gjohnson Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Kanji said: Paris should absolutely win the CL with that team. Frightening attack, there will always be space for 1-2 of their attackers. Wijnaldum will add a ton to their midfield, Ramos will provide some much needed leadership and steel back there and they have the best Gk in the world now. With the players they have they should have dominated for the last few seasons. Simple fact is that their league doesn't keep them challenged enough to be sharp when the important CL matches come around Exactly the same reason that Rangers and Celtic never make it past the first rounds of European competition. Edited August 11, 2021 by gjohnson Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 Yeah that's definitely the reason. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
triggs Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 (edited) 7 minutes ago, gjohnson said: With the players they have they should have dominated for the last few seasons. Simple fact is that their league doesn't keep them challenged enough to be sharp when the important CL matches come around Exactly the same reason that Rangers and Celtic never make it past the first rounds of European competition. Nah, the reason they haven't won the CL is because they've been really limited in some positions. Does that Bakker bloke that played for them last season even get in the Dutch squad? Gueye and Herrera are nothing special either. They've finally actually tried to build a team this summer though it looks like with Hakimi, Wijnaldum, Ramos and obviously Messi. They should win the CL with the team they have but you cannot win the CL these days with 3 attackers that have no interest in pressing or tracking back. Bayern/Liverpool will just overrun them Edited August 11, 2021 by triggs Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Consortium of one Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 Read this morning that PSG will be looking to shift 10 players to balance the books. i had forgotten about some of the guys they are looking to move. It's like they fell into a black hole or something. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ponsaelius Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, SEMTEX said: I guess we'll quickly find out if Messi hates him or not. He actually does. Messi is good pals with Maxi Lopez, who's wife Wanda left him for Icardi. That's why Icardi never got near the national team for ages. Indeed still doesn't. Edited August 11, 2021 by ponsaelius Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmojorisin75 Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 38 minutes ago, triggs said: They should win the CL with the team they have but you cannot win the CL these days with 3 attackers that have no interest in pressing or tracking back. Bayern/Liverpool will just overrun them This basically yeah. Poch gonna have to play 3 responsible midfielders I reckon, such as Wijnaldum, Paredes & Verratti and hope they can get enough support from the FB positions & one midfielder. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rgk_lfc Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, Wullie said: Bayern Munich have won the Bundesliga in all of the last 9 seasons. In only 1 of those seasons was the points gap less than 10 points. It is an absolute procession for Bayern every single year, no less than PSG, who have at least fucked things up to come second twice in the same period. I think the "no competition to test themselves against" thing is increasingly offset against, in England at least, by the sheer number of competitive games played. Bayern won the Bundesliga 6 or 7 times in from 2000-2010. Then Klopp's Dortmund came about and shocked the system. Bayern had lost the Bundesliga before but most of the clubs who won it looked like a one-time event. Dortmund was different though. Their challenge looked sustainable. The premise is that it shocked Bayern into action and dialed up their ruthlessness to a whole new level which heralded this new age of domination. Edited August 11, 2021 by rgk_lfc Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rgk_lfc Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 46 minutes ago, triggs said: Nah, the reason they haven't won the CL is because they've been really limited in some positions. Does that Bakker bloke that played for them last season even get in the Dutch squad? Gueye and Herrera are nothing special either. They've finally actually tried to build a team this summer though it looks like with Hakimi, Wijnaldum, Ramos and obviously Messi. They should win the CL with the team they have but you cannot win the CL these days with 3 attackers that have no interest in pressing or tracking back. Bayern/Liverpool will just overrun them You also need a decent amount of luck to win the CL. I think PSG have been unlucky in the past to injuries to key players like Neymar. Rafa's 2008-2009 Liverpool was an order of magnitude better than the 2005 team which won the CL. Chelsea's team which won the CL in 2011 or 2012 wasnt as good as the Chelsea team of 2005-2010. Best team doesnt win in most of the cases. Which is why the achievement of Zidane's Madrid is so impressive. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 3 minutes ago, rgk_lfc said: Bayern won the Bundesliga 6 or 7 times in from 2000-2010. Then Klopp's Dortmund came about and shocked the system. Bayern had lost the Bundesliga before but most of the clubs who won it looked like a one-time event. Dortmund was different though. Their challenge looked sustainable. The premise is that it shocked Bayern into action and dialed up their ruthlessness to a whole new level which heralded this new age of domination. What's that got to do with Bayern's players still managing to be competitive in the Champions League despite easy league campaigns every year? I don't see the connection. Pretty sure Joshua Kimmich doesn't have his mind on the 2011 Dortmund side as some sort of motivation. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ponsaelius Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 (edited) I think there's an argument that, despite their dominance, Bundesliga games are generally more competitive than Ligue 1. Not sure I agree mind. Ligue 1 is generally pretty underrated in terms of standard, while Bundesliga is probably slightly overrated. Edited August 11, 2021 by ponsaelius Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ponsaelius Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 Ligue 1 produces players that have made France world champions and have ridiculous depth. They also supply half of Africa with their national teams for those that aren't good enough for Les Bleus. Even if players are constantly leaving the league, which is unfortunately the case, there's a constant churn of new domestic talent coming through. PSG have had a super team for a decade and have still been beaten to the title twice now. I say this as somebody who finds it really hard to generate an interest in French football, too. But to be honest that's rarely down to the talent and quality of the teams. It's more down to the lack of cultural cache I have attached with the clubs - which I just don't find interesting. Which I think stems from a lack of historic exposure in the UK, and a lack of historic success in Europe (Ligue's track record in winning European trophies is atrocious). