Yorkie Posted September 5, 2022 Share Posted September 5, 2022 1 hour ago, Pata said: I think the crying about offsides is largely irrelevant and naive. @Yorkie wants to draw the line (pun not intended) on attacker getting unfair advantage but where do you draw the line there? It would only become way more messy than it is right now and the arguments would move on to subjective matters which VAR already struggles mightily with. It’s irritating to be in offside by a toenail but human eye can’t make the calls in real time and I don’t see any other option. I really hope the new technology works as it should as on paper it sounds really good. "Crying." Any need for that sort of condescending shite? That wasn't what I was saying anyway. I'm not making suggestions as to how it's application should be altered; I'm calling for VAR not to be used at all for offsides. I think the use of VAR has, without justification, changed the nature of offside. It used to exist to prevent unfair advantages; the human eye should be able to spot those and a century of evidence supports that the idea that it usually can. Offside in a VAR world exists not to prevent unfair advantages but neuter the concept of a striker playing on the shoulder, among other things. I just don't think it's necessary at all and I'd have so much time for the whole thing if that aspect of it was jettisoned and the responsibility given back to the linesman. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pata Posted September 5, 2022 Share Posted September 5, 2022 1 minute ago, Yorkie said: "Crying." Any need for that sort of condescending shite? That wasn't directed at you? The justification is that officiating had been terrible and something had to be done. I'm not even blaming linesmen, it's an impossible job for human eyes. Is the unfair advantage on any rule book? You are either onside or offside, I have no idea how anyone would know how to decide whether an attacker gets a fair or an unfair advantage. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
geordiesteve710 Posted September 5, 2022 Share Posted September 5, 2022 3 minutes ago, Jesse Pinkman said: I don’t think they are on the clubs books or anything. It’s more they are just cowards. They know if they give a big decision at Old Trafford or Anfield Fergie or Klopp will berate them and they may be all over the back pages the next day. They don’t want that attention. They chose the path of least resistance during 50/50 situations. The decision in our game was just pure shite though. There's definitely something to this. It's why the Leeds manager was sent off on Saturday but Klopp was allowed to strop to his heart's content on Wednesday. Marriner knew it wasn't worth the bother it would bring if he sent him to the stands. For this reason as well I'm not in favour of ref facing the media after games which is often suggested. In the post-game presser on Wednesday Howe was asked questions like "are your team time-wasting cheats?" Whereas the interview with Klopp pretty much went along the lines of "Jurgen, is there anything that you would like to bring to the viewers' attention" and he got a platform to play his victim card. I wouldn't trust this country's journalists to ask fair, impartial questions of referees. I do like the idea a few pages back of the ref releasing a public written statement to explain why and how any controversial decision has been reached. If the affected club then want to complain further then they will be able to clearly explain their grounds for doing so. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Jinx Posted September 5, 2022 Share Posted September 5, 2022 VAR should be run by a totally independent organisation that’s not linked to existing league referees. The issue is that they all have relationships, they look out for each other and although some are better than others, there’s often good ones covering for the terrible ones. We’re particularly sensitive about this because over just this season and last there have been a number of blatantly wrong decisions that either got looked at or were never deemed an issue to look at. Remember Fraser being taken out of it against City? Its not an issue with the technology, it’s those using it and they have shown not to be up to the job. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cronky Posted September 5, 2022 Share Posted September 5, 2022 I think they need to re-inforce the concept that VAR is only there to correct a 'clear and obvious' error on the part of the referee. Unless Lee Mason for some reason didn't see the push on Willock, then I can't see why he should say that it's a 'clear and obvious' error to award the goal. What's happening I suspect is there's so much pressure now, that the off the field adjudicator can take the easy way out and ask the ref to take another look. The ref is then under pressure to change his mind from the start because he thinks he must have missed something. Everyone plays safe and the original purpose of VAR gets lost. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted September 5, 2022 Share Posted September 5, 2022 2 hours ago, geordiesteve710 said: Even if that ref on Saturday was looking at the replay thinking "this is bollocks, I made the right decision" it would have been at the back of his mind that no referee in the PL had ever previously gone to the monitor and not overturned the original decision. That's got to add an additional level of pressure not wanting to be the first to do so and potentially undermining a senior colleague. Especially if it turns out you're wrong. Now that taboo has been broken I reckon we'll see more refs stand by the initial call. PL refs have gone to the monitor before and stuck by their decision. Graham Scott infamously did it in a Spurs-Brighton game when there was a ridiculous foul involving Hojbjerg, he went to the monitor and decided there had been no foul when it was an absolutely blatant clattering. https://youtu.be/m2wRhgYQAxM?t=74 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LFEE Posted September 5, 2022 Share Posted September 5, 2022 2 hours ago, Happinesstan said: I say you draw the line at the part of the body that makes initial contact. Just draw 2 sets of lines each for attacker and defender and if there is any overlap then it’s onside. Gives advantage if any to the forward. Very simple. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HaydnNUFC Posted September 5, 2022 Share Posted September 5, 2022 11 minutes ago, Wullie said: PL refs have gone to the monitor before and stuck by their decision. Graham Scott infamously did it in a Spurs-Brighton game when there was a ridiculous foul involving Hojbjerg, he went to the monitor and decided there had been no foul when it was an absolutely blatant clattering. https://youtu.be/m2wRhgYQAxM?t=74 That's mental, whew. Says a lot about COVID era football that I never knew that. Would love to know though how many refs have stuck by their decision after going to the screen from the start of last season though. Michael Oliver the only ref that's done it? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
