Open your eyes. We all want rid of Ashley, but just accept that those buying us deserve scrutiny and, the more our fans continue to justify or provide stupid counter-arguments, the more we as a fanbase deserve scrutiny as well.

 

Brilliant post

[AyeDubbleYoo]

Yeah exactly, nobody needs to excuse what Saudi Arabia are into. If they improve in future, so much the better.

[Si]

I just really wish our fans, en masse, could give up on the 'whataboutery' and go into this with their eyes open.

 

Yes, we have no say over who our owners are.

 

Yes, it'll be great if we can enjoy supporting our club again.

 

However, just admit the fact that a lot of people justifiably have reservations about who our owners will be. Don't feel it necessary to argue the point or make pointless comparisons to either make yourself feel better or convince the world not to have reservations about who is buying us.

 

"Oh, but do you get Ubers? Or have you ever been in a vehicle that uses oil?" Bullshit and pointless arguments.

 

"Oh, but there are bad people who have bought other clubs!" Aye, there are, but we're about to be purchased by a kingdom who execute LGBTQ+ people and any peaceful activists contra the Kingdom. That's not to mention the more often mentioned journalist murdering, Yemen bombing and general suppression of women.

 

I just want people to stop trying to justify this. Open your eyes. We all want rid of Ashley, but just accept that those buying us deserve scrutiny and, the more our fans continue to justify or provide stupid counter-arguments, the more we as a fanbase deserve scrutiny as well.

 

Brilliant post

agreed.

[Hughesy]

I just really wish our fans, en masse, could give up on the 'whataboutery' and go into this with their eyes open.

 

Yes, we have no say over who our owners are.

 

Yes, it'll be great if we can enjoy supporting our club again.

 

However, just admit the fact that a lot of people justifiably have reservations about who our owners will be. Don't feel it necessary to argue the point or make pointless comparisons to either make yourself feel better or convince the world not to have reservations about who is buying us.

 

"Oh, but do you get Ubers? Or have you ever been in a vehicle that uses oil?" Bullshit and pointless arguments.

 

"Oh, but there are bad people who have bought other clubs!" Aye, there are, but we're about to be purchased by a kingdom who execute LGBTQ+ people and any peaceful activists contra the Kingdom. That's not to mention the more often mentioned journalist murdering, Yemen bombing and general suppression of women.

 

I just want people to stop trying to justify this. Open your eyes. We all want rid of Ashley, but just accept that those buying us deserve scrutiny and, the more our fans continue to justify or provide stupid counter-arguments, the more we as a fanbase deserve scrutiny as well.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Great post.  Only quibble is that I'm getting fed up of the term "whataboutery".  I understand that whataboutery can deflect from the underlying issues, but pointing out inconsistencies in people's analysis of a situation doesn't seem to me to irrelevant, yet now always appears to be dismissed as such.

[Greg]

I just really wish our fans, en masse, could give up on the 'whataboutery' and go into this with their eyes open.

 

Yes, we have no say over who our owners are.

 

Yes, it'll be great if we can enjoy supporting our club again.

 

However, just admit the fact that a lot of people justifiably have reservations about who our owners will be. Don't feel it necessary to argue the point or make pointless comparisons to either make yourself feel better or convince the world not to have reservations about who is buying us.

 

"Oh, but do you get Ubers? Or have you ever been in a vehicle that uses oil?" Bullshit and pointless arguments.

 

"Oh, but there are bad people who have bought other clubs!" Aye, there are, but we're about to be purchased by a kingdom who execute LGBTQ+ people and any peaceful activists contra the Kingdom. That's not to mention the more often mentioned journalist murdering, Yemen bombing and general suppression of women.

 

I just want people to stop trying to justify this. Open your eyes. We all want rid of Ashley, but just accept that those buying us deserve scrutiny and, the more our fans continue to justify or provide stupid counter-arguments, the more we as a fanbase deserve scrutiny as well.