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 4 minutes ago, ponsaelius said: I think there's an argument that, despite their dominance, Bundesliga games are generally more competitive than Ligue 1. Not sure I agree mind. Ligue 1 is generally pretty underrated in terms of standard, while Bundesliga is probably slightly overrated. Definitely easier to score goals in Germany generally, it's so open. Not uncommon for Bayern to be 2-0 down at HT and win 5-2. Last season they went through a run where they conceded the first goal for 8 Bundesliga games in a row and they didn't lose a single one of those games. Just so easy for them to step it up offensively against Bundesliga defences. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Jinx Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 PSG were close last season, ultimately what let them down was indiscipline, despite City going behind they put it up to them and they didn’t like it one bit. Couldn’t cope with adversity, when all was needed was cool heads to keep hold of their lead. Midfield wasn’t their problem, nor was up front, it was at the back. Ramos is not the answer to that particular problem. Messi will bring a calmness up front but it’s still only papering over cracks that haven’t been fixed, imho.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SEMTEX Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 36 minutes ago, ponsaelius said: I say this as somebody who finds it really hard to generate an interest in French football, too. But to be honest that's rarely down to the talent and quality of the teams. It's more down to the lack of cultural cache I have attached with the clubs - which I just don't find interesting. Which I think stems from a lack of historic exposure in the UK, and a lack of historic success in Europe (Ligue's track record in winning European trophies is atrocious). I think this is an interesting discussion point. Personally, I find myself much more interested in the Italian league than any other foreign league. I don't really understand why. I suppose due to the historical cache of several clubs in Serie A, combined with my age. With the league seemingly peaking in at a time when I was paying the most attention, and of course James Richardson's gelatos certainly helped. The fact there are several teams of interest always made it seem more competitive too. Hopefully the decade of Juventus pissing the league are a thing of the past, but it doesn't sound like it given the debacle at Inter. Might give it a genuine go this year. I think I'll need to arbitrarily pick a club to support. Ideally one that I could be bothered to visit some day. I always had Roma kits as a yoot, but they seem uninspiring plus Mourinho Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SEMTEX Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 34 minutes ago, Dr Jinx said: PSG were close last season, ultimately what let them down was indiscipline, despite City going behind they put it up to them and they didn’t like it one bit. Couldn’t cope with adversity, when all was needed was cool heads to keep hold of their lead. Midfield wasn’t their problem, nor was up front, it was at the back. Ramos is not the answer to that particular problem. Messi will bring a calmness up front but it’s still only papering over cracks that haven’t been fixed, imho.. If they don't have the management in place to deal with all these bellends, I don't think that any trophies are a given. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tgarve Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 Would argue the french league is better than la liga now Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rgk_lfc Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 1 hour ago, Wullie said: What's that got to do with Bayern's players still managing to be competitive in the Champions League despite easy league campaigns every year? I don't see the connection. Pretty sure Joshua Kimmich doesn't have his mind on the 2011 Dortmund side as some sort of motivation. I am not saying that is the only reason. That is why I qualified my post with "Not quite sure I ascribe to that but I can understand their point." I am not saying Kimmich is playing at a higher level fueled by the threat posed by the 2011-2012 Dortmund team. But at the same time, I can understand how the extra competition within the league gave them the jolt which helped them move to the next level. I don't mean just the players, the background operation, scouting etc. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeyt Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 Arsenal's hard on for Ramsdale is odd Should have kept Martinez Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ponsaelius Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, SEMTEX said: I think this is an interesting discussion point. Personally, I find myself much more interested in the Italian league than any other foreign league. I don't really understand why. I suppose due to the historical cache of several clubs in Serie A, combined with my age. With the league seemingly peaking in at a time when I was paying the most attention, and of course James Richardson's gelatos certainly helped. The fact there are several teams of interest always made it seem more competitive too. Hopefully the decade of Juventus pissing the league are a thing of the past, but it doesn't sound like it given the debacle at Inter. Might give it a genuine go this year. I think I'll need to arbitrarily pick a club to support. Ideally one that I could be bothered to visit some day. I always had Roma kits as a yoot, but they seem uninspiring plus Mourinho Even as Serie A fell well behind La Liga and arguably also Bundesliga in terms of quality over the last 15 years, I have still always much preferred it. I think much of it is how football reflects society, history and culture. It sounds terrible but the bitter intensity of the local/regional rivalries, the history of corruption and outright mistrust of officials, the 'problematic' ultra culture, the decaying stadia (a direct result of glacial bureaucracy) - all of that contributes to the interest from my point of view. For a lot of people it turns them off - especially when it has all definitely contributed to a drop in quality on the pitch. If you were to ask me how I wanted English football to be run then the Bundesliga would probably be the model I'd point to. Fan ownership and direct involvement, amazing stadiums and infrastructure, great full capacity attendances, 'nice' fan culture with 'good' politics, great youth academies. Yet for some reason I find the Bundesliga boring to follow from afar... go figure. Edited August 11, 2021 by ponsaelius Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 Vestergaard to Leicester Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeyt Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 Such a slow defence for Leicester Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmojorisin75 Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 30 minutes ago, Disco said: Vestergaard to Leicester Southampton apparently don't give af this year Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 48 minutes ago, mrmojorisin75 said: Southampton apparently don't give af this year Another reason why Bruce is a lucky lucky man and will survive another season Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astroblack Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 1 hour ago, joeyt said: Such a slow defence for Leicester Is Fofana slow? Thought he looks a real Rolls Royce of a defender. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeyt Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 He's injured. If they get vestergaard to play alongside soyuncu and/or Evans that is slow Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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