geordiesteve710 Posted September 6, 2022 Share Posted September 6, 2022 9 hours ago, Wullie said: PL refs have gone to the monitor before and stuck by their decision. Graham Scott infamously did it in a Spurs-Brighton game when there was a ridiculous foul involving Hojbjerg, he went to the monitor and decided there had been no foul when it was an absolutely blatant clattering. https://youtu.be/m2wRhgYQAxM?t=74 Wasn't aware of that one. Fair enough, happy to stand corrected. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HWTL Posted September 6, 2022 Share Posted September 6, 2022 Cant understand why they only seem to be shown from the angle which proves whoever is doing var is right. They should be shown all the angles they have then shown in real time before making a decision and not just 1 angle 5 times. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted September 6, 2022 Share Posted September 6, 2022 11 hours ago, LFEE said: Just draw 2 sets of lines each for attacker and defender and if there is any overlap then it’s onside. Gives advantage if any to the forward. Very simple. I did hear that argument from someone on TV over the weekend, and it does seem like a very simple and logical solution. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happinesstan Posted September 6, 2022 Share Posted September 6, 2022 1 hour ago, HWTL said: Cant understand why they only seem to be shown from the angle which proves whoever is doing var is right. They should be shown all the angles they have then shown in real time before making a decision and not just 1 angle 5 times. Lee Mason pretending he's Jim Garrison. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Icarus Posted September 6, 2022 Share Posted September 6, 2022 2 hours ago, geordiesteve710 said: Wasn't aware of that one. Fair enough, happy to stand corrected. Your point is still totally relevant though. It's rare that refs stick with their decision and it's likely to have played a part in the ref's decision considering his inexperience. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slim Posted September 7, 2022 Share Posted September 7, 2022 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Prophet Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 https://theathletic.com/3586000/2022/09/12/juventus-milik-var-serie-a?source=user-shared-article Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pokerprince2004 Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 By god there has been some god awful VAR decisions these last 2 weeks but that Juventus disallowed goal in the last minute of injury time trumps everything. Probably the most disgraceful decision I've seen from VAR. Firstly the 'offside' player never touched the ball and was no way blocking the vision of the goalkeeper. Infact he was getting his shirt pulled terribly by a Salernitana defender. Secondly he wasnt even offside in the first place as the VAR officials FORGOT there was a defender near the corner flag. Instead they zoomed in on the goalmouth action so he was out of shot. Outrageous. Video of events for anyone who hasn't seen it: And the 'Offside' decision that disallowed the goal: Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leffe186 Posted September 19, 2022 Share Posted September 19, 2022 Just popping in to say that without VAR Son’s hat-trick goal would have been wrongly disallowed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thomas Posted September 19, 2022 Share Posted September 19, 2022 52 minutes ago, leffe186 said: Just popping in to say that without VAR Son’s hat-trick goal would have been wrongly disallowed. cool Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leffe186 Posted September 19, 2022 Share Posted September 19, 2022 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanshithispantz Posted October 16, 2022 Share Posted October 16, 2022 Another rule they’ve just made up. Having a covering defender now apparently means you can foul players. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joey Linton Posted October 28, 2022 Share Posted October 28, 2022 No touchline ban for Klopp, just a pissy fine. Still I'm sure if they've asked really nicely he'll start giving the officials the respect they demand rather than acting like an overly aggressive bully. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Posted October 29, 2022 Share Posted October 29, 2022 Dogsy is back reffing in the Prem this weekend. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Posted October 29, 2022 Share Posted October 29, 2022 On 19/09/2022 at 14:49, thomas said: cool This guy had a Small Wonder gif in his holster. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
et tu brute Posted October 29, 2022 Share Posted October 29, 2022 19 hours ago, Joey Linton said: No touchline ban for Klopp, just a pissy fine. Still I'm sure if they've asked really nicely he'll start giving the officials the respect they demand rather than acting like an overly aggressive bully. Every manager in the league sent off can now point to Klopp and say you can't ban me as you have set a precedence. If one manager deserved a touch line ban it's that cunt. He could already have been sent off three or four times this season. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbers Posted November 12, 2022 Share Posted November 12, 2022 Pretty good example of a terrible ref tonight, prick. